Topic 'ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux' in forum 'Canadian Chat' - dslreports.com http://www.dslreports.com/forum/ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773186 en Wed, 19 Jun 2013 20:52:03 EDT Wed, 19 Jun 2013 20:52:03 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27778100 said by shrug :

you can ask the person about it while their alive. Ask to see if they have a copy etc.

You can ask them, but they're not legally bound to show it to you. After they pass away the executor isn't legally bound to show it to you either, but you can apply to the court to have a copy provided to you.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27778100 Sat, 01 Dec 2012 10:42:30 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27778005 said by jaberi:

DKS can every member of the family have a right to informally request to see the will, or obtain a copy of the will?...before/after death.

I have no idea, but I doubt it. Not unless the person shows it to you.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27778005 Sat, 01 Dec 2012 09:42:06 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27778003 said by true dat :

said by MaynardKrebs:

A lot of bodies probably ought to be disposed of as hazardous waste, particularly those people who died while being treated for cancer with carboplatin and other industrial strength anti-cancer agents. There's way too much pharmaceutical active ingredients leeching into the environment.

You aren't wrong.

I could ask (may take a few days) but I believe that some embalming waste is disposed of as biohazard material.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27778003 Sat, 01 Dec 2012 09:41:15 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777621 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777621 Sat, 01 Dec 2012 00:30:45 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777478 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777478 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 23:48:23 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777403 said by jaberi:

can every member of the family have a right to informally request to see the will, or obtain a copy of the will?...before/after death.

Informally? No.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777403 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 22:36:02 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777393 said by DKS:

said by Ian:

said by jaberi:

Ian, or anyone ...... how long after death is the will open to be settled?..what's the probate thing mean?

I'm no expert, but I think it's wildly dependent on the complexity of the estate and whether or not anything is contested or not.

For example, if your estate is 100% cash, quickly. If its a web of complex securities and real estate partnerships over 6 continents, years.

Again, you are sadly mistaken. Having been the executor of a simple estate, it took ten months to settle it. The most difficult part was dealing with the CRA. Two final tax returns have to be filed; the tax return for the year of death and once the Notice of Assessment has been received, the Final return has to be filed. The CRA can take months to clear a Final return (my CA says allow 5-6 months).

DKS can every member of the family have a right to informally request to see the will, or obtain a copy of the will?...before/after death.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777393 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 22:31:28 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777036 said by MaynardKrebs:

A lot of bodies probably ought to be disposed of as hazardous waste, particularly those people who died while being treated for cancer with carboplatin and other industrial strength anti-cancer agents. There's way too much pharmaceutical active ingredients leeching into the environment.

You aren't wrong.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27777036 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 20:38:38 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776548 said by Ian:

Uh huh. Trying to get another topic locked? ;-)

... and yet you continue with an air of non-culpability despite comments like that? Figures. :hmm:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776548 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 17:23:04 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776517 said by Gone:

said by Ian:

If what I said was "wrong" then fine. All I said was that depending on complexity it could be from "quickly" to years. And that still isn't wrong by anything he posted. He replied just to be argumentative...Kinda like.... Oh yeah. You. ;-)

If you hadn't been such an asshole about claiming that my knowledge was "deficient" on what is legally binding in a will when the only one with a deficiency of understanding on this topic was you, I wouldn't be so keen on rubbing it in every chance you give me. :p

Uh huh. Trying to get another topic locked? ;-)
--
“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776517 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 17:13:50 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776510 said by DKS:

said by Ian:

Jeebus, some of you guys just like to argue. OK smart guy, 10 months is "quickly" to me. Am I still "sadly mistaken"? :uhh:

You didn't give any frame of reference. If 10 months is "quickly" to you, so be it. If you feel 5-6 months to approve the final return for a simple estate is acceptable, fine.

