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bshampine

join:2010-04-08
Gouverneur, NY

Xbox Live And Extreme Internet

Could someone tell me please why I have so much trouble on xbox live no matter what speed tier I use. Ive tried everything from road runner lite just to see if worse internet would make me lag like most people seem to be doing on live and that didnt work. So now ive upgraded to the 30/5 extreme and still having the same problems. Here are my modem signal levels.

Downstream
DCID Freq Power SNR Modulation Octets Correcteds Uncorrectables
Downstream 1 90 549.00 MHz -4.61 dBmV 38.98 dB 256QAM 87044604 3 0
Downstream 2 89 543.00 MHz -4.74 dBmV 38.26 dB 256QAM 86367305 14 0
Downstream 3 91 555.00 MHz -4.50 dBmV 38.26 dB 256QAM 91414669 9 0
Downstream 4 92 561.00 MHz -4.74 dBmV 37.94 dB 256QAM 86440466 2 0
Reset FEC Counters
Upstream
UCID Freq Power Channel Type Symbol Rate Modulation
Upstream 1 1 21.20 MHz 48.75 dBmV DOCSIS1.x (TDMA) 2560 kSym/s 16QAM

Status
System Uptime: 0 d: 2 h: 07 m
Computers Detected: staticCPE(0), dynamicCPE(1)
CM Status: OPERATIONAL
Time and Date: Wed 2012-12-12 12:38:21



freakout9903
Premium
join:2001-04-19
Gastonia, NC

I think it's more an issue of Xbox live having issues. A new black ops and halo came out recently and I've been having issues since.


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to bshampine

Black ops is terrible in general in netcode. You're using a 10 year old game engine designed to work with 56.6k dial up. Are you having problems with anything else.

In general your signals look fine. Are you using their router or yours? What model is your modem?


bshampine

join:2010-04-08
Gouverneur, NY

there gateway which is a arris dg860


bshampine

join:2010-04-08
Gouverneur, NY
reply to bshampine

Also will running a vpn help me out in any other way other then security purposes. Im new to this stuff and people keep mentioning things to try. Thanks


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2

Again, is the issue just with your Xbox and games, or do you have lag/issues elsewhere?

What game(s) are you playing?
What happens exactly (Are you just getting booted from lobbies or are you losing your XBL connection completely, or is it just laggy)?
Are you having connectivity issues on other devices?

The first bit of troubleshooting before ANY VPNs/Proxies or anything like that should be getting your own router and bridging theirs. All in one routers are terrible in general (Not just TWC) and some people have no issues once they have their own.



chamberc
Premium
join:2008-08-05
Irving, TX
reply to bshampine

said by bshampine:

Could someone tell me please why I have so much trouble on xbox live no matter what speed tier I use. Ive tried everything from road runner lite just to see if worse internet would make me lag like most people seem to be doing on live and that didnt work. So now ive upgraded to the 30/5 extreme and still having the same problems. Here are my modem signal levels.

Downstream
DCID Freq Power SNR Modulation Octets Correcteds Uncorrectables
Downstream 1 90 549.00 MHz -4.61 dBmV 38.98 dB 256QAM 87044604 3 0
Downstream 2 89 543.00 MHz -4.74 dBmV 38.26 dB 256QAM 86367305 14 0
Downstream 3 91 555.00 MHz -4.50 dBmV 38.26 dB 256QAM 91414669 9 0
Downstream 4 92 561.00 MHz -4.74 dBmV 37.94 dB 256QAM 86440466 2 0
Reset FEC Counters
Upstream
UCID Freq Power Channel Type Symbol Rate Modulation
Upstream 1 1 21.20 MHz 48.75 dBmV DOCSIS1.x (TDMA) 2560 kSym/s 16QAM

Status
System Uptime: 0 d: 2 h: 07 m
Computers Detected: staticCPE(0), dynamicCPE(1)
CM Status: OPERATIONAL
Time and Date: Wed 2012-12-12 12:38:21

Tracert? What are you hop times?

bshampine

join:2010-04-08
Gouverneur, NY

Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Administrator>tracert www.google.com

Tracing route to www.google.com [173.194.73.106]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to bshampine

Might want to post of the rest of that log, as well as answer the questions above.



