 Wolfie007My dog is an elitist
Premium Member
join:2005-03-12 |
to Hydraglass
Re: [Serious] Nurse who transferred prank call commits suicidesaid by Hydraglass:how many people have been booted from their careers and done just fine - most of us at one point or another no?
That was just an example. We don't know if that happened, but if something like that did, or if she thought that it was inevitable, your armchair psychoanalysis is flawed. A critical determinant of our ability to cope with a major setback is the extent to which we're conditioned to it over time. Something that happens completely out of the blue is far more devastating than something that we've been expecting for years. Incidentally, the opposite is true, too. Studies have shown that many lottery winners go on to lead surprisingly miserable lives because the incredible high of "the day they won the lottery" leads to expectations that real life inevitably cannot fulfill. Whereas people who gradually become wealthy can realistically cope. |
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peterboro (banned)Avatars are for posers
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
1 recommendation |
to Hydraglass
said by Hydraglass: The hospital has already released several statements that they had no disciplinary actions toward her, and that everyone there felt equally bad... Of course they are saying that now. But her initial interaction was probably along the lines of hospital administration trying to find ways to shift the blame to her. They just never got the chance. If they are anything like the morally bankrupt bunch that run the hospital in Peterborough she would have been quickly dispatched once the public scrutiny stopped. |
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 FFH5
Premium Member
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ |
to Wolfie007
said by Wolfie007:I was just reading about this and it's truly sad.
A little confusing, though, and I think it's being poorly described due to the usual crap journalism. It's been described as the person who "put through" the call, but that person at the actual main switchboard was only on the phone for a few seconds and likely not even a nurse. The nurse who picked up the phone in the ward and spoke with them and actually gave them real information is undoubtedly who they're talking about.
CBC has a recording of the call and it's pretty innocuous, mostly just a stupid stunt of the kind that happens all the time (remember when Sarah Palin got a call from a Quebec DJ impersonating the President of France?). How it could lead to a suicide is perplexing. I suspect there's a lot more that we're not being told. The hospital claims they were "supportive" of the nurse, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out that they dumped on her in a really major way. Maybe one of the downsides of the reverence with which royalty is still regarded over there. OTOH, medical confidentiality does apply to everyone.
I get the feeling too that she must have taken some real grief from bosses at hospital to get so depressed she killed herself. Suicide seems pretty drastic if all she suffered was embarrassment. |
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 dirtyjeffer0Posers don't use avatars.
Premium Member
join:2002-02-21
London, ON |
to Gone
said by Gone:Perhaps, but one should also keep in mind that the British media is relentless and puts what we have here in North America to shame when it comes to hounding people.
funny you mention that...my coworker told me the same thing...his wife (prior to him meeting her) spent several years in England and said the same thing. |
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 SteveI know your IP address
join:2001-03-10
Tustin, CA |
to Gone
said by Gone: Perhaps, but one should also keep in mind that the British media is relentless and puts what we have here in North America to shame when it comes to hounding people. Especially when it comes to royals. |
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to donoreo
Literally a waste of life.
My understanding was she was not the nurse to divulge the intimate details of the Duchess’ condition, she only transfered the call, yet she felt bad enough to kill herself and leave two kids behind - that's such a tragedy. |
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Yes, and the prank call was 5:30 AM local time, no switchboard operator at night, so this nurse was the person who initially answered the call and transferred it to the nurse taking care of the Duchess.
A real shame. |
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 shaner
Premium Member
join:2000-10-04
Calgary, AB |
shaner to DKS
Premium Member
2012-Dec-7 7:54 pm
to DKS
The facebook page has been deleted. Edit: No it hasn't. That appears to be an error by CTV news who linked to the wrong site address. » www.facebook.com/2dayfm. |
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to donoreo
We have a lot of "shock jocks" in the US, but these Australians are assholes beyond the pale. 2DayFM has a history of public humiliation. In 2009, a 14-year-old girl was tricked into acknowledging that she had been raped at the age of 12 -- only to be asked by a DJ: "Is that the only experience you've had?"
