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mstaszew

join:2012-12-03

POTS Splitter Installation Help

Click for full size
NID
Hi there, I am trying to install a POTS splitter.

First, I've read both the Homerun FAQ (»AT&T Southeast Forum FAQ »Homerun FAQ revision w/o photos for now) and the NID schematic (»AT&T Southeast Forum FAQ »Standard POTS NID (Network Interface Device) Schematic) but am still a little unsure as to which connections I need to disconnect. I've uploaded a picture of my NID.

NID Setup:

I have two IWs exiting the NID through the grommet: an olive one feeding the phone jacks in my house and a green one feeding a garage/bonus room addition. I would like to add a third cable as the home run for my modem. I already have CAT 6 run to the new modem location and I've wired it to the NID (not shown in the picture) and all is working as expected.

Splitter Installation:

What am I an connecting the jumper wire to inside of the NID? Am I supposed to disconnect the red/green wires that connect the telco side to the EBN and jump between those and the splitter's network and use the returned voice/data lines in the jumper to connect to the IW as appropriate? Or, do I simply leave the telco/EBN connections intact, disconnect all of the IWs from the EBN, jump between the EBN and splitter, and connect my jumper to the IW (within the NID) so that no IWs are connected directly to the EBN?

Finally, what are "appropriate" connections to be made between the jumper and the IWs? Is twisting/taping them together enough? Should I solder? Is there a super easy crimp on connector I can get from Radio Shack?

Thanks in advance,
Michael

mstaszew

join:2012-12-03

I'm not color blind, but as stated in the original post the "green" cable for the bonus room from the NID is clearly blue in the picture!



David
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reply to mstaszew

ok first you only need one wire from the nid to the splitter. That wire would connect on the "network" pins of your splitter. Your other cables would connect to the "Voice" pins for your phones and the "data" one would be for just your DSL jack.

my diagram is below

downloadSchematic.mht 154759 bytes
(Schematic.mht.zip)

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mstaszew

join:2012-12-03

Ok, thanks. So your diagram made it clearer, but to be 100% clear, I understand the splitter connections and that a single wire jumps between the NID/splitter, but the jumper is connected to the NID on the EBN posts correct? In other words I am not disconnecting the wires connecting the telco side to the customer side and jumping from the telco side directly, correct? And the jumper wires from the splitter's posts (o/ow and bl/blw from your diagram) are connected directly to my inside wiring within the NID. The existing IW are no longer connected at all to the EBN and the only connection from the EBN is to the jumper between the NID and the splitter. Is that all correct? If so, what kind of connections did you make between the jumper and exising IWs? Is twisting/taping sufficient? Should I solder/heat shrink tubing? Is there a small crimp on connector that would make this easier? Thanks.



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reply to mstaszew

you shouldn't need to disconnect anything on the telco side. For mine I ran 3 seperate wires. One wire to carry it into the house. MOunted the splitter in the basement, and made my voice and data connections with 2 other cat5e wires. You should only need one pair of wires at the nid/sni (or one cable with one pair). The splitting and multipair wiring is done at the splitter. Any more wires there and the splitter won't help and will be more or less a bridge tap to the modem.


medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
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reply to mstaszew

I think you need to call your telco and ask for a new NID first...

here's what mine looks like...

»Re: Cat5/Cat6...... Phone/DSL install



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reply to mstaszew

I don't think he will need a newer nid, a newer one will probably be more confusing than this one. This one looks pretty modern for a residential 2 pair install. I have an IW box in my house that looks about the same.

All he really has to do is take one wire and wire it to which hooks has his dial tone and run the splitter like I posted and I think he will be ok.


medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
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said by David:

I don't think he will need a newer nid, a newer one will probably be more confusing than this one. This one looks pretty modern for a residential 2 pair install. I have an IW box in my house that looks about the same.

All he really has to do is take one wire and wire it to which hooks has his dial tone and run the splitter like I posted and I think he will be ok.

his NID doesn't look to far from this guy's own NID which was causing issues...

»Re: Cat5/Cat6...... Phone/DSL install

I'd still push for a new NID for a cleaner and more efficient connections, stable signals and better splitter wiring...