Furious bEz
fgclive.com
Premium
join:2003-08-13
Los Angeles, CA

1 edit
reply to bshampine

I too am an avid XBL Gamer... I also recently (finally after 2 years of waiting) upgraded to 30/5. I game and live stream via TwitchTV (FuriousTV) and it's usually only BlackOps 2 (which I dont stream) where lag becomes an issue.

I will be doing some testing this weekend and follow-up on this thread with links to my results.

  • I have the Arris TG862G for Phone Only!
  • I have the Motorola SBG6580 D3 for Internet (however, the Arris is listed by TWC as Internet Equipment also)


I have used my own router in the past, but ever since I have received my D3 SurfBoard all-in-one, I have not been to concerned with bridging. It maybe time to return to using my own router again.

Anyone have suggestions on whether LinkSys/Cisco models are still best for residential use, or should I fork-up the funds for a Cisco or similar business model router???

Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to bshampine

You don't need a business router. Any ~100 router is going to be plenty sufficient.

Unless you OWN the Moto, why do you have two Docsis 3 wireless modems in your house? You can return the Moto and bridge out the Arris and use your own router, or use the wireless on the Arris. I use my own router with a bridged Arris and it works great (Though I hate wireless and have ethernet wires with switches everywhere).

Again, Black Ops II is a horrible game for lag and netcode (Except on the PC which has dedicated servers), so do not use that as a reference for a "poor connection".



Furious bEz
fgclive.com
Premium
join:2003-08-13
Los Angeles, CA

Well, both modems (Arris/Moto) are from TWC and not mines.
I had the Moto originially when D3 was activated. Earlier this year I bundled with Phone and the Arris was sent for Phone.

When I upgraded from 20/2 to 30/5, I was told that the Arris would be (or should be) used for both Internet and Phone, however I asked to keep the Moto bcuz I wasn't sure if I wanted to keep phone services much longer.

Thanks for your reply!
--
Furious Gaming Communityfgclive.com)
A community of league gamers driven by members and proven leaders!


chalieboy

join:2009-11-26
Euclid, OH

The issue is not live and the netcoding, obviously it does affect it but I have been experiencing horrible lag ever since I have had timewarner. Its not like red bar lag, but its lag as in the packets are taking longer than they should to travel, enemies are not were they appear on my screen, etc. I know many people with timewarner that have 0 problems and they even had lower tiers than me and worse modem stats. Theres literally no explanation and I have been trying to figure it out for years. I game everyday and I know the difference between a bad host from peer to peer gaming and when something with the internet is just not right.

EDIT.

I realized our downstream channels are the same and we are having the same issues, coincidence? Maybe


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to Furious bEz

You can still drop the Moto and if you don't want the phone service, drop it off the Arris, and you won't have to have a tech come out. There's no need for the two pieces of equipment.

Again, game examples would be nice as Call of Duty is a terrible example. I will go from having a great connection and doing well, to suddenly having people teleport in front of me and me dying, in the same game, without a host migration. COD is not a good example of trying to find "a good game". Everyone I play with has complaints of having great games on 3 bars and terribly laggy games on 4 bars. This is people in Europe playing with other Europeans, Canadians, Americans, local players, everyone. Call of Duty is a game that is HORRIBLY coded in terms of net code. If you can provide proof somewhere else then I can take the problem seriously. Saying "I lag" in Call of Duty is like saying "I get wet" when taking a shower.



Furious bEz
fgclive.com
Premium
join:2003-08-13
Los Angeles, CA
reply to bshampine

Downstream Bonded Channels
Channel Lock Status Modulation Channel ID Frequency Power SNR Correctables Uncorrectables
1 Locked QAM256 4 687000000 Hz -2.5 dBmV 40.8 dB 455 0
2 Locked QAM256 1 705000000 Hz -2.4 dBmV 40.7 dB 497 5
3 Locked QAM256 2 699000000 Hz -2.4 dBmV 40.1 dB 875 1
4 Locked QAM256 3 693000000 Hz -2.4 dBmV 40.7 dB 127 0

Upstream Bonded Channels
Channel Lock Status US Channel Type Channel ID Symbol Rate Frequency Power
1 Locked TDMA 12 2560 Ksym/sec 35500000 Hz 44.2 dBmV

chalieboy

join:2009-11-26
Euclid, OH
reply to Fleeced

said by Fleeced:

You can still drop the Moto and if you don't want the phone service, drop it off the Arris, and you won't have to have a tech come out. There's no need for the two pieces of equipment.

