Topic 'Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women' in forum 'Security' - dslreports.com

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Fri, 30 Nov 2012 14:34:28 EDT

Blogger posted : I'm fairly consistent across the board on things of the type in Saudi Arabia. (Who by the way is our business partner, not our friend like a Canada or UK.)

1. I think that the condition described is wrong.

2. SA is a sovereign nation and up to a point they can do what they want internally.

3. I never want to see our military going overseas to fight and die so Ms. Faisal can have the right to vote, drive a car, not have to cover their bodies from head to toe or not carry electronic tracking devices.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:02:32 EDT

DrStrange posted : Absolutely. Except that they really are the same.

If you look at it from an outsider's point of view, they're two different sects of the same religion.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:10:00 EDT

carpetshark3 posted :

said by dave:

said by StuartMW:

The US is doing its best to become Western Europe.

It was my impression that the US is trying hard to become a theocracy, in particular with respect to the canonical 'old white guys' telling women what they can and can't do with their bodies.

(I feel free to use the pejorative term 'old white guys' because I are one.)

Really, this "my country is more free than yours" pissing match is pretty silly, don't you think? And it trivializes the actual topic.

Thank you. I fail to see some of the differences between Sharia law and what these people call Christianity except the name of the god.
Both are extremely repressive.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Fri, 30 Nov 2012 06:40:09 EDT

Laura_cyber posted : Hi,
I want to correct you, "Women are treated as animal or thing in most of the countries (it is not about religion)".
You can took example from news of last few months, what happened to Malaba and and Indian women (didn't know the name) who lost her life in IRELAND(a christian country) during her pregnancy because the physicians refuse to abort the child, arguing that it is against the Christianity. This is very disappointing that, they refuse the importance of mother's life over the foeticide.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Thu, 29 Nov 2012 21:19:55 EDT

Anubis Prime posted : The world is "addicted" to oil because there is NOTHING that is as readily available to provide the power needed by the world. Most of us would like to live in an imaginary future where Mr. Fusion is on the backs of our Deloreans but it isn't the case.

We need to continue to research alternative fuels and explore OUR OWN natural resources, and stop buying oil from people that want to kill us. I, for one, do not want to go back to the stone age while this happens.

So keep it flowing for now!
--
Give me Liberty, or I'll give you death!

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Wed, 28 Nov 2012 02:16:29 EDT

ashrc4 posted :

said by DownTheShore:

said by EUS:

said by harald:

Not that I disagree with earlier posts, but you should know that if you live in Latin America as an ex-pat, and your wife attempts to travel to the US with the kids to visit the grandparents, she's going to need your written permission.

? When my wife or I travel alone with our children, and we want to enter into the US from Canada with our children, we require a letter of permission from the other parent to do so. Been this way for a looooong time.
Still a far cry from being an e-tagged system for one sex only.

I think this might have more to do with the problem of estranged/divorced parents "kidnapping" their children in custody disputes and taking them out of the country. It probably legally absolves the governments of the countries involved from complicity, in any potential lawsuits that may result.

For me it's a lot more simple, some religions don't perceive women as equal....period.
And the followers with the vote/power want to be perceived as respectful of religious doctrine .... For the uneducated this is O.K. No concept of yin and yang here.
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Paradigm Shift beta test pilot. "Dying to defend one's small piece of suburb...Give me something global...STAT!

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 12:30:05 EDT

goalieskates posted :

said by dave:

Really, this "my country is more free than yours" pissing match is pretty silly, don't you think?

Agree.

And while various countries bought slaves, let's remember Africans were the ones selling other Africans into slavery.

Plenty of blame to go around, but I don't subscribe to feeling guilt for something you personally didn't do. For most countries it happened years ago to people long dead. For the women of Saudi Arabia, however, it's happening now - that's the difference.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 12:02:05 EDT

DownTheShore posted :

said by EUS:

said by harald:

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 11:47:32 EDT

dave posted :

said by StuartMW:

The US is doing its best to become Western Europe.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 11:00:55 EDT

StuartMW posted : To add to that many of the US Founding Fathers knew very well of the contradiction between slavery and the Declaration Of Independence and The Constitution but had to acquiesce on that point in order to get the southern states to join the union. That contradiction was resolved with the Civil War.

There are still countries (e.g. in Africa) that practice slavery in some form or another. It may not be as organized as it was 150 years ago but it still exits. In fact one could make a good case that Saudi Arabia's treatment of women is a form of slavery.
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow!

