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not quite right
I'm not cool enough to be a Mac person

join:2001-06-23
Puyallup, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Comcast
reply to jeckler

Re: [iPhone] Woman tasered after trying to buy too many iPhones

said by jeckler:

From the print story...

quote:
The policy continues, "The weapon is a level of force normally required to overcome passive, defensive, or offensive resistance that is intended as an act of overt aggression toward the officer where an individual refuses to comply with verbal instructions."
You lay down, you can be tasered, you attack, you can be tasered, you defend yourself from being tasered (a natural response IMO), you can be tasered.
Can't win.

How about not putting yourself in the position to be tazed?
Think about it, you have to be seriously breaking company policy for a retailer to refuse to take your money, and show you the door.
--
Not many people know this, but I happen to be quite famous...


not

@comcast.net

Maybe she shouldn't have said who they were for. It's XMas time... who cares who it's for. They don't usually ask, but if they do, they're XMas presents for my family and friends. And no, you may not ask further details as it's a breach of my privacy and the info is confidential.

Apple does not have the right to question you about your private affairs. However, you have to be smart enough to keep your mouth shut and know how to respond in a calm and normal manner. Act a fool and you'll be treated like a fool.



Cheese
Premium
join:2003-10-26
Naples, FL
kudos:1

1 recommendation

She shouldn't have to explain jack squat, they should be happy people are BUYING the shit to begin with.



fonzbear2000
Premium
join:2005-08-09
Saint Paul, MN
reply to HiVolt

said by HiVolt:

said by fonzbear2000:

Once she has purchased the phones, she has any right to do whatever she wants with them. If I want to go and buy 50 unlocked iPhones, I should be able too! Why should Apple care what I do with them after I buy them? Because she's Chinese, they think she's going to sell them on the black market? That's complete racial discrimination! I hope she sues Apple big time!

You can't send them to countries with an economic sanctions, such as Iran, Cuba, etc...

And it's not racism, its realism, especially if you dont know how huge the black market is in China for Apple stuff. And Apple only officially released the iPhone5 in China this past week, and you have to be picked in a lottery in order to get one...

Sure you can't, but why should Apple care what she does with them AFTER she has bought them?

It's racism. Because she's Chinese, Apple automatically assumes she's going to send them to China which makes Apple racist.
--
»A pretty good alernative to bit torrent and newsgroups


haroldo

join:2004-01-16
united state
kudos:1

1 edit

1 recommendation

said by fonzbear2000:

...
It's racism. Because she's Chinese, Apple automatically assumes she's going to send them to China which makes Apple racist.

(two can play that game)...It's racism, because she's Chinese you automatically assumed she was denied and ultimately arrested based on her race (not her activities).

Is it possible she was unruly, disruptive and a public nuisance?

I'm okay if this post gets hey modded and removed


NOCMan
MacChatter
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Colorado Springs, CO

1 recommendation

reply to haroldo

Yeah and 10 years ago they would of just manhandled her down, today cops use tasers as cattle sticks to force compliance.


gateguy
Premium
join:2001-02-12
Reisterstown, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to haroldo

said by haroldo:

She was requested to leave the store

In English, the report says that she only speaks Chinese. So, how is she supposed to be able to understand the "peace officers" request.

Imagine you visit France (or some other country where YOU dont know the language) and the police start talking to you. Then you get tazered for not complying.
--
Time for a new message.


haroldo

join:2004-01-16
united state
kudos:1

said by gateguy:

said by haroldo:

She was requested to leave the store

In English, the report says that she only speaks Chinese. So, how is she supposed to be able to understand the "peace officers" request.

Imagine you visit France (or some other country where YOU dont know the language) and the police start talking to you. Then you get tazered for not complying.

give me a break. You're telling me that if an armed and uniformed officer of the law approaches you...after an altercation and a problem you had with a merchant...and you didn't understand the native language, you won't be able to understand their gestures and request?
I don't speak Russian, but if i were in Moscow and police officer was called as a result of my behavior and gestured to me, you bet your arse that I'd remain calm and do what ever I could to comply.
I know where all being theoretical here, but do you really believe there is one grown woman on the face of the planet who doesn't understand what a police uniform in a civil society represents?
Really?

gateguy
Premium
join:2001-02-12
Reisterstown, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

You are making the assumption she understood that it was an altercation.

You are making the assumption she understood that she was being asked to leave.

You are making the assumption the "peace officer" was not overly aggressive. You know the type, do what I say now or else.

You are making quite a few assumptions.

Per the video, she does not speak English.

And yes I do not believe there is one grown woman on the face of the planet who doesn't understand what a police uniform in a civil society represents?

But what the officer represents and what he is trying to communicate are two very different things.
--
Time for a new message.



skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

1 recommendation

You have a responsibility to have a fundamental ability to communicate when you are visiting another country. When I go to Japan, I have translation software for Kanji and an ability to communicate. I wouldn't go to China unless I took a few week course in Chinese for travelers AND carry a translation device, which if she can be buying a half dozen iPhones, she could also buy.

Chinese understand "No" in English and would understand gestures to leave. She obviously was able to communicate enough to buy iPhones the previous week and come back requesting more.

No would be the clue to simply leave not start arguing with the store's manager.