Thus no frame of reference to describe as "sadly mistaken". I don't know what's involved for the CRA to approve a final return, thus no basis to decide if 5-6 months is "acceptable" or not. And as with absolutely EVERYTHING that the Government does, they don't tend to consult me (or you I'd wager) on setting time-frames. ;-)
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“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776510 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 17:11:20 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776441 said by Ian:

If what I said was "wrong" then fine. All I said was that depending on complexity it could be from "quickly" to years. And that still isn't wrong by anything he posted. He replied just to be argumentative...Kinda like.... Oh yeah. You. ;-)

If you hadn't been such an asshole about claiming that my knowledge was "deficient" on what is legally binding in a will when the only one with a deficiency of understanding on this topic was you, I wouldn't be so keen on rubbing it in every chance you give me. :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776441 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 16:47:52 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776391 said by Ian:

Jeebus, some of you guys just like to argue. OK smart guy, 10 months is "quickly" to me. Am I still "sadly mistaken"? :uhh:

You didn't give any frame of reference. If 10 months is "quickly" to you, so be it. If you feel 5-6 months to approve the final return for a simple estate is acceptable, fine.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776391 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 16:35:14 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776162 said by Gone:

said by Ian:

Jeebus, some of you guys just like to argue. OK smart guy, 10 months is "quickly" to me. Am I still "sadly mistaken"? :uhh:

Dude, he deals with these matters as part of his career. What do you expect, him to sit around while people who know nothing about this talk as if they do? :huh:

If what I said was "wrong" then fine. All I said was that depending on complexity it could be from "quickly" to years. And that still isn't wrong by anything he posted. He replied just to be argumentative...Kinda like.... Oh yeah. You. ;-)
--
“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776162 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:38:15 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776145 said by Ian:

Jeebus, some of you guys just like to argue. OK smart guy, 10 months is "quickly" to me. Am I still "sadly mistaken"? :uhh:

Dude, he deals with these matters as part of his career. What do you expect, him to sit around while people who know nothing about this talk as if they do? :huh:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776145 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:34:29 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776120 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27776120 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:28:48 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775967 said by DKS:

said by Ian:

said by jaberi:

Ian, or anyone ...... how long after death is the will open to be settled?..what's the probate thing mean?

I'm no expert, but I think it's wildly dependent on the complexity of the estate and whether or not anything is contested or not.

For example, if your estate is 100% cash, quickly. If its a web of complex securities and real estate partnerships over 6 continents, years.

Again, you are sadly mistaken. Having been the executor of a simple estate, it took ten months to settle it. The most difficult part was dealing with the CRA. Two final tax returns have to be filed; the tax return for the year of death and once the Notice of Assessment has been received, the Final return has to be filed. The CRA can take months to clear a Final return (my CA says allow 5-6 months).

Jeebus, some of you guys just like to argue. OK smart guy, 10 months is "quickly" to me. Am I still "sadly mistaken"? :uhh:
--
“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775967 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 14:50:31 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775751 said by hm :

said by DKS:

Cemetery costs are normally separate from the funeral. That is because in many parts of Canada, funeral homes are not allowed to own cemeteries. And not all cemeteries are unionized.

We went through this in another topic. See reference in the first post of this topic. To re-iterate what was said in that other topic, not applicable here. Maybe in Ontario...

And Quebec isn't the centre of the universe. :uhh:
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775751 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 13:58:58 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775059 said by DKS:

The industry will figure out a way to charge for that. And someone will come up with a ritual of flushing.

Blessing of the plunger ceremony, $1,000]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775059 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 11:41:43 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775157 said by DKS:

And someone will come up with a ritual of flushing.

The thought of that kind of makes me feel sick in the pit of my stomach, but hey, whatever floats one's boat I guess.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775157 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 11:23:12 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775045 said by DKS:

Cemetery costs are normally separate from the funeral. That is because in many parts of Canada, funeral homes are not allowed to own cemeteries. And not all cemeteries are unionized.

We went through this in another topic. See reference in the first post of this topic. To re-iterate what was said in that other topic, not applicable here. Maybe in Ontario...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775045 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 10:57:58 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775012 said by hm :

said by hm :

In one situation I was in everything was covered, except for (and this is the technical term they used), "The opening and closing ceremony", which cost me ~1,000$.

That is where they dig the hole and then fill it in.

Guess union work isn't covered.

OH!
I guess in regards to this topic the question must be asked!

Will there be a flushing ceremony cost?