That led the Australian Communications and Media Authority to censure the station -- saying the broadcast did not meet standards of decency. The station said it had provided the teenager with counseling and vowed "to prevent anything similar from happening again."
But 2DayFM has been the subject of several inquiries since; and this year was told it "must not broadcast material that demeans or is likely to demean women or girls" as a condition of keeping its license.
That followed a broadcast in which a female journalist was called a derogatory term and told "to watch your mouth or I'll hunt you down" by DJ Kyle Sandilands. » www.cnn.com/2012/12/07/w ··· dex.html |
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 DKSDamn Kidney Stones
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON |
to donoreo
London police are in contact with Australian police. They want to interview the DJs. The call may have been illegal under Australian law and in violation of the national broadcasting standards and the station's license conditions. Some advertisers are running fast in the opposite direction. » www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20656911# |
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| DKS |
to PX Eliezer704
said by PX Eliezer704:Yes, and the prank call was 5:30 AM local time, no switchboard operator at night, so this nurse was the person who initially answered the call and transferred it to the nurse taking care of the Duchess.
A real shame.
No small hospital (this is a "boutique" maternity hospital, remember) has staff on the switchboard 24/7. It would not be unusual for a night staff nurse to answer the telephone. |
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| DKS |
to Hydraglass
said by Hydraglass:Sorry but suicide is almost always the "victim"'s fault. It's selfish. And that is such utter, complete nonsense, it does not even deserve comment. Suicide is usually the result of a pre-existing medical condition and often a co-morbid outcome (cultural factors excepted, which are not at play here). |
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| DKS |
to shaner
said by shaner:It doesn't even need to be any of that. The hospital or royal family gave no indication that they were pissed at her. To me, this sounds like a woman who took deep pride in her duty to the royal family and felt that she had horribly failed them.
Quite right. The responsibility of care in nursing (at least among those who are competent) is every bit as intense as that of a police officer or the military. It's not called a "sisterhood" for nothing. And given that this nurse was a part of a hospital who was serving the Royal Family, she would have to be not only clinically top notch, but epitomize all the values of dedication and commitment which come with nursing quality. Maternity nurses are also a special breed. The best are every bit as intense and professional as ICU or ER nurses. I recall talking with one nurse after a Code Pink call in our hospital. She downplayed her role in the situation, which was life-threatening. "Yes, the little guy just didn't want to do what he needed to do, so we had to help him a little bit." That was it. Very humble. But what they did (and I know this for a fact) was quite remarkable. It saved the child's life. |
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| DKS |
DKS to hm
2012-Dec-9 7:46 am
to hm
said by hm :said by shaner:The hospital or royal family gave no indication that they were pissed at her.
Yes they did. Hospital said she was to be removed from duty and to undergo further training. Hospital stated she wasn't fired though. Evidence? |
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peterboro (banned)Avatars are for posers
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON |
to DKS
said by DKS: No small hospital (this is a "boutique" maternity hospital, remember) has staff on the switchboard 24/7. It would not be unusual for a night staff nurse to answer the telephone. The charge nurse on duty, who may have no or less patients, would be the appropriate person to answer the phone at that time of night. |
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| peterboro |
to DKS
said by DKS: Quite right. The responsibility of care in nursing (at least among those who are competent) is every bit as intense as that of a police officer or the military. It's not called a "sisterhood" for nothing. And given that this nurse was a part of a hospital who was serving the Royal Family, she would have to be not only clinically top notch, but epitomize all the values of dedication and commitment which come with nursing quality. I am also in line with that reasoning. On the other hand I am very curious as to the interaction she had with with administration before she left the hospital. |
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to DKS
The nurse was from India and I believe had been in the UK for only 4 years. Cultural differences and embarrassment likely also played a role. This news story says the radio station [continues] to brag about the prank call. » daily.bhaskar.com/articl ··· NOR.htmlThe radio network CEO also said (in another news story) that there was nothing illegal done. I don't know. In any civilized country if someone calls me and pretends to be someone else (even a regular Elizabeth not Queen Elizabeth) for the purpose of deception, and if they broadcast that deception on the air, then surely that is violating [some] kind of law....laws regulating phone recording if nothing else. In a Commonwealth Realm such as Australia, impersonating the Queen herself may be covered under some additional law, too. |