I'll make the assumption that she got irate when not permitted to buy the extra phones that are certainly not for her "family" and got even more irate when asked to leave then even more irate when the police asked her to leave and resisted when she was finally placed under arrest for refusing to leave.

Cops don't want to arrest people, especially in a mall. It's a pain in the ass and a bunch of extra work when they can get the same money for standing around bullshitting. She isn't going to be arrested unless she is arguing with the police instead of simply walking away.


watice

join:2008-11-01
New York, NY
reply to gateguy

Generally, when you fall to the ground yelling, it means you're not leaving. That's refusal to comply, not a language barrier. She was tased for that reason. You're making the assumption that this took place in a court of law, and you were her defense attorney.


gateguy
Premium
join:2001-02-12
Reisterstown, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by watice:

Generally, when you fall to the ground yelling, it means you're not leaving. That's refusal to comply, not a language barrier. She was tased for that reason. You're making the assumption that this took place in a court of law, and you were her defense attorney.

I have seen this video 5 times now. At no point in the supplied video is it stated that she was on the ground yelling before she was asked to leave.

Do you have a source other than the video to back up your claim?

Otherwise, your statement "She was tased for that reason" is erroneous.

I am making no assumptions, I am watching the video. What are you watching and reading to come up with such a different viewpoint.
--
Time for a new message.


haroldo

join:2004-01-16
united state
kudos:1

1 edit

The video didn't show what happened to precipitate the use of the taser. As such it does not show a true picture of the events, it's merely a cut and paste to make the story look bad for the police (and the evil profit seeking corporation)



Brendan
Warr Guitar is here

join:2000-07-14
Littleton, CO
reply to KeepOnRockin

Welcome to the Police States of America. This is only the beginning. Once the economy finishes collapsing, armored personnel vehicles will be rolling down Main Street, and we'll all be wishing for the "good ol' days" of the 1990s and 2000s.

Then, we'll have real problems.
--
"Heaven is having an American salary, a Chinese cook, an English house, and a Japanese wife. Hell is having a Chinese salary, an English cook, a Japanese house, and an American wife." -- James H. Kabbler III



dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
reply to gateguy

said by gateguy:

You are making the assumption she understood that it was an altercation.

you are making the assumption she doesn't speak or understand English.

from my 2 decades of experience in retail, many "foreign" people play the "don't speak English" card, despite actually being able to speak it or at least understand it, when it benefits them...the article stated she had already been there a couple of days prior to purchase some phones, so if she can't speak or understand English, how on Earth did she make that purchase to begin with??...point to an iPhone on the counter, show 2 fingers (for quantity of 2) and hand over a credit card??...come on.
--
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

- George Orwell


not quite right
I'm not cool enough to be a Mac person

join:2001-06-23
Puyallup, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Comcast

said by dirtyjeffer:

said by gateguy:

You are making the assumption she understood that it was an altercation.

you are making the assumption she doesn't speak or understand English.

from my 2 decades of experience in retail, many "foreign" people play the "don't speak English" card, despite actually being able to speak it or at least understand it, when it benefits them...

I hate to say it, but when I worked retail I found this to be true as well. It was simply amazing how quickly they learned english when something had rang up wrong on their receipt LOL!
--
Not many people know this, but I happen to be quite famous...

gateguy
Premium
join:2001-02-12
Reisterstown, MD
reply to dirtyjeffer

I am making no assumption.

In the video the daughter clearly states that her mother speaks no English.
--
Time for a new message.



skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2

Credible witness right there...no way she would be covering for her.
--
In a nation of spoiled children, Santa Claus always wins.



Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1
reply to KeepOnRockin

Generally speaking I don't like making decision or coming to conclusions without knowing the full story. However, people often never get the full story.

I will say this though:

I was in US military service for nearly 10 years. In that time I had more then one military occupational specialty (MOS). Riot control training / civil disturbance training was almost annual and I was trained by military police officers and on a few occasions civilian officers gave insight to their tactics.

Having two male officers unable to remove this woman from the store without the use of a taser seems somewhat suspect IMO. I won't err on the side of police or the 48 yr old woman without knowing more and to do so IMO would be anything but impartial.

I do want to make one thing very clear though. Partial video can be indicative of wrong doing. Sometimes it doesn't matter what happened before because what happened after cannot be justified. I'm not saying this is the case here though.

I think it's unwise to say the least for people to write a blank check in their mind to allow law enforcement to do whatever they want to whomever they want. This is a high point of ignorance IMO.


gateguy
Premium
join:2001-02-12
Reisterstown, MD
reply to skeechan

The same could be said of the police chief. No way he would be covering for his officers.
--
Time for a new message.



skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit

Which is why it should be looked at logically. Why would two officers who have a cush assignment generate a ton of work for themselves? They wouldn't without reason. Occam's razor. She got pissed when she couldn't get the phones because it meant tons of lost black market money. She threw a fit in the store and then mouthed off to the cops to the point she was arrested at which time she resisted and got tazed.

And I know many Chinese, including non-English speakers and all of them would understand "no" and indications to leave the store. And more importantly all of them know not to lip off or otherwise argue with police. If they point and tell them to leave...even if it is in Pig Latin, they'll leave.

--
In a nation of spoiled children, Santa Claus always wins.

Expand your moderator at work