The industry will figure out a way to charge for that. And someone will come up with a ritual of flushing.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775012 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 10:52:17 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775007 said by hm :

said by DKS:

The contract is simply a monetary deposit. Preferences are indicated, such as range of price of services, but because prices of services can change over the years, no specific services are contracted. Interest is paid on the money deposited and it accumulates with the deposit. The deposits are insured in Ontario. Such contracts can also be transferred without penalty, usually.

Yeah, prices change. But in some instances and it's all contract dependent, and prov dependent, in many situations there is a guarantee of what is covered and guaranteed not to change.

For example, costs of the viewing, cost of cremation, cost of the vessal (coffin or vase).

In one situation I was in everything was covered, except for (and this is the technical term they used), "The opening and closing ceremony", which cost me ~1,000$.

That is where they dig the hole and then fill it in.

Guess union work isn't covered.

Cemetery costs are normally separate from the funeral. That is because in many parts of Canada, funeral homes are not allowed to own cemeteries. And not all cemeteries are unionized.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27775007 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 10:51:04 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774739 said by hm :

In one situation I was in everything was covered, except for (and this is the technical term they used), "The opening and closing ceremony", which cost me ~1,000$.

That is where they dig the hole and then fill it in.

Guess union work isn't covered.

OH!
I guess in regards to this topic the question must be asked!

Will there be a flushing ceremony cost?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774739 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:47:57 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774699 said by DKS:

The contract is simply a monetary deposit. Preferences are indicated, such as range of price of services, but because prices of services can change over the years, no specific services are contracted. Interest is paid on the money deposited and it accumulates with the deposit. The deposits are insured in Ontario. Such contracts can also be transferred without penalty, usually.

Yeah, prices change. But in some instances and it's all contract dependent, and prov dependent, in many situations there is a guarantee of what is covered and guaranteed not to change.

For example, costs of the viewing, cost of cremation, cost of the vessal (coffin or vase).

In one situation I was in everything was covered, except for (and this is the technical term they used), "The opening and closing ceremony", which cost me ~1,000$.

That is where they dig the hole and then fill it in.

Guess union work isn't covered.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774699 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:42:39 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774707 said by DKS:

And so what is law in Quebec is not the law in the rest of Canada.

It is also worth pointing out that while BC allows someone to will the way they want their remains disposed of, the funeral arrangements are still up to the administrator of the estate.

Quebec is the odd one out, as they allow someone to will their funeral preferences as well as disposal. That seems very odd if you ask me, as financial means can change over the years and put a family into a position of hardship if bound by a will to the way they must perform a funeral service. Doesn't surprise me that other provinces don't make such requests binding.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774707 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:37:49 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774678 said by peterboro:

said by Gone:

said by peterboro:

I would assume that what the deceased having paid for services in advance and the funeral home in receipt of such would fulfil be the foundation of a contract in common law. You are suggesting that one party, the deceased estate, can renege on the contract?

There are legal provisions and case law specific to the issue of contracts for funeral and internment services that allow them to be broken by the executor of an estate in Ontario.

Interesting that there is statutory or regulatory relief from contractual obligations. I will need to read these in order to plan my escape from the planet, or rearrangement of carbon based particles, as the case may be.

Citation?

There is no contractual obligation in the way you are thinking. Pre-paid funeral arrangements are more like a savings account than a binding contract. The funeral home is the receipt of deposit.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774678 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:27:20 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774672 said by hm :

In Ontario is the key word. Canada is not Ontario (which may come as a shock to some here). Some fine differences in will and estates between Ontario and Quebec and other prov's.

In some prov's, like Quebec, contents of the will take precedence. And the law is setup to "respect" that.

And so what is law in Quebec is not the law in the rest of Canada.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774672 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:25:44 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774668 said by peterboro:

said by DKS:

said by Juggernaut:

The executor or executrix, has a legal obligation to follow the will (desires) of the deceased.

No, they do not. And I have seen that happen. Family member has laid out their wishes. Estate executor comes in and does a "ship and burn" and takes the ashes. Not a legal problem, as they are the estate executor. And the funeral home has to refund to the estate any funds left over from expenses.

I would assume that what the deceased having paid for services in advance and the funeral home in receipt of such would fulfil be the foundation of a contract in common law. You are suggesting that one party, the deceased estate, can renege on the contract?

