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SipSizzurp
Fo' Shizzle
Premium
join:2005-12-28
Houston, TX
kudos:4
reply to Mele20

Re: [WIN8] Biggest gripe about Win 8...

You can download and install it in less than two minutes. Another 30 seconds to decide which of the 3 classic start menus you want. 45 more seconds to select the things you want on the start menu, or just leave at defaults for an extra zero seconds.

Don't like that ? Un-Install in 20 seconds.


Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5

It gave me text on top of text and full glass was not that transparent and the Start menu was in dark brown! I couldn't read it in that color and with text on top of text. Plus, it gave me that ugly globe for the word "start". I hate that stupid globe. I wanted it to be like classic XP and it does not have that dumb globe...that started in Vista if you were not using Classic Windows. I chose the classic menu but it still had that fat ugly globe for Start.

I would have played with though except it suddenly disappeared (the Start menu part) and I couldn't figure out how to get it back. I also did not like the childish icons in Explorer that it added. But I would have played with it except I couldn't get it back. So, I just uninstalled it.

Maybe I will try it again later. It is not simple like you claim...there is a LOT to learn if you use it and I am overwhelmed with learning right now...don't need anything more to learn.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson


Shootist
Premium
join:2003-02-10
Decatur, GA
kudos:3
reply to R2

said by R2:

Where is the big red X to stop these programs??? So many things - the Default PDF program and the Default music program don't have a red X in the corner to shut them down!! And honestly I cannot find that red X anywhere!!! That is REALLY annoying!!!!

MS is going the ways of Apple Mac. On a Mac when you close a window you are working in the program itself Does Not Close. It stays running in the background until you Quit the program.

Why on earth is MS following Apple Mac on this. It is the Stupidest thing I have every had to deal with, as I own one Mac. It will be my last Apple product. As it's looking Windows 7 will be my last Microsoft Operating System also.
--
Shooter Ready--Stand By BEEP ********

Riamen
Premium
join:2002-11-04
Calgary

1 edit

said by Shootist:

MS is going the ways of Apple Mac. On a Mac when you close a window you are working in the program itself Does Not Close. It stays running in the background until you Quit the program.

Why on earth is MS following Apple Mac on this. It is the Stupidest thing I have every had to deal with, as I own one Mac. It will be my last Apple product. As it's looking Windows 7 will be my last Microsoft Operating System also.

You obviously don't understand OS X, windows on the Mac represent documents not applications. Close a window and you're closing a document, the application still runs until you chose to close it.

The behaviour in Metro is different and has nothing to do with aping the Mac. It's falling line with other mobile operating systems where there's little need to close apps and the OS handles everything. It makes sense for mobile touch-based operating systems. I admit less so on the desktop.

Shootist
Premium
join:2003-02-10
Decatur, GA
kudos:3

I understand OS X very well, thank you.


Riamen
Premium
join:2002-11-04
Calgary

Maybe so but your comparing it to Windows 8 didn't make sense.


SipSizzurp
Fo' Shizzle
Premium
join:2005-12-28
Houston, TX
kudos:4
reply to Mele20

said by Mele20:

Maybe I will try it again later. It is not simple like you claim...there is a LOT to learn if you use it and I am overwhelmed with learning right now...don't need anything more to learn.

I'm sure there are settings to adjust all those things you did not like, but I can sympathize with not having the time to learn a bunch of new stuff. At least you know what is available and can quiet those who keep pointing you to an alternate shell.

The customer is always right, and this is something that Microsoft needs to be aware of. It would have been very easy to leave more basic desktop functionality in the desktop. If they can put 30 check boxes of options in the "Performance and View" to adjust fading and sliding options they could damn sure have included one check box somewhere to enable / disable classic desktop functionality for those of us who would have liked a choice.

Shootist
Premium
join:2003-02-10
Decatur, GA
kudos:3
reply to Riamen

said by Riamen:

Maybe so but your comparing it to Windows 8 didn't make sense.

Maybe not to you but it makes sense to me. But then I am not either a MS or Apple Fan boy.
--
Shooter Ready--Stand By BEEP ********


R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1
reply to Riamen

OK, but that is a LOT more time consuming than clicking a big red X! Especially on a lap top without a mouse.

I seems Windows 8 is REALLY meant to be used with touch screens - which is fine - but that is NOT what I have, so why isn't there a NON-touch screen style, lap top friendly way to close Modern UI Apps?... eh, like how about a big red X?



R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1

3 edits
reply to Mele20

Click for full size
Mele, this is what I get as the default music player. Despite having some buttons at the bottom, none of them has an X...

I installed Adobe Acrobat immediately after I saw the functionality (or lack thereof) in the default "Reader" program. It was horrible. I cannot find it anymore, so maybe Adobe appropriately kills that thing once it is installed.

Believe me, I hate how intrusive Adobe is with their twice a day ARM update announcements, but at least their product has some functionality to it...


R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1
reply to Shootist

Shootist: "when you close a window you are working in the program itself Does Not Close. It stays running in the background until you Quit the program."