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said by PX Eliezer704:The nurse was from India and I believe had been in the UK for only 4 years. Cultural differences and embarrassment likely also played a role. 9 years ago and I doubt 'cultural differences' has anything to do with anything. Having the entire world scrutinize a woman's actions is more than likely the primary motivator here... All the latest stories and people interviewed paint a picture of a caring, intelligent, woman who was good at her job and was doing professionally well in London. Family members in India said that she called every Sunday without fail and they just spoke with them a day prior and no issues were mentioned. So far there doesn't seem to be anything that suggests there's an alternative reason for what happened outside of the pressure of this event. |
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said by urbanriot:said by PX Eliezer704:The nurse was from India and I believe had been in the UK for only 4 years. Cultural differences and embarrassment likely also played a role. 9 years ago and I doubt 'cultural differences' has anything to do with anything. Having the entire world scrutinize a woman's actions is more than likely the primary motivator here... All the latest stories and people interviewed paint a picture of a caring, intelligent, woman who was good at her job and was doing professionally well in London. Family members in India said that she called every Sunday without fail and they just spoke with them a day prior and no issues were mentioned. So far there doesn't seem to be anything that suggests there's an alternative reason for what happened outside of the pressure of this event. I hope they have their asses fired and get black listed from ever working in the industry again. |
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 Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON |
to peterboro
said by peterboro:The charge nurse on duty, who may have no or less patients, would be the appropriate person to answer the phone at that time of night. Based on my experience when my son was born a charge nurse at the nursing station was only on duty from 8AM to 8PM. Incoming calls to the ward after hours were handled in the manner exactly described by DKS - any available nurse answered the phone. |
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peterboro (banned)Avatars are for posers
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON |
said by Gone:said by peterboro:The charge nurse on duty, who may have no or less patients, would be the appropriate person to answer the phone at that time of night. Based on my experience when my son was born a charge nurse at the nursing station was only on duty from 8AM to 8PM. Incoming calls to the ward after hours were handled in the manner exactly described by DKS - any available nurse answered the phone. Depending on the unit and size the calls would go to a ward clerk or secretary during the day and a charge nurse again depending on the unit would also be in charge 24/7 concurrently with a manager during the day. |
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Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON |
Gone
Premium Member
2012-Dec-9 3:50 pm
There is no receptionist or clerk who takes calls at the maternity ward at Welland County General. There is one phone number for all of the hospitals in the region and you use an IVR to reach the specific hospital and department you want to call. Once the call comes in any available nurse answers the call as there was no specific person assigned even during the day when the charge nurse was on duty. There was no charge nurse on duty between 8PM and 8AM. If anything happened it was reported to the charge nurse during charting at 8AM during the shift change.
When my wife went into labour we called the hospital prior as we're 45 minutes away and wanted to check with them as to when to come into the hospital. The same nurse who answered the call was the one who tended to us when we arrived, and ended up being one of the nurses who watched our son while he was there sick for two weeks after being born. |
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DKSDamn Kidney Stones
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON |
to peterboro
said by peterboro:said by DKS: No small hospital (this is a "boutique" maternity hospital, remember) has staff on the switchboard 24/7. It would not be unusual for a night staff nurse to answer the telephone. The charge nurse on duty, who may have no or less patients, would be the appropriate person to answer the phone at that time of night. Having observed hospital operation at night on many occasions, that is not always the case. It depends on the hospital. |
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Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON |
Gone
Premium Member
2012-Dec-9 5:59 pm
said by DKS:Having observed hospital operation at night on many occasions, that is not always the case. It depends on the hospital. Exactly. My niece was born at the Civic Hospital in Ottawa earlier today, and seeing as how they have 14 delivery rooms and a massive birthing ward I would expect they would have at least one charge nurse 24/7. At Welland, where there's only three, that is most definitely not the case. |
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peterboro (banned)Avatars are for posers
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON |
NM |
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DKSDamn Kidney Stones
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON |
to Gone
said by Gone:said by DKS:Having observed hospital operation at night on many occasions, that is not always the case. It depends on the hospital. Exactly. My niece was born at the Civic Hospital in Ottawa earlier today, and seeing as how they have 14 delivery rooms and a massive birthing ward I would expect they would have at least one charge nurse 24/7. At Welland, where there's only three, that is most definitely not the case. A hospital the size of Civic would have a 24/7 switchboard. We do here. A smaller hospital, not always. |
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Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON |
Gone
Premium Member
2012-Dec-9 7:25 pm
Fair enough, but when we went to the Civic today the information desk had no staff. I found that quite surprising considering just how big that hospital is, even on a Sunday.