The contract is simply a monetary deposit. Preferences are indicated, such as range of price of services, but because prices of services can change over the years, no specific services are contracted. Interest is paid on the money deposited and it accumulates with the deposit. The deposits are insured in Ontario. Such contracts can also be transferred without penalty, usually.
--
Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774668 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:24:56 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774640 said by peterboro:

Citation?

It was cited in the same document that Ian and I posted earlier in this discussion. They specifically singled out Ontario on that issue.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774640 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:14:48 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774623 said by Gone:

said by peterboro:

I would assume that what the deceased having paid for services in advance and the funeral home in receipt of such would fulfil be the foundation of a contract in common law. You are suggesting that one party, the deceased estate, can renege on the contract?

There are legal provisions and case law specific to the issue of contracts for funeral and internment services that allow them to be broken by the executor of an estate in Ontario.

Interesting that there is statutory or regulatory relief from contractual obligations. I will need to read these in order to plan my escape from the planet, or rearrangement of carbon based particles, as the case may be.

Citation?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774623 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:09:29 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774617 said by hm :

In Ontario is the key word. Canada is not Ontario (which may come as a shock to some here). Some fine differences in will and estates between Ontario and Quebec and other prov's.

There are only two provinces that have different laws, and those two provinces do not form the majority of the Canadian population. What Quebec does, in the context of this discussion about a company based out of Sask, is irrelevant.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774617 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:07:25 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774585 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774585 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:56:56 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774575 said by DKS:

said by hm :

said by Gone:

Funerals and interment aren't for the person who died. They're for the people left behind.

Peoples wishes (the dead people) should come first. This is only respect, no?

Nope. In Ontario, at least, it is the estate executor who makes those decisions, not the deceased, even in the case of a pre-arrangement.

In Ontario is the key word. Canada is not Ontario (which may come as a shock to some here). Some fine differences in will and estates between Ontario and Quebec and other prov's.

In some prov's, like Quebec, contents of the will take precedence. And the law is setup to "respect" that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774575 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:55:30 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774508 said by DKS:

said by Juggernaut:

The executor or executrix, has a legal obligation to follow the will (desires) of the deceased.

No, they do not. And I have seen that happen. Family member has laid out their wishes. Estate executor comes in and does a "ship and burn" and takes the ashes. Not a legal problem, as they are the estate executor. And the funeral home has to refund to the estate any funds left over from expenses.

I would assume that what the deceased having paid for services in advance and the funeral home in receipt of such would fulfil be the foundation of a contract in common law. You are suggesting that one party, the deceased estate, can renege on the contract?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774508 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:32:12 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774424 said by hm :

said by Gone:

There is no other side to see.

Nothing else need to be said.

I don't think anything else had to be said after this, really:

said by Gone:

said by hm :

Peoples wishes (the dead people) should come first. This is only respect, no?

Respect for what, exactly?

Estate matters are a matter of law, not "respect".
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774424 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 07:52:07 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774050 said by Gone:

There is no other side to see.

Nothing else need to be said.

I don't think anything else had to be said after this, really:

said by Gone:

said by hm :

Peoples wishes (the dead people) should come first. This is only respect, no?

Respect for what, exactly?

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774050 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 07:39:15 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774343 said by jaberi:

aren't executors mostly family members, how common is it for people choosing an executor outside their family?

Often a lawyer is executor. It's not uncommon.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774343 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 07:05:43 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774342 said by Gone:

said by peterboro:

Sounds like you come from some sort of dysfunctional family otherwise you would see both sides of this issue.

There is no other side to see. If you see fit to dictate what music is played, what passages are read and what the guest list reads to your own funeral, you are doing nothing more than attempting to extend your own narcissism and control issues beyond the grave.

A funeral may be about you, but it's not for you. It's one thing to ensure that expenses are paid as the idea of burdening my family with having to pay for a funeral should something happen to me is wholly unappealing, but beyond that how my family decides to celebrate my life after I'm gone is their choice, not mine. I won't be there to care, and you won't be there to care about what goes on at yours, either.

