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XXXXXXXXXXX1
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join:2006-01-11
Beverly Hills, CA

XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

[CATV] CATV reboots/freezing issues

I posted this in Charter Direct, and I've posted a slightly modified version hoping someone can give some insight into what is happening with my Charter CATV. Thanks for any insights. Here's the post:

Good afternoon! My name is Jim and I'm hoping you can shed some light on a weird CATV issue.

Just to give you my setup (which was installed by Charter), the main drop off the pole is RG-11 in underground conduit to the Charter box on my house, then coupled to RG-6 and runs into my home's utility room. It is then split by an Antronix splitter (CMC3003V) with the -3.5db leg servicing the CATV. Signal leaves the splitter and enters an 8-output amp (Extreme Broadband IPA1008D-RSVF, supplied by Charter) and then leaves via RG-6 to service the various television outlets and cable boxes in my home, each outlet having its own home run back to the amp in the utility room. Cable is high quality, shielded properly and adequately, and has the high quality quad shielded coax fittings that have been looked over by Charter techs in the past. I currently have 3 cable boxes: a Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC, a CISCO Explorer 8640HDC, and a Scientific Atlanta Explorer 3200.

Here's the issue(s):
Most of the time, all three cable boxes seem to work well, but something happened today that somehow demonstrates an intermittent problem that all three have (but the 3200 seems to be most problematic).

I was trying to access Sprout programming through On-Demand on the 3200, but the Sprout programming would not load. It searched and searched, but no program. While that was happening, I went to both the other cable boxes in the house, and both were able to access the same On-Demand Sprout programming that the 3200 could not. Then, the 3200 spontaneously rebooted, and after it reset itself, I tried again to access On-Demand, and I could not.

I then unplugged the 3200, and switched it with a functioning DVR, trying to see if the outlet was the issue. Both boxes rebooted, and the 3200 refused to get On-Demand from the new outlet, and the DVR was good to go, immediately getting the programming and streaming it to the DVR. I accessed the diagnostics screen in both the SA DVR and 3200, and both showed SNR strength of 35 db, and no errors. I rebooted both again, and still no On-Demand on the 3200. Finally, the 3200 lost all channels. I could see the programming bar telling the program that should have been playing, but no TV whatsoever. Both DVRs were working fine at that moment... HSI was up and running normally... and Tel had dial tone.

I called Charter Tech support, and a helpful young lady asked a few questions and then sent a "hit" to the 3200, and magically, the box's TV programming reappeared, and On-Demand worked as normal.

My question: why is this happening? I've had techs here in the past and my signal strength and clarity has consistently been solid. This was a case where somehow one box went renegade while the others were working fine.

And I would write this off as a lone defective box, except to say that the other boxes act up occassionally as well. The SA and CISCO DVRs tend to have the screen "freeze" in place, requiring me to use the remote to change the channel up, and then back, and things are back to normal. This tends to happen on Sprout in the afternoon (1pm - 3pm typically). It's not an isolated event.. it happens once a day or every other day. The funny thing is.. I have tuned both DVRs to Sprout in the past around that time.. and one will freeze and the other will be normal as if nothing is wrong- and there is no consistent box that does it always.. sometimes it's one, and sometimes it's the other, and sometimes it's neither.

Bottom line: HSI running fine, Telephone running fine, and signal quality from the diagnostic screens on all boxes is good (even during and after an event), as has been the measurements of the techs. This seems to be a cable box issue. Why do these boxes do these random reboots/freezes, and one signal reset by a Charter tech can clear a box that unplugging and plugging cannot fix? Any thoughts? Is this just the typical service from these boxes that I need to expect going forward? Is this a video compression issue or maybe crummy box quality? Please let me know. Thanks!

XXXXXXXXXXX1

XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

Maybe a better question is: has anyone else experienced any of the freezing symptoms that I have? Does this ever happen to anyone else or is this just me?!?
XXXXXXXXXXX1

XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

Well, I'll throw this out there and see if anyone has some ideas..