Again, game examples would be nice as Call of Duty is a terrible example. I will go from having a great connection and doing well, to suddenly having people teleport in front of me and me dying, in the same game, without a host migration. COD is not a good example of trying to find "a good game". Everyone I play with has complaints of having great games on 3 bars and terribly laggy games on 4 bars. This is people in Europe playing with other Europeans, Canadians, Americans, local players, everyone. Call of Duty is a game that is HORRIBLY coded in terms of net code. If you can provide proof somewhere else then I can take the problem seriously. Saying "I lag" in Call of Duty is like saying "I get wet" when taking a shower.

It would be much easier to solve this problem if people would understand that the game is not the problem. Its every single game that is online, dedicated servers or not. Or even when I am host of the game, people are still ahead of me in gametime, and I dont even know how that is possible when im host of the lobby.


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

1 edit

If it's not the game then what is the problem? A host should not be "lagged up" because of other players who can register shots faster to the server when they still have to deal with a minimum of 4ms of latency. Where I come from, it is unacceptable for a host with a ping lower than a millisecond, hosting the server on their own hardware to fail to register a shot faster and turn the tide than someone performing the same move at the same time but registering 20ms later on. If it isn't the lag compensation or network coding causing issues, then what is the problem? In-game Ping (true measurement, not the souped up Bars) is measured by Round Trip Time from the server game packets to the client and back and true game ping is measured by Network latency + processing latency + lag compensation on both the server and client end.

Point being, with the host only having to be concerned about processing latency, either the entire server is being dragged down by a lack of resources or poor optimization, or there's something wrong with the game mode. You've taken Internet latency out of the equation. Being a PC gamer, there are many, and I mean many ways to find out where you're lagging from. You can see your framerate, you can see server and client heartbeats, you can see interpolation and lag compensation times, you can see latency, jitter, loss, and processing times. If you're hosting you can also see the delay between your game client and the server.

Maybe if there were more stupid fast connections like Google Fiber, FiOS, or rock solid DOCSIS 3.0 connections and less shoddy transit around we'll start seeing some tides turning on where the problem is. I highly doubt the problem is in the networks. Take Minecraft as an example of this since it has very bad netcode as known by the community. On a server hosted on a Verizon FiOS connection, I can ping 4ms to the server and can also get throughput that is 100% solid with no loss or jitter. When I join the server, I see chunk loading lag and command delay. Yet, when I go on a connection that is pinging 130ms to the server, filled with jitter and some occasional loss the server is far more responsive and chunks load up faster. A lot of games behave the same way to a lesser extent.


chalieboy

join:2009-11-26
Euclid, OH

Its not the game, plain and simple. I told you that Ive played at multiple friends houses that also have timewarner and the difference is immense. They come over to my house and they are in shock on how bad it is. It doesnt make any sense.



bluepoint

join:2001-03-24
reply to bshampine

Can bandwidth monitor TWC has implemented affect gaming latency?


signmastr

join:2004-06-21
Fallbrook, CA
reply to chalieboy

Call M$ xbox live support. They will blame TW. Call TW they will blame M$. Try to contact Trearch/Activision they won't answer. So where does the blame really lie? I believe M$ has stretched Xbox live far beyond its capabilities. As gamers, we all suffer...


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to bshampine

Have you done any other testing other than with your Xbox? Do you have speed issues on your computer doing speed tests?


bshampine

join:2010-04-08
Gouverneur, NY

No other speed issues but like I've said previously I've went from a 10/1 connection to a docsis 3 30/5 speed tier and having same problems on Xbox like people are dropping me with one shot but it takes sometimes a whole clip no matter if it's COD or RSV2 doesn't matter


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to bshampine

I'm waiting for you to tell me an issue that isn't COD related. I play it and that happens to me as well. Sometimes in the same game.