While that is a bit harsh, it is factually correct. Having met with hundreds of families over the years to plan a funeral, they may have a list of Mom's last wishes in hand, but they may, and usually do overlay their own tastes. I remember on family who simply refused mom's music choices, preferring much more upbeat music than she had chosen. The hardest ones are folks who say "no funeral" but the family wants to gather to grieve. Part of my work is to help them do exactly that.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774342 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 07:03:51 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774338 said by Ian:

said by jaberi:

Ian, or anyone ...... how long after death is the will open to be settled?..what's the probate thing mean?

I'm no expert, but I think it's wildly dependent on the complexity of the estate and whether or not anything is contested or not.

For example, if your estate is 100% cash, quickly. If its a web of complex securities and real estate partnerships over 6 continents, years.

Again, you are sadly mistaken. Having been the executor of a simple estate, it took ten months to settle it. The most difficult part was dealing with the CRA. Two final tax returns have to be filed; the tax return for the year of death and once the Notice of Assessment has been received, the Final return has to be filed. The CRA can take months to clear a Final return (my CA says allow 5-6 months).
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774338 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 06:57:09 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774333 said by Juggernaut:

The executor or executrix, has a legal obligation to follow the will (desires) of the deceased.

No, they do not. And I have seen that happen. Family member has laid out their wishes. Estate executor comes in and does a "ship and burn" and takes the ashes. Not a legal problem, as they are the estate executor. And the funeral home has to refund to the estate any funds left over from expenses.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774333 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 06:52:39 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774331 said by hm :

said by Gone:

Funerals and interment aren't for the person who died. They're for the people left behind.

Peoples wishes (the dead people) should come first. This is only respect, no?

Nope. In Ontario, at least, it is the estate executor who makes those decisions, not the deceased, even in the case of a pre-arrangement.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774331 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 06:49:24 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774213
ok so the body is not at the interment but the spirit lives on or so they say, i'm always afraid that spirit haunting me down if i don't respect the persons wishes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774213 Fri, 30 Nov 2012 02:22:22 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774005 said by peterboro:

Sounds like you come from some sort of dysfunctional family otherwise you would see both sides of this issue.

There is no other side to see. If you see fit to dictate what music is played, what passages are read and what the guest list reads to your own funeral, you are doing nothing more than attempting to extend your own narcissism and control issues beyond the grave.

A funeral may be about you, but it's not for you. It's one thing to ensure that expenses are paid as the idea of burdening my family with having to pay for a funeral should something happen to me is wholly unappealing, but beyond that how my family decides to celebrate my life after I'm gone is their choice, not mine. I won't be there to care, and you won't be there to care about what goes on at yours, either.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27774005 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 23:51:04 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773973 said by Gone:

said by Ian:

But I think in what way a person wants their body disposed of ought to be up to them to decide

People who want to dictate their own funeral and burial/cremation/whatever plans are selfish on a level to which I simply cannot comprehend.

Funerals and interment aren't for the person who died. They're for the people left behind.

Sounds like you come from some sort of dysfunctional family otherwise you would see both sides of this issue.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773973 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 23:32:04 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773806 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773806 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 23:29:31 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773957 said by jaberi:

aren't executors mostly family members, how common is it for people choosing an executor outside their family?

Most people pick a family member, but it's not required. You can also have more than one. You can also name alternates, as anyone who is named executor has the right to refuse.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773957 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 23:22:38 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773945 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773945 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 23:16:01 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773891
And, as I said earlier, the vast majority of people appoint a family member as an executor, to which I had the right general idea. For example, my aunt is my Grandfather's executor, I am my mother's (to which, I hope I don't find myself in that position for another 40 years). For you to say that anyone is legally bound to adhere to one's final wishes with regards to funerals or internment wasn't even remotely close to being correct. But as I said, it if makes you feel better to grasp at straws to try and make someone else go down with you, so be it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773891 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 22:53:46 EDT Re: ok a strange topic: Dissolving Grandma. Part Deux http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773883 said by Gone:

Nice try, though.

The fact remains, you (and not your family) exercise a form of (imperfect) control. I admitted I was wrong on this. You were also wrong. Nice try though.
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“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-ok-a-strange-topic-Dissolving-Grandma-Part-Deux-27773883 Thu, 29 Nov 2012 22:50:27 EDT