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ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI

1 edit

Asus RT-N16 as secondary router, need DHCP on both routers?

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I helped a friend set up some security cameras last year. At that time she didn't have internet at home, but using the router she could look at all her cameras using a laptop or desktop. She just got internet installed couple weeks ago and whoever did it, sold her another router she didn't need and wired everything as on picture. I was pissed when I learned about it but it was too late.

Linksys has stock firmware (looks like it isn't supported by Tomato) and Asus runs on Tomato USB.

Must have's:
1. Asus has to sit where it is (against the window, looking right at 5 out of 6 cameras). It's signal is boosted too. So I can't just swap routers.
2. Remaining 1 camera could potentially work off the Linksys router, which is in the basement (but half the distance vs Asus)
2. Wireless cameras must be have static IPs designated so she can use free DNS service and watch the video from her smart phone or other computer.

Without rewiring it, can I make it work? I tried LAN-LAN (not really what I needed) and LAN-WAN (fail), but obviously I am missing something as I am networking noob. Obviously Cat5 run from modem to Asus (making it primary router) would fix this problem, but it would be a huge PITA to do it.

Is there a way to have DHCP running on both routers?


tcg
Premium
join:2003-09-12
Lubbock, TX

1 recommendation

Re: Asus RT-N16 as secondary router, need DHCP on both routers

From your diagram, I fail to see the need for DHCP on both routers. Turn the Asus router into an access point, put whatever port forwarding information you need to reach the cameras in the Linksys and you're done.


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada

1 recommendation

reply to ba1drick
Disable DHCP on the Asus... Assuming the Linksys is .1, statically assign the WAN address of the Asus as .2 (just for the ability to access and manage - actually does nothing for the traffic).

Use DHCP reservations or static assignments outside the DHCP range of the Linksys for the cameras...

No problem...


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
So you are suggesting LAN-LAN, which I already tried, turning Asus to slave/dummy.

I still don't know how would I assign static IPs using Linksys.
On Asus running Tomato, it's super easy, where one menu shows all discovered MAC addresses and you can add IPs right away.

1. How would Linksys "see" cameras that are discovered by Asus?
2. How should I manage SSID's and channels?


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
I'm not familar with that specific router, but the Googe-Fu is strong today...

»content.etilize.com/User-Manual/···1888.pdf

Page 25 is DHCP reservations.

If the SSID's and WiFi are working through the Asus right now, I'd probably leave it alone, myself... No use fixing what isn't broken.

As for 'seeing' the cameras - if DHCP is disabled on the Asus - the Linksys will answer the DHCP requests from the cameras, assuming they are setup for DHCP now. Are they, or are they static?


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
Right now, all 6 wireless cameras have static addresses set up on tomato/Asus settings. 192.168.1.111, *112, *113, etc. Every unique MAC address is assigned it's own IP address.

They have to be static in order to work with multi camera software on laptop and to work through no-ip or similar DNS service, so camera footage can be seen online (away from the house) or on smartphone.

This is the exact setup I have myself at my home, except I am using just 1 router and set up was a breeze.


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to ba1drick
OK - so the cameras are DHCP, the router has a DHCP reservation... That's actually easier for us here, I'd think.

Just write down the MACs and associated IPs in the Asus before you disable DHCP, then can put the same info info the Linksys...


tcg
Premium
join:2003-09-12
Lubbock, TX

1 recommendation

reply to ba1drick
Yes, if you connect a LAN port on the Asus to the switch, which is connected to the Linksys, disable DHCP on the Asus and assign the Asus an IP, you have effectively turned the Asus into an access point. The Linksys will see any wireless devices connected to the Asus router.

However, look at the documentation for the Asus. A Netgear router that I have here (wnr2000v3) has you use the WAN port for the connection, if you use the firmware that is inbuilt for the AP configuration. But it works fine using the steps in the first paragraph for configuration.

Technically, you don't assign static IP's for the cameras on the Linksys, you do it on each camera. Use IP's that are outside the DHCP scope (on Linksys routers, this scope ordinarily starts at .100)


clarknova

join:2010-02-23
Grande Prairie, AB
kudos:7
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

1 recommendation

reply to ba1drick
Tomato has a nice feature that enables you to bridge the WAN to LAN, effectively giving you five LAN ports (see screen shot). Do this and disable the DHCP server as others have mentioned, and the ASUS becomes a switch and access point on your network, with the Linksys doing all the routing and DHCP work.

You can make static lease assignments for the cameras on the Linksys, or configure the static IPs into the cameras themselves, outside the DHCP range of the router, as the previous poster described.
--
db


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
reply to ba1drick
Sounds good, I will try that when I visit her next time.

Couple more questions:

1. Should I use Linksys factory firmware or should I upgrade to DD-WRT? It doesn't look like it's supported by Tomato.
2. Should I delete all settings on Asus itself or leave them alone? It looks like they will be ignored once I cascade it LAN-LAN.
3. What should I do for SSIDs on both routers. Same? Different? If same, then what channels? I read somewhere that after long struggle with setting the channels, guy had most luck with channel 1 on both routers. Kinda weird.


clarknova

join:2010-02-23
Grande Prairie, AB
kudos:7
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

1 recommendation

1. I'm leery of factory firmwares, and I have very little experience with dd-wrt. If it were mine I would flash dd-wrt for the QoS and maybe vSSID abilities. That said, most people just want stability, and I would probably settle on whichever one proved most reliable.

2. If the DHCP server has been disabled and you're using it in bridge mode, pretty much everything but the wireless settings become irrelevant. Any changes you make to other settings will be for your own entertainment.

3. If you make both SSIDs and security the same, devices on your network will be free to roam between APs. This can be a good or a bad thing. Some wireless hosts have the ability to lock to one AP, in which case you could be lucky enough to have devices roam or not roam according to your wildest desires.