I just had a tech visit my home, and he thought the problem was probably one of two things: either my 8-port amp (which was an older model and known for problems), or the amp on the pole that services my street. He swapped out the Extreme Broadband amp with the latest generation, and then used his meter to see what kind of signal measurements he was getting at the amp. Measurements at the amp were dead on the money with SNR of 34-36 and perfect signal strength on all frequencies. So pole drop, grounding block, splitter, and amp checked out fine

Coax in the house is a star formation with all home runs back to the utility room. Coax from amp to each outlet is Belden 1829A with high-quality compression fittings on all the runs. Some outlets have runs as short as 5' from amp to outlet, and some are longer, but all exhibit the same behavior (video and audio freezes requiring the channel to be changed to restore video and sound). Meter was used to test outlets, and signal strength and SNR were dead on the money for all outlets- showing SNR of 34-36, signal strength on the money, and no errors whatsoever. So coax runs to all outlets checked out fine

RG-6 with compressions fittings is then used from the outlet to the cable boxes. And the cable boxes report on their diagnostics screens no errors, SNR of 34-36, and signal levels in the sweet spot of tolerances.

With the amp switched out, I thought we had it at first, but last night a random freeze-up happened to one DVR, and this morning, a random reboot happened to the other DVR. So no luck... problem still exists.

Neighbor says he rarely sees a freeze-up, maybe once a month, and that freeze-up requires a reboot, it's not correctable by the remote. Since our symptoms are different, I would think that rules out the street amp, but truck will be rolled to take a look early next week.

Only 2 other possibilities I can think of if street amp checks out as good:

1) Flaky tap. My neighbor and I are on the same amp, but different taps. I would think this isn't the case since it's so infrequent and random, and I'm getting uptimes on my cable modem of 20-40+ days usually.

2) Charter's boxes are just problematic. I had a DVR when I first got Charter that was horrific, and had it swapped out, and this replacement is just annoying. That makes me suspect that these Scientific Atlanta/CISCO boxes are just not up to the compression that Charter's downstream video is sent at. When it gets overwhelmed... it hiccups, and a freeze-up or reboot occurs. That's my theory anyway.

Any ideas or things I haven't thought of? This is really baffling.
kherr
Premium Member
join:2000-09-04
Collinsville, IL

kherr to XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

to XXXXXXXXXXX1
I have similar glitches but not often enough to worry about. It sorta disappeared when I went Tivo, but I'll fire up the TV (mainly the one in the LR) and the Tivo will be hung up because the Video Adapter had rebooted or Charter sent an update that required the V/A to reboot. It happened at the darnnest time during a football game. I figured it's just one of those things especially with a Tivo box. It doesn't happen as much with the B/R Tivo, but this has happened with both at the same time. Hence the theory of an update to the V/A and it needing to reboot.

Cable Dog
@charter.com

Cable Dog

Anon

Your cable modem should really be run from the 3.5 leg from the first splitter. That gives the lowest loss to your modem.
XXXXXXXXXXX1
Premium Member
join:2006-01-11
Beverly Hills, CA

XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

said by Cable Dog :

Your cable modem should really be run from the 3.5 leg from the first splitter. That gives the lowest loss to your modem.

Charter has it setup with the cable modem on a -7 dB leg, and it and my MTA are the only things working properly...

I have another thread about my struggles in the HI forum.. check it out:

»CATV issue- box freezing and reboots..
XXXXXXXXXXX1

XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

Click for full size
I snapped this pic from the diagnostic screen quickly as a freeze was in progress. The signal strength of the tuner with the frozen channel plummeted to -20dBmV. A second or two after pic, signal strength returned to +7dBmV on that frequency.

Other cable boxes in the house were unaffected, and no errors were reported on that tuner during the freeze. What would cause that to happen?

DocDrew
How can I help?
Premium Member
join:2009-01-28
SoCal

DocDrew

Premium Member

What frequency is that tuner on for Sprout?
XXXXXXXXXXX1
Premium Member
join:2006-01-11
Beverly Hills, CA

XXXXXXXXXXX1

Premium Member

said by DocDrew:

What frequency is that tuner on for Sprout?

Sprout is on switch digital, so it moves around based on usage in the service group.
XXXXXXXXXXX1

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Premium Member

Just want to post a follow-up.. Problem was in the headend, and has been fixed. No more freezes!

It took some time, but we finally got there. Woo hoo!