 fuziwuziNot born yesterdayPremium
join:2005-07-01
Atlanta, GA | reply to La Luna
Re: Anonymous Hacks Westboro Baptist Church web site said by La Luna:I think you would be hard pressed to find any true Christians who approve of Westboro's despicable tactics. They are an anomaly.
They claim to be the "true christians" and everyone else is "fake". So, who are we (non-christians) to believe? Every one of the 217+ recognized denominations of christian churches claims to be the only correct one.
Saying that one nonsense is more correct than another nonsense is, well, nonsense. 
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 ArchivisYour DaddyPremium
join:2001-11-26
Earth
kudos:18 | reply to La Luna
Re: Anonymous Hacks Westboro Baptist Church web site said by La Luna:I think you would be hard pressed to find any true Christians
Fixed. |
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 SteveI know your IP addressConsultant
join:2001-03-10
Yorba Linda, CA
kudos:5
1 edit | reply to EGeezer
said by EGeezer:it's unfortunate how many people in our supposedly tolerant American society use religion to spread fear, hate and bigotry in the name of the Christian religion based on love, compassion, forgiveness and redemption. Westboro Baptist Church is not a bad church; they are not a church at all; they are a law firm posing as a church.
They are trying to bait people - especially local governments - from restricting their "rights" where they can sue for damages under religious discrimination. The "church" is made up almost entirely by the Phelps family, many of whom work at the Phelps Law Firm.
They're just disgusting human beings, and any attempts to discredit their "religious beliefs" is giving them the benefit of the doubt.
Steve
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Stephen J. Friedl | Unix Wizard | Security Consultant | Orange County, California USA | my web site |
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 bTU
join:2009-04-22
Aurora, CO | The sued people from the local Patriot Guard Riders for infringement of their civil liberties. We counter protested them by using our bikes to block their view of a military funeral motorcade and revved our engines so no one could hear their hate speech. |
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 kingdome74Emotionally UnavailablePremium
join:2002-03-27
Syracuse, NY
kudos:3
 ·Verizon FiOS
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to trparky
Here's where this debate goes off the rails - this church doesn't break any laws. Instead they use them to their advantage no different than someone uses the tax code to theirs. Breaking the law - especially laws that protect speech - is the complete usurping of what we're supposed to be all about. As much as we despise these folks - I've had my own run in with them at a military funeral up here - as long as they break no laws they have every right afforded to them granted in the Constitution and as such should be free from vigilante justice. I always wonder how the same people who yell about their rights being taken from them are the first to take them from others.
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Stayed #4. Next up on 12/15 Canisius. Nassib was named All-American over Bridgewater in Pro Football Weekly. Grats Ryan! |
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ArchivisYour DaddyPremium
join:2001-11-26
Earth
kudos:18
1 edit | A person who bases their morality around whatever the laws are, is not a moral person at all. |
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 KrisnatharokCaveat EmptorPremium
join:2009-02-11
Earth Orbit
kudos:7 | And yet how many people say "it's legal, so I'm not doing anything wrong" (regarding tax loopholes, etc.). |
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ArchivisYour DaddyPremium
join:2001-11-26
Earth
kudos:18 | Yep. Something doesn't have to be illegal for it to be wrong. Also, just because something is illegal, doesn't mean it's wrong either.
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A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have. -MLK |
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KrisnatharokCaveat EmptorPremium
join:2009-02-11
Earth Orbit
kudos:7 | Well of course. Well-constructed laws make illegal what is already immoral (or exist for order and the common good--i.e. speed limits), but there are legal--but immoral--acts, as much as there are illegal--but moral--acts (or put another way, it would be immoral if you didn't act by breaking the law).
But as a society, we have a hard time agreeing on what is immoral and should be made illegal.
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If we lose this freedom of ours, history will record with the greatest astonishment, those who had the most to lose, did the least to prevent its happening. |
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 BlackbirdBuilt for SpeedPremium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3
 ·Frontier Communi..
| reply to trparky
The problem arises from confusing "moral" with "legal". Laws may (and usually do) reflect a culture's consensus standards of morality, but not all morality is reflected in laws. And not all laws, as written, necessarily are moral statements. In the end, morality is an individual perception that may or may not concur with one's neighbors' views of morals, but laws are general, public pronouncements of specific things that are or are not allowed.
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“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