As for back home, NHS no longer has a 24/7 switchboard for any hospitals and it's the largest multi-hospital system in the entire province. You call one number for the entire system and then drill through an IVR menu to get to the hospital and the department you need. If you hit 0 at the right point during regular business hours you would get someone at a central location who would give you information, but it's not 24/7 (I've tried) and the people who answer those calls are all located at the business office in St. Catharines. Once you drill through the menu it would depend on the individual department who answers. I would assume that somewhere like the third or fourth floor of the St. Cats General would have a dedicated staff member to answer the phone 24/7 due to how busy that word is, whereas some departments at Douglas Memorial or Port Colborne General would have the phone ring and ring and ring even in the middle of the day.
Either way, the way the call was handled at King Edward VII isn't exactly out of the ordinary, even for many Canadian hospitals. |
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shaner
Premium Member
join:2000-10-04
Calgary, AB
1 recommendation |
to Warez_Zealot
said by Warez_Zealot:I hope they have their asses fired and get black listed from ever working in the industry again.
Why? For making a prank call? Which is pretty much an industry staple in the morning DJ world? Look, there is absolutely no way these two morons could have predicted this particular outcome. No possible way. Now, I call them morons because, frankly, the original joke simply wasn't funny. But, the joke really had no malicious intent whatsoever, and once again, they never, ever could have envisioned this outcome. And there wouldn't be calls for their heads if this woman had not killed herself. Hey, even the venerable Peter Funt of Candid Camera fame sides with the DJ's. » www.nytimes.com/2012/12/ ··· ml?_r=1&This is a good viewpoint as well. Even Prince Charles initially laughed off the prank and kind of validated it as somewhat amusing. » www.smh.com.au/opinion/s ··· 29q.htmlLook, I think her suicide is the tragedy, not the prank call. I want there to be an honest discussion about mental health issues, and the underlying reasons for suicide and what can be done to prevent these kind of tragedies before they even happen. That is the discussion we should be having, not one about whether these DJ's are criminally responsible for the choice someone else made. Period. If these DJ's are responsible for this poor woman's death, then the sanctimonious crowd needs to step back and think about the times in their lives they may have even snickered at another person's misfortune. Like watching America's Funniest Home Videos for example. This was not a prank gone wrong. This was the management of a mental health issue gone wrong. Frankly, the more I think about it, the very hospital this woman worked for is more culpable in her death than the DJ's are. They had direct involvement with her immediately following the incident and chose to leave her alone instead of supervising her for possible suicidal tendencies. Clearly, they felt the prank was harmless as well, and they are the health professionals. |
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FFH5
Premium Member
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ |
FFH5 to Gone
Premium Member
2012-Dec-9 7:55 pm
to Gone
said by Gone:Fair enough, but when we went to the Civic today the information desk had no staff. I found that quite surprising considering just how big that hospital is, even on a Sunday. Do Canadian hospitals usually have volunteers to help out? In any US hospital I ever visited, there were unpaid volunteers(usually retired people) to do duty at information desks. |
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Gone
Premium Member
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON |
Gone
Premium Member
2012-Dec-9 7:58 pm
said by FFH5:Do Canadian hospitals usually have volunteers to help out? In any US hospital I ever visited, their were unpaid volunteers(usually retired people) to do duty at information desks. Yes. Lots of volunteers at hospitals, though I suspect that they aren't there on a Sunday afternoon. |
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