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jcremin

join:2009-12-22
Siren, WI
kudos:2

1 recommendation

reply to TBBroadband

Re: [Bus. Ops] Tower Space

Here's the deal, and please listen. This is me being 100% honest with you about some serious issues you are facing here.

First: You are saying you will be offering WiMax, 4G, and 100meg, but the equipment you claim you will be using are none of those. If you advertise something you simply can't deliver and say you are using technologies you simply aren't, it not only will give your business a bad name, but it also gives every other WISP across the country (and beyond) a bad name. I deal with potential customers at trade shows who refuse to sign up for my service because they used another WISP where they used to live, and the service was horrible. They won't even give me a shot anymore because they assume my service will be just as bad. Not only are you hurting yourself, you're hurting the very people who you have come on this forum and asked for FREE help from.

Second: You are thinking way to big for your knowledge level. You're talking about caching appliances when you have virtually no need to think about it for years (if ever). You are talking about 100-megabit speeds - do you have anyway to backhaul and deliver those speeds? That's an entirely different ballgame from using cheap unlicensed equipment. Third, you're giving off the impression that you're a huge company, when you clearly aren't. There's a difference between being professional, and being something you're not. If you're going to be big, be big (it won't be cheap, and you shouldn't expect to cheat people out of fair tower rent, etc). If you are small, be small. You can still give off a professional image without the impression you are a mega-corporation. Plus you can usually barter things like cheap rent if people know you're not making millions of dollars.

Last (and most important): You're coming onto a forum filled with professionals who run their own WISP's, tirelessly, day in and day out, usually for much less pay than they could get working a desk job, and are typically left with little to no life outside their job. Yet they volunteer their time to come on here and give out free advice to help others out who are trying to get started, or who are running into issues with their own WISP. If you see overwhelming backlash against what someone is trying to do (like yourself) there's usually a good reason for it. Like I already mentioned, if you over promise and under deliver, you're not only shooting yourself in the foot, but also hurting every other business you are representing. In addition, you turned on those who are trying to prevent yourself and your potential customers from making a big mistake. You will quickly run out of resources that will provide the kind of free, professional support that you desire if you bite the hands that feed you.

I'm not trying to tell you to "go away". On the contrary. I'm begging you to reconsider your business plan and offer a service that will reflect professionally on yourself and every other WISP. And above all, take the criticisms for what they are: Good advice. If you change your attitude, I'm sure your reputation in this forum can still be salvaged. If you don't, well, I can't imagine anyone will be willing to help you much longer.

Sincerely,
Joe


TBBroadband

join:2012-10-26
Fremont, OH
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·MegaPath

If 3.65 isn't WiMax then why is it listed as such: »www.google.com/search?q=wimax+3.65ghz ??? So according to equipment manufacturers, yes it would be WiMax. It's unlicensed WiMax at that. It's something that many WiSPs are now using, especially in the Midwest region to overcome the 2.4 and 5.8 issues with how crowded they have become.

2nd- I have been around before, and actually had another account on here until I changed names and deleted the former account. I've built an WiSP before but it was on 2.4 using YDI (was back in early 2002/3 around the time of the East Coast Blackout). I only exited the business/industry at that time due to becoming ill.

3rd- How am I giving off the impression I'm a mega-corp/use? Because of the plans that I have? Well as the saying goes- Go big/plan big or go home. To me there is no reason on why I can't have a plan and put it out to the public. And I'm not hiding how big I am. No where do I state that I'm a mega corp or anything. I even mention on the website that the number listed is a Google Voice number, no massive company is going to use a GV number. My backhaul is being planned currently and I'm working with several network engineers along with obtaining other frequencies for the backhaul. I also have a 1gig connection to the Internet. I'm also not trying nor plan on trying to cheat people out of tower rent, so I'm not sure how you managed to obtain that information, it was never implied nor mentioned. I simply asked a question especially since I posted before I was a very small company. Which you can find that on the post I made about caching.

Lastly- I know that you guys are on here to help, as I've said, I've been on here for more than 7 years and used another name. I was even on this site and on this section when Kory from VA was on here building out his hotspot network using Sputnik.

If I came across the wrong way I apologize, but as I have said, I have done my research before, and have been again. I've also been following what's going on and what I can and can not do.

Kyle


LLigetfa

join:2006-05-15
Fort Frances, ON
kudos:1

said by TBBroadband:

If 3.65 isn't WiMax then why is it listed as such...

Huh? Just cuz WiMax often uses 3.65GHz, does not make all 3.65GHz products WiMax. WiMax is a technology, not a frequency and Ubiquiti does not make WiMax.
said by TBBroadband:

...It's unlicensed WiMax at that.

Huh? Unlicensed in what way? Are you saying Ubiquiti is stealing the technology and not licensing it?
--
Strange as it seems, no amount of learning can cure stupidity, and formal education positively fortifies it. -- Stephen Vizinczey

wirelessdog

join:2008-07-15
Queen Anne, MD
kudos:1
reply to TBBroadband

Wow unlicensed and 3.65 in the same sentence.

Time to go back to school kiddo


TBBroadband

join:2012-10-26
Fremont, OH
reply to LLigetfa

did not say that. I said it's unlicensed as far as not the same as a 2.5 network that Clear uses. And are you implying I said something I didn't?