I believe that is what they did on the Pocket OS for Windows (Windows CE?) when Palm ruled the shirt pockets of all geeks. The iPaq with Windows CE was SUCH a dog - because it would never close anything! It was nearly impossible to use! You had to reboot it more often than Windows 3.1.

I didn't like it back then, and I don't think I'll like it now...


Riamen
Premium
join:2002-11-04
Calgary
reply to R2

said by R2:

OK, but that is a LOT more time consuming than clicking a big red X! Especially on a lap top without a mouse.

I seems Windows 8 is REALLY meant to be used with touch screens - which is fine - but that is NOT what I have, so why isn't there a NON-touch screen style, lap top friendly way to close Modern UI Apps?... eh, like how about a big red X?

I agree but it's the easiest way I found to close apps. The mouse gesture is meant to mimic swiping your finger from the top to the bottom to close an app on a tablet.


R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1

I got it, but on a 17 inch lap top with a touch pad - that's a LONG way to go. And certainly not user friendly...



RazzyW8

@rr.com
reply to R2

said by R2:

OK, but that is a LOT more time consuming than clicking a big red X! Especially on a lap top without a mouse.

I seems Windows 8 is REALLY meant to be used with touch screens - which is fine - but that is NOT what I have, so why isn't there a NON-touch screen style, lap top friendly way to close Modern UI Apps?... eh, like how about a big red X?

Do you have touchpad drivers with Windows 8 gesture support?

»www.howtogeek.com/126084/how-to-···rackpad/

to close app with touchpad gesture, you'd need to swipe in from top then keep swiping to bottom of touchpad


Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1
reply to R2

quote:
Originally unveiled by ZDNet, the update on the Windows side, due in mid-2013, will include UI changes and alterations to the entire platform and pricing. We’re told that Microsoft is aiming to make Windows Blue the next OS that everyone installs. The approach is simple, Microsoft will price its next Windows release at a low cost or even free to ensure users upgrade. Once Windows Blue is released, the Windows SDK will be updated to support the new release and Microsoft will stop accepting apps that are built specifically for Windows 8, pushing developers to create apps for Blue. Windows 8 apps will continue to run on Blue despite the planned SDK changes.
»www.theverge.com/2012/11/28/3693···low-cost


plencnerb
Premium
join:2000-09-25
Carpentersville, IL
kudos:3
reply to R2

said by R2:

Believe me, I hate how intrusive Adobe is with their twice a day ARM update announcements, but at least their product has some functionality to it...

I have been running Adobe Reader 10.x since it came out, and just recently updated to Reader 11.x. I've never seen any kind of message about an ARM update.

Why? Because when I install any application, I always check to see if there is a way to turn off auto updates from inside of said application. I even go one step further and check for any new services that may have "update" in them. Finally, I'll go look in the registry to see what runs on startup. There are 3 places where run keys can be placed in the registry, and in those 3 places, I only have 6 items: 2 are for McAfee, 2 are for Bonic (distributed computing project) and 2 are for my Microsoft Keyboard.

If you are bothered by the Adobe ARM updates, go remove the keys from the registry!

--Brian
--
============================
--Brian Plencner

E-Mail: CoasterBrian72Cancer@gmail.com
Note: Kill Cancer to Reply via e-mail


R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1

I completely agree! Thanks, and I do know that, but I actually use MANY computers through my day at work. I think almost EVERY computer I touch has a tray message asking to update Reader. I don't have the time to remove it from all of them, and even if I did, someone would come along later and install something else or download some update - only to have it reset the ARM update message!

I just find the number or updates they release to be very excessive.

Razzy - no, but I will look into that. Thanks.

Octavean - thanks too.


Shootist
Premium
join:2003-02-10
Decatur, GA
kudos:3
reply to R2

said by R2:

Shootist: "when you close a window you are working in the program itself Does Not Close. It stays running in the background until you Quit the program."

I didn't like it back then, and I don't think I'll like it now...

On Mac most programs do not close when you close the window for that program. Kind of like the 2 X's in a windows program where the bottom X is to close the window and the top X, the one in the Program title bar, closes both the window and the program. But on a Mac there is only one X and that is to close the window. Mac uses the same bar at the top of the screen for program menus and like the start bar and notification area in windows it has all those icons for WiFi and the clock and various other things along with all the menu options for the program that is active. You have to go to the program name in the menu bar, when it is the active program and click it then click Quit programname, or Command+q, to quit (Close) the active program. It you forgot to close a program and then opened another the name for that program you thought you closed by closing the window does not appear in the menu bar. you then have to Command+Tab (or click in the Mac Dock) to make that still running program (With NO Window open for it) the active program so you can shut it down.
Mac fanboys say OS X handles all this and you never have to shut programs down. Bunch Of BS.

If you are asking about Win 8 then yes with the Metro Apps just making the app disappear from the screen does not close the underlying program. It is still running.

Also Win 8 doesn't really shut down. It goes into some state of sleep/hibernation when you think you are turning off your computer. That is how they can get it to boot faster. If you really do shut it down, and there are ways to do that, the Boot times are much better then Win 7
--
Shooter Ready--Stand By BEEP ********

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5
reply to Shootist

said by Shootist:

said by R2:

Where is the big red X to stop these programs??? So many things - the Default PDF program and the Default music program don't have a red X in the corner to shut them down!! And honestly I cannot find that red X anywhere!!! That is REALLY annoying!!!!