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2 edits
reply to David

Your wiring advice might be made a bit clearer if you replace the word "wire" with the phrase "wire pair" (unless you are actually talking about doing something that makes a mockery of Ohm's law as I have always interpreted it). If the OP is not familiar with Ohm's law, and only moves a single wire for each telco circuit, things are not likely to work very well.

And FWIW, not everyone is going to be able to easily view your uploaded MS proprietary file Schematic.mht (just in case that file clarifies your instructions).




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Canezoid
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reply to David

said by David:

I don't think he will need a newer nid, a newer one will probably be more confusing than this one. This one looks pretty modern for a residential 2 pair install. I have an IW box in my house that looks about the same.

All he really has to do is take one wire and wire it to which hooks has his dial tone and run the splitter like I posted and I think he will be ok.

Sorry, not modern at all, this particular unit dates back to the mid/late 1980's, actually an updated 1 would make it easier as the splitter can be placed inside, along w/ the new home run as the other poster's pic shows. This unit will not accomodate that at all.


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reply to mstaszew

It looks more modern than what I am used to seeing. I am used to seeing the little plastic cup with two screws. I am not a NID/SNI know it all, nor profess to be one. I am sure there is many nids that I would think are more modern but older than dirt. Hell mine might be ancient for all I know, mine is a standard keptel nid/sni though. I always figured if it had a test jack it was beyond the 80's



ILpt4U
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FWIW, doing U-Verse work, techs are required to replace the style of NID the OP has, and install a "slotted" style NID (new ones made by Corning, but there are similar older models made by Keptel)

»csmedia.corning.com/CableSystems···zoom.jpg - 3 Line newer NID
»csmedia.corning.com/CableSystems···zoom.jpg - 6 Line newer NID

The newer NIDs do give you a little more space to work with on the customer side (and telco side) for wiring, and have the slots for internal/NID-based xDSL splitters


mstaszew

join:2012-12-03
reply to mstaszew

The house was built in '86 and I suspect the NID is just as old.

I haven't done the installation yet, but after rereading the homerun FAQ again and looking at David's attachment I should be good to go. I plan on installing it tonight right before I setup QoS on my router so the significant other can't hog bandwidth for Netflix while I'm trying to play xbox!

I didn't see anyone suggest preferred connection method for joining the jumper to IWs, but I see gel filled connectors and other types online. Radio Shack had some water "resistant" crimp on connectors that accommodate the number of wires I have. I'll just throw some dielectric compound in them and crimp unless this type of connector is not advised.

David's attachment is actually a .zip file containing a .mht. The filename of the download is misleading, but if you look just beneath the link it tells you the file extension. Just rename to zip, extract, view in IE, but I'm not sure if Mac has native support for web page archive files though. It would probably be better at a standard HTML page though or link to one so that everyone can access it.

Thanks,
Michael


medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
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reply to mstaszew

what exactly are you trying to accomplish with this project?

are you having issues?


mstaszew

join:2012-12-03
reply to mstaszew

I was just trying to install the splitter and was curious as to how the connections were made to the NID. The wiring within the splitter was well understood, but the connection to the EBN had me second guessing myself. It's installed now though and working properly.

The only issue I had was trusting the connectors I bought that said stripping the wire was unnecessary... well... that was wrong. I tried once without stripping and no dial tone. The crimp must not have cut through the insulation. I cut off the connectors and twisted wires together to test... dial tone. Stripped wire and then used the connectors... dial tone. Modem works, etc.



NetFixer
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said by mstaszew:

The only issue I had was trusting the connectors I bought that said stripping the wire was unnecessary... well... that was wrong. I tried once without stripping and no dial tone. The crimp must not have cut through the insulation. I cut off the connectors and twisted wires together to test... dial tone. Stripped wire and then used the connectors... dial tone. Modem works, etc.