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 10:40:49 EDT

Blackbird posted :

said by EdmundGerber:

... F**king yanks - remember slavery? Jesus H Ch**st....

No nation in the Western world has clean hands regarding slavery, not the US, not the UK, not the French, and not Canada. While Britain ended her own importation of African slaves in 1807, the US in 1808, Britain was more than willing to profit handsomely off the slave trade into other lands and especially her colonies and islands in the Caribbean until 1833. The holding of slaves (including the tactic of redefining them as 'indentured servants') was still ultimately permitted within the empire until 1838 (including Canada - read the writings of Afua Cooper for insight into that chapter of Canadian history). In the US, the Northern states abolished slavery between 1780 and 1800. The Southern states, whose economies were more directly affected, did not accept abolition of slavery until the Civil War ended it in 1865.

The more southern the latitude under the British empire (and elsewhere), the longer slavery tended to persist and be more firmly held onto, largely because it was so foundational to the plantation economies upon which the more southern-located colonies were built and which demanded cheap (or free) labor for their profit. One could argue that Canada's northern latitude had as much or more to do with her willingness to turn against slavery as any inherent enlightened nature of her citizens. Ditto for the US Northern states.

None of our nations are without guilt in the reprehensible practice of slavery... so let's not throw stones.
--
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 09:21:09 EDT

StuartMW posted :

said by EdmundGerber:

We have more freedoms here in Canada, for fucks sake. And the UK and Scandinavian countries are above you as well. Actually - most of Europe.

Well not to worry. The US is doing its best to become Western Europe. It has turned its back on its founding (what I explicitly referred to) principles.
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow!

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 09:05:09 EDT

EdmundGerber posted :

said by StuartMW:

The US was founded on the idea of individual rights regardless of race, gender etc. It was the first, and so far, the only country in history to do so and look at the results.

What fucking arrogance. We have more freedoms here in Canada, for fucks sake. And the UK and Scandinavian countries are above you as well. Actually - most of Europe.

Fucking yanks - remember slavery? Jesus H Christ....

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Tue, 27 Nov 2012 05:44:26 EDT

Link Logger posted :

said by dave:

said by Link Logger:

well then your position in the world is likely to remain in the lower half of productivity, progressiveness, innovation, business, etc countries in the world.

Except that they have oil and thus money.

They only have money because someone buys their oil and because of the world's addiction to oil, they have lots of money (ie the world's addiction to oil is stronger then its dislike for what they do). Addictions are rarely good as they typically remove your ability to make a choice.

Blake
--
Vendor: Author of Link Logger which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 12:05:13 EDT

EUS posted :

said by harald:

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 11:09:22 EDT

dave posted : I think that the government not calling out the saudi regime on human rights violations is more to do with oil and diplomacy than with some imaginary "political correctness".

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 11:02:14 EDT

harald posted : Not that I disagree with earlier posts, but you should know that if you live in Latin America as an ex-pat, and your wife attempts to travel to the US with the kids to visit the grandparents, she's going to need your written permission.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 10:26:25 EDT

dave posted :

said by Link Logger:

well then your position in the world is likely to remain in the lower half of productivity, progressiveness, innovation, business, etc countries in the world.

Except that they have oil and thus money.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 10:07:57 EDT

Link Logger posted :

said by Crowbar1:

This is one of the reasons most people don't want them here , their values and beliefs are incompatible with ours . Now they want to control women like micro chipped animals ... :mad:

I don't really care what they do in their country, that's their deal, and if you basically take 50% (or in most cases more then 50%) of your population out of the game, well then your position in the world is likely to remain in the lower half of productivity, progressiveness, innovation, business, etc countries in the world.

Now of course if they move to or visit a country with different laws/rights/etc then I expect them to be subject to those laws/rights/etc, otherwise they simply shouldn't go there.

I don't go to some countries in the middle east because my relationship and such with my wife would be in conflict with their laws, so we don't.

Blake
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Vendor: Author of Link Logger which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 10:00:02 EDT

StuartMW posted :

said by dave:

...I can assure you that people who think my way tend not to shy from calling a repressive totalitarian theocratic monarchy by name.

The US gummint won't. Neither will many others.

The whole point of Political Correctness (PC) is to limit speech. Can't have people calling things what they are. It's analogous to NewSpeak in Orwell's 1984 and has had the same result.
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow!