TBBroadband

join:2012-10-26
Fremont, OH
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·MegaPath
reply to wirelessdog

3.65 is basically unlicensed. $210 will net you a "license" to use 3.65 but it's not totally a licensed product. And according to the FCC and their documents, mobile base stations are fully 100% unlicensed and do not have to be filed with them. Only fixed base stations. So one could say its a semi-licensed product.

But I'm not arguing being licensed or not. I simply asked a question and showed proof on how I got that 3.65 was Wimax- and WiMax is considered a 4g product.


LLigetfa

join:2006-05-15
Fort Frances, ON
kudos:1

said by TBBroadband:

I simply asked a question and showed proof on how I got that 3.65 was Wimax...

You have proven nothing. All you prove is how you may have been misled to thinking it was so.
--
Strange as it seems, no amount of learning can cure stupidity, and formal education positively fortifies it. -- Stephen Vizinczey
Expand your moderator at work


Jerm

join:2000-04-10
Richland, WA
kudos:2

1 edit
reply to TBBroadband

Re: [Bus. Ops] Tower Space

First off TBus sorry for the attacks on here. This forum can come off as unwelcoming as they have seen their fair share of failures and "up to 54mbps" WISPs in the past with clueless people at the helm.

Well this doesn't excuse their behavior, these guys *do* know their stuff and you get some of the best doublecheck advice that way...

Back OT:
Plenty of guys on here have sweet tower deals where they just exchange service for rent. Really it just depends. I remember a recent thread of one guy getting pretty much a new bandwidth source paid for by a client with a tower and made out like a bandit.

I guess the real moral of the story here is YMMV. It can work, just be aware of the pitfalls: If they decide to use someone else for bandwidth, are you just going to lose the tower? What then? ETC...

Expand your moderator at work

jcremin

join:2009-12-22
Siren, WI
kudos:2
reply to TBBroadband

Re: [Bus. Ops] Tower Space

said by TBBroadband:

If 3.65 isn't WiMax then why is it listed as such

As was already stated, WiMax is a specific technology, and can be used on many different frequencies. The most common is 3.65 Ghz, but Clear runs it on 2.5 Ghz and a telcom near me ran a WiMax network on 700 Mhz. The equipment UBNT sells is simply 5 Ghz 802.11a/n converted to a 3.65 Ghz frequency, which doesn't make it WiMax. It's the equivalent of taking two wheels off of your car and saying you have a motorcycle.

In addition to not being WiMax or 4G, UBNT's marketing is also deceptive and is presented in a "better than best case" scenario. You'll never be able to sustain 100mbps in a PTMP setup using their equipment. If you sell your service as such, and are under the impression that it will deliver what you are advertising, you'll probably be extremely disappointed when you start setting up customers and find that it falls way short.

said by TBBroadband:

3rd- How am I giving off the impression I'm a mega-corp/use? I simply asked a question especially since I posted before I was a very small company. Which you can find that on the post I made about caching.

Just saying that some of the wording on your site makes you sound much bigger than you explained in your topic about caching. And your ideas about the caching, while valid ideas, are WAY above and beyond your current size that it sounded like you were dreaming way too big. Didn't mean anything negative by it.

said by TBBroadband:

Lastly- I know that you guys are on here to help, as I've said, I've been on here for more than 7 years and used another name.

Again, my reply wasn't meant to attack you. It was simply me trying to offer my suggestions based on some incorrect assumptions.

said by TBBroadband:

If I came across the wrong way I apologize, but as I have said, I have done my research before, and have been again. I've also been following what's going on and what I can and can not do.

Sorry if I'm giving the impression I'm saying you have no experience. All I can base my assumptions off of are your two recent topics here. While you may have some knowledge from your prior experience, the big issue right now is the 3.65ghz/WiMax confusion. Once we get past that, I think it will be much easier to make more progress.


WHT

join:2010-03-26
Rosston, TX
kudos:5
reply to TBBroadband

said by TBBroadband:

If 3.65 isn't WiMax then why is it listed as such: »www.google.com/search?q=wimax+3.65ghz ??? So according to equipment manufacturers, yes it would be WiMax.

Ummm...No. WiMax is a proprietary **technology**. It is not necessarily specific to any particular band. Just because a product is 3.65 GHz or "4G" does not automatically qualify it as WiMax.

mj3431

join:2003-04-21
STL, MO
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to TBBroadband

said by TBBroadband:

I'm using UNBT. And other vendors as well.

TBS will offer a wide range of speeds for both residential and business users. Speeds will start at 25Mbps and go up from there. Below is a sampling of our expected speeds.

25Mpbs download by 2.5Mbps upload
40Mbps download by 3.5Mbps upload
90Mbps download by 4.5Mbps upload
150Mbps download by 10Mbps upload

Took this from your website. Although not a WISP, I do use a good deal of UBNT PTP equipment. Good luck offering those speeds!

TBBroadband

join:2012-10-26
Fremont, OH
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·MegaPath

did you happen to miss the word "expected". Does not say will be offered or anything of that sort. And you also missed the part of other vendors as well.

I think I'm done discussing this though on this board. My main question was never really answered, instead it seems like nothing is provided but bashing and re-working words into things that never even were put in print, nor said anywhere.

A few of you I may PM but other than that. Thanks

Expand your moderator at work