As for channels, in theory you want to avoid anything within 5 channels on 2.4 GHz (10 channels if people are using 40 MHz channel width). In practice, the "automatic" setting is usually a good choice, or you may just have to trial and adjust for your environment.
--
db


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
OK, I will try everything as suggested. I will try stock Linksys firmware first and maybe wander to DD-WRT at some point. I really wish Tomato supported it as I think there is some neater way of running 2 Tomato routers together.

Would there be any advantages if instead I went with LAN-WAN setup, creating 2 separate subnets? One of my worries is overloading the throughput of the primary router with 6 streams going on all the time.

Now add the TV stream (netflix or whatever online stream) and the performance on the laptop or desktop would likely be affected.

Or am I overthinking it?

Also, it would be nice to be able to use ASUS as primary router as it's more advanced, but again it would mean either buying another copy of N16 to replace the E1200 or running additional wire to place existing N16 as primary router.


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
Also, out of curiosity (I won't be able to test anything for few more days), what would happen if DHCP was disabled on primary (Linksys) router and enabled on secondary (Asus) router.

What would happen to devices plugged into Linksys?


aefstoggaflm
Open Source Fan
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join:2002-03-04
Bethlehem, PA
kudos:7
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said by ba1drick:

Also, out of curiosity (I won't be able to test anything for few more days), what would happen if DHCP was disabled on primary (Linksys) router and enabled on secondary (Asus) router.

What would happen to devices plugged into Linksys?

Unless I am mistaken: The computers that are not setup to use a Static IP (DHCP) will not be able to access the net.

By mistaken, for example: The Asus router can tell the DHCP clients, to use a different Default Gateway other than Asus router's LAN IP.
--
Please use the "yellow (IM) envelope" to contact me and please leave the URL intact.


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
In short:

1. With Linksys DHCP turned off, will Asus (DHCP on) see what's plugged into Linksys (wired) or in wireless range of Linksys? If so, I can give them static IPs from Asus.

2. Would that would mean that I don't need the extra Cat5 run from Asus back to Linksys, turning Asus into my primary router?


clarknova

join:2010-02-23
Grande Prairie, AB
kudos:7
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to ba1drick
Good news. Looks like you can put Tomato on the Linksys: »tomato.groov.pl/download/K26RT-N···-Max.bin

It appears that Tomato (at least shibby and teddybear builds) don't support changing the default gateway in the dhcp server, so you'll have to keep dhcp on the gateway router. Maybe that doesn't matter now that you'll be installing Tomato on the Linksys.

The advantages to placing a router between the cameras and the other devices are 1) broadcasts will not pass the router. Probably not a concern in this setup, and 2) a router can put some security between the attached networks. Also not a concern from what you've told us, since the client will be viewing the cameras from outside anyway.

The disadvantages to running the RT-N16 as a router is increased complexity, including more port forwarding (NAT) setup and more dhcp administration. Based on what you've told us I would recommend installing Tomato on the E1200 and leave the RT-N16 in AP mode.
--
db


clarknova

join:2010-02-23
Grande Prairie, AB
kudos:7
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to ba1drick
The show-stopper problem with using the ASUS as your DHCP server is that the clients will get the ASUS as their default gateway, and therefore not have access to the internet. Maybe you can change that in the shell, but not in the GUI.

If you really want the ASUS as gateway without moving it, then you have two plausible options, 1) run another wire to it, or 2) get a vlan-capable switch to replace your switch. Put the modem's LAN port and ASUS's WAN port on an isolated vlan, then put the ASUS's LAN port and all your local hosts on another vlan. Put the E1200 in AP mode and disconnect it from the modem. Connect its LAN port (or WAN, if bridged) to the LAN. This second solution is logically equivalent to running another wire.
--
db


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
I thought I checked with Shibby's website before (as that's what Asus is running) and he lists E1200v1, not v2. Not sure how much difference there is, I guess it's worth emailing him, as having 2 routers with Tomato should make things way easier.
»tomato.groov.pl/?page_id=69
BTW, DD-WRT clearly distinguishes v1 and v2.
»www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Su···g.2Fn.29

OK, so lets scratch the idea of swapping DHCPs and wait what Shibby will tell me on v2.

I agree, running the wire would fix everything, but it's hell of a job (concrete block walls, ton of joists, store area, crappy suspended ceilings). I will do it if that's the only option left. I will take a look on how the wire was fed by the installer when i have a chance.


clarknova

join:2010-02-23
Grande Prairie, AB
kudos:7
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

1 recommendation

Yeah, it's not listed there, but it's listed here:

»tomato.groov.pl/download/K26RT-N···-series/

I don't know if I would bother running a wire. For reasonable outlay you can get a GS108E and just do the vlan thing with existing wiring.
--
db


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
Great catch! Thanks!

OK, so Tomato goes on Linksys for sure. What's the best way to set them up now with 2 Tomato-powered routers? I might actually use that exact same setup at my own home too.


clarknova

join:2010-02-23
Grande Prairie, AB
kudos:7
I think your current setup (in the diagram) is best. Install Tomato on the E1200 and put the ASUS in AP mode. Set up static reservations for the cameras, and port forwarding in the E1200.
--
db


ba1drick

join:2004-07-01
Baraboo, WI
1. Would it make any sense to set up Asus to run in N-mode only (as all cameras are N) to max the range/quality on them?

2. Then, would it bother Linksys if it's running mixed or G only and SSID is same on both routers? (so, with same SSID, can one router do N and other mixed or G?)

1 camera is closer to Linksys and will probably connect to it rather than to Asus (if Linksys is running N or mixed)

3. And finally, are there any Tomato-specific options I can use here to my advantage?