That is a fairly common occurrence. It is often caused by using IDC connectors/splices that are designed for use on stranded wire with vinyl insulation on solid wire with a newer more resilient insulation.
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tigerpaw509

join:2011-01-19
reply to mstaszew

Install a new nid and wire the filter and data wire to the entrance bridge.All other voice wires get connected to the filter but that nid has to go.



tigerpaw509

join:2011-01-19
reply to David

Test jacks were mandated after deregulation in 1984


KennesawMtn

join:2008-12-30
Kennesaw, GA
reply to ILpt4U

said by ILpt4U:

FWIW, doing U-Verse work, techs are required to replace the style of NID the OP has, and install a "slotted" style NID (new ones made by Corning, but there are similar older models made by Keptel)

»csmedia.corning.com/CableSystems···zoom.jpg - 3 Line newer NID
»csmedia.corning.com/CableSystems···zoom.jpg - 6 Line newer NID

The newer NIDs do give you a little more space to work with on the customer side (and telco side) for wiring, and have the slots for internal/NID-based xDSL splitters

But what about U-verse customer self installs like for internet only? I'm having that done, going from traditional DSL (with a external splitter and home run) to U-verse VDSL. In that case does the tech doing the line's swapover at the neighborhood box ever even come to the house and look at the NID? I'd be surprised if they do. In my case, my NID is 1989 vintage and is not compatible with DSL splitter modules that fit inside the NID. My current splitter is a seperate one in its own external housing that I mounted next to the NID in 2005.


ILpt4U
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said by KennesawMtn:

But what about U-verse customer self installs like for internet only? I'm having that done, going from traditional DSL (with a external splitter and home run) to U-verse VDSL. In that case does the tech doing the line's swapover at the neighborhood box ever even come to the house and look at the NID? I'd be surprised if they do. In my case, my NID is 1989 vintage and is not compatible with DSL splitter modules that fit inside the NID. My current splitter is a seperate one in its own external housing that I mounted next to the NID in 2005.

At least in my area, techs are dispatched to make the connections @ the crossbox/VRAD, and also go to the house to verify the VDSL2 signal at the house, inspect the drop/NID & update/replace as necessary.

While at the house, techs are supposed to knock on the door, and if the customer is home/available, go inside and verify the VDSL2 signal makes it to the modem jack. If good, then good. If the signal is not stable/good to the modem jack, any inside wiring work is potentially billable to resplice existing wiring or run new wiring. If the customer is not home, the NID is tagged/labeled, any existing inside wiring that was connected before is connected again. If the existing wiring will hold the signal, all is good. If a technician revisit is required for a failed self installation & the signal is good to the NID, the revisit is billable

KennesawMtn

join:2008-12-30
Kennesaw, GA

That makes sense (that they check signal at the NID) and I hope they do come by today. I will be home as well.

But if they replace my 1989/1990 style NID, I would think that would only be needed if they deem my current external DSL splitter incompatible with the new VDSL. In that case I will still need a new modular DSL splitter for inside the newer style NID. I wonder if that is deemed billable, as having a home run from the NID is not exactly the typical installation. But I did the home run back in 2005 for 2 reasons. 1) to avoid needing in-line filters and 2) to have a better signal to the modem, as my home's phone wiring is the older 4 conductor non-twisted pair type.


KennesawMtn

join:2008-12-30
Kennesaw, GA

1 edit

Installer came today. Courteous and everything is working fine. my 12/1.5 tier is performing pretty close to those levels (~11.3/1.35).

He had no concerns about the older style NID, which he did not replace. When I asked about the adjacent whole-home DSL filter I already had, he thought it would be OK and said the hookup looked fine. He was not 100% certain about it working OK with the VDSL so he called his technical resource area and they said it would be fine. I later looked up my splitter model # (guess I could have done that before, huh?) on its inside cover. It is a Corning SPS-H70-SR1, specs for it are good with VDSL

Had I not asked, I don't think it would have necessarily been a topic of conversation, as checking the signal at the NID was what he was looking to do it appeared. It seems to me that in this Atlanta area market that inside the home in-line filters with the DSL piggy-backing on the "phone" wiring (such as non twisted pair 4 conductor like I have) are the expected norm for DSL and Uverse internet. My home run, however has served me well since I got DSL in 2005.