MS is going the ways of Apple Mac. On a Mac when you close a window you are working in the program itself Does Not Close. It stays running in the background until you Quit the program.

Why on earth is MS following Apple Mac on this. It is the Stupidest thing I have every had to deal with, as I own one Mac. It will be my last Apple product. As it's looking Windows 7 will be my last Microsoft Operating System also.

i just noticed this. I don't have PDF reader (use Evince on XP) yet on this Win 8 computer. (I won't need a standalone one once I upgrade Fx 10 ESR to Fx 17 ESR). There was a link in a thread here last evening to a PDF article. I clicked on it and up popped this really ugly reader with a black background. I read the article and CLOSED IT when finished. Hmpf. I didn't really close it! I found it OPEN to the article when I sat down at the computer today. I'm not sure how to close it...as ugly as it is and with Fx 17 having builtin PDF reader I won't use it once I upgrade Fx...but how do I turn it off as well as close it now?
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5
reply to Shootist

said by Shootist:

said by R2:

Shootist: "when you close a window you are working in the program itself Does Not Close. It stays running in the background until you Quit the program."

I didn't like it back then, and I don't think I'll like it now...

If you are asking about Win 8 then yes with the Metro Apps just making the app disappear from the screen does not close the underlying program. It is still running.

Also Win 8 doesn't really shut down. It goes into some state of sleep/hibernation when you think you are turning off your computer. That is how they can get it to boot faster. If you really do shut it down, and there are ways to do that, the Boot times are much better then Win 7

I got that crappy Win 8 PDF reader closed just now by mousing to the upper left corner of the monitor, and clicking on the X on that thumbnail of the PDF reader open to the article I read last night. It's completely closed now. But I don't want to INCREASE mouse clicks ....that just invites more chronic hand problems..,just as the extra number of keyboard strokes on Win 8 does the same.

I disagree that boot times are fast in Win 8. I have the OS on an SSD but it boots more slowly than my almost 7 year old XP computer. It does shut down fully. It never sleeps because I don't allow that in power options. That is another crappy thing in Win 8...but I recall that as crappy in Wiin 7 beta (never had Win 7 except during public beta). I prefer Power Options in XP Pro.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson

Shootist
Premium
join:2003-02-10
Decatur, GA
kudos:3

On a Desktop system I don't want ANY Power Options. I want it to run FULL POWER all the time. So I agree with you on those setting. On my notebook I use them for longer battery life.
--
Shooter Ready--Stand By BEEP ********



Ctrl Alt Del
Premium
join:2002-02-18
kudos:1
reply to Shootist

said by Shootist:

On Mac most programs do not close when you close the window for that program.

This behavior is slowly disappearing, and both the Mac and Windows are beginning to manage apps in a similar way. Starting in OS 10.7 Lion, and even more in 10.8 Mountain Lion, the OS now has automatic termination. If the application explicitly supports automatic termination, when the OS detects there are no open windows, no background processes doing work, there's nothing to save, and the application no longer has focus, the OS will quit the app. On my Mac, all of these apps will fully quit after you close the last window: Calendar, Contacts, Notes, Reminders, TextEdit, Preview. Other applications that fully quit themselves when you close the window include: App Store, Image Capture. Now the only apps that remain open in the background after closing the window are: web browsers, Mail, iTunes. Web browsers stay open so they are quick to re-open. Mail stays open to fetch email in the background. iTunes stays open to play music and sync with iDevices.

So if you hated how the Mac kept apps open all the time, upgrade to the latest OS. Now there's only 3 or 4 applications that stay open all the time.
--
less talk, more music

Shootist
Premium
join:2003-02-10
Decatur, GA
kudos:3

That is true and false. If you have a Mac start every app you can then close the windows for them. Look and see how much RAM is being used and processes are running. Then let it sit and see if those processes close and how long it takes. I have and the OS never really closes the App.
--
Shooter Ready--Stand By BEEP ********



R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to Mele20

Yes, the best description of that Metro reader is simply UGLY. There is NOTHING good about it - and it is REALLY UGLY as well. I fully agree!!!!!



sivran
Opera ex-pat
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Irving, TX
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to R2

Well if this is your biggest gripe about 8, I guess you don't have any real problems and like it just fine.
--
Think Outside the Fox.



R2
R Not
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-18
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1

Yeah well, I just started to get to know the beast!!


SilentMan

join:2002-07-15
New York, NY
reply to R2

Windows 8: Ugliest Windows yet! That Sinofsky guy really has bad taste!


Riamen
Premium
join:2002-11-04
Calgary
reply to Shootist

said by Shootist:

That is true and false. If you have a Mac start every app you can then close the windows for them. Look and see how much RAM is being used and processes are running. Then let it sit and see if those processes close and how long it takes. I have and the OS never really closes the App.

Automatic termination is a feature of OS X 10.7 and later. Apps have to be re-written to take advantage of it.
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