Let me repeat myself again:

Call of Duty is a terrible game in terms of netcode. It's been getting progressively worse with each iteration, and there's usually major fixes for the lag in the game. So when you have something other than COD having a problem, there might be something to do. Otherwise you can deal with it like the rest of us do.



cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27
reply to bshampine

Questions:
-model xbox (newer slim or older beige/white style)
-clear caches and updates? Re d/l any maps, DLC...
-what else is on your network/lan? just modem then xbox?
-any QoS ? (n/a if you are modem->xbox)
-I assume you did just modem to xbox to isolate any hardware/router?
-Bad router/modem? Can you get a replacement modem?
-change cables? How is wiring? Any DB loss on the coax? any splitters?
-can you isolate the xbox (can a buddy bring their setup over and connect with same issue...isolating the xbox out)?
-did you piss anyone off and getting DDoS (ok, far stretch but hey, someone...well...could send attacks to IP...been done before) Doubtful but throwing stuff out.

I am sure you realize that there are no "servers" with xbox...you host, they all come to you. I've played games with buddy in NZ...I had to lead shots with the global lag. Sad. But when I hosted, he had the lag.

BTW (oh, same with PS3... but since it's free I don't care).
--
Splat


bshampine

join:2010-04-08
Gouverneur, NY

1.) Older XBox
2.) Cleared everything and re downloaded all required maps ect..
3.) Xbox, Laptop, Netgear router.
4.) Tried QoS and didnt really have any luck in that situation neither.
5.) Hardwired into modem which is a arris dg860 ( Gateway ) which ive tried no router and bridge mode with router same issues.
6.) New cable from pole directly to modem.
7.) Brother is having same issue and lives like 3 mins from me.
8.) Yes I believe ive been hit with many DDoS attacks during clan matches id be hosting and booted off xbox live. Which only happends in clan matches against certain people.

Also, ive been researching about proxy servers and vpn's which people are saying if my area is congested this could help my connection out? Please if you can message me and hopefully we can figure out the problem im sick of spending top dollar for high speed internet and getting no where as far as console gaming.

Thanks.



DelmarPip
Premium
join:2011-10-15
Brownsville, TX
reply to bshampine

the answer to your problem is report all cheaters on xbox live


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2

lol. Might as well just give up there.

As for the proxies/VPNs, they're just going to add more hops and more latency to your game. All the free proxies are already slow, and the others you're just going to have to pay for. Just sounds like your party leader is too far away from you and is giving you terrible games. The only time I have where the games are always awesome is when I'm playing with locals against locals. The rest of the games are crapshoots, and when the party leader is further away, it usually means the host is even further than that which results in horrendous games. Do you play any FFA?


chalieboy

join:2009-11-26
Euclid, OH

said by Fleeced:

lol. Might as well just give up there.

As for the proxies/VPNs, they're just going to add more hops and more latency to your game. All the free proxies are already slow, and the others you're just going to have to pay for. Just sounds like your party leader is too far away from you and is giving you terrible games. The only time I have where the games are always awesome is when I'm playing with locals against locals. The rest of the games are crapshoots, and when the party leader is further away, it usually means the host is even further than that which results in horrendous games. Do you play any FFA?

For the last time, ITS NOT THE GAME. How hard is that to understand? Its any game, including games that have dedicated servers or even when I am HOST of the game.

chalieboy

join:2009-11-26
Euclid, OH
reply to bshampine

Id like to add my brothers ps3 has little problems and I know the problem isnt my xbox because I have 2 xboxes and my buddy has also brought his xbox to my house while i brought mine to his house and it was fine.


Fleeced

join:2012-10-06
kudos:2
reply to bshampine

With all that said, you don't have any issues with any of your computers or anything except for your XBox.

You have yet to describe anything other than what most people experience when playing Call Of Duty. I know and play with people who have Comcast, Cox, FIOS, DSL Hughesnet and other services that have the exact same problem as you. Some have the problem and their neighbors don't, but they play with different people. I get host and the game explodes on me and kicks me out and breaks up my party. When I do get into the game with host it's sometimes laggy and sometimes not. Host does not make a difference here. It is your communication with the game server that is the problem.

The only thing that may help the OP is getting his own router and bridging the modem. It's not your service.