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 09:55:30 EDT

dave posted :

said by StuartMW:

However in today's PC dominated world we're supposed to consider their culture just as good and valid as our ours. I don't and won't.

That's your knee-jerk reflex showing. I likely have the sort of viewpoint that you'd call "PC", and I can assure you that people who think my way tend not to shy from calling a repressive totalitarian theocratic monarchy by name.

Us liberals are the ones that tend to take The Handmaid's Tale as a serious warning, after all.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 09:43:14 EDT

goalieskates posted : Which clearly demonstrates why we don't want Sharia law here.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Mon, 26 Nov 2012 08:53:16 EDT

DrStrange posted : This is Wahabbist Islam in action. The US and others keep these radicals in power by buying their oil. The minute we get off oil [or start producing enough to supply ourselves; we're producing a lot more oil than we were a few years ago and with reduced demand we're on track to be oil-independent around 2020], we should cut them off and encourage moderates [anybody except al-Qa'ida is more moderate, including most Islamist elements] in the country to depose the house of Saud.

Normally, I don't condone meddling in another country's affairs, but since we put them in power in the first place I suppose it's only right that we take them out and prevent even more extreme elements [remember where bin Laden came from?] from coming to power.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 23:27:17 EDT

La Luna posted : There is no security or privacy for women who live with Arab men, only fear and oppression.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 22:18:30 EDT

OZO posted :

said by DownTheShore:

Women are second class citizens in most religions, not just Islam.

And I was talking about religions in general, not about Islam only...
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 22:00:09 EDT

Crowbar1 posted : This is one of the reasons most people don't want them here , their values and beliefs are incompatible with ours . Now they want to control women like micro chipped animals ... :mad:

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 21:27:20 EDT

DownTheShore posted : More likely from the continued precedence and protection of patriarchal and misogynistic attitudes of their culture.

Women are second class citizens in most religions, not just Islam.

[att=1]

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 21:17:09 EDT

OZO posted : That comes from their radical religion... Drop that and there would be nothing like that left or course.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 17:02:19 EDT

Kearnstd posted :

said by StuartMW:

The US was founded on the idea of individual rights regardless of race, gender etc. It was the first, and so far, the only country in history to do so and look at the results. The Arab countries, along with many others, have been a mixture of tribal and collectivist societies and look where they are. If Saudi Arabia didn't have oil (and they nationalized those oil wells) they'd still be riding camels in the desert.

However in today's PC dominated world we're supposed to consider their culture just as good and valid as our ours. I don't and won't.

I think they where pretty horrified to see women driving HUMVEEs during the first golf war. as well as flying aircraft like the A-10 Warthog. I mean that must have had their men hiding in the closet for days at the mere thought of a female flying an aircraft that could level a city block and still not be out of ammo!
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Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 16:16:58 EDT

dandelion posted : I'm sure a lot of this can be under the auspices of "we are protecting you". Beware any "protection" that can invade privacy and be a simple excuse for domination.

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 16:01:41 EDT

StuartMW posted : The US was founded on the idea of individual rights regardless of race, gender etc. It was the first, and so far, the only country in history to do so and look at the results. The Arab countries, along with many others, have been a mixture of tribal and collectivist societies and look where they are. If Saudi Arabia didn't have oil (and they nationalized those oil wells) they'd still be riding camels in the desert.

However in today's PC dominated world we're supposed to consider their culture just as good and valid as our ours. I don't and won't.
--
Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow!

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 15:35:19 EDT

jaykaykay posted : In that country and others in the Middle East, women are less than nothing. They are treated as baby machines, cooks, and all kinds of things to wait on men, but like people/individuals? No! That is exactly the kind of thing that the radicals of those countries would like to put upon free countries such as the US. I don't find this unusual for them at all, sad to say. (end of rant)

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 14:59:16 EDT

siljaline posted : Nasty stuff, antdude
Squirted this out on Twitter the other day:
»venturebeat.com/2012/11/22/saudi···by-text/
Edit:
Also at RawStory:
»www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/11/22/s···r-women/

Re: Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 14:32:00 EDT

Dustyn posted : Wow. That is some kind of crazy. And although I'll admit I do not understand that way of life, I don't think I'd want to either.

Saudi Arabia Implements Electronic Tracking System for Women

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 14:28:09 EDT

antdude posted : »www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/no···ts-women from »www.hardocp.com/news/2012/11/24/···r_women/

"Saudi Arabia criticised over text alerts tracking women's movements

Male 'guardians' receive text message whenever women leave country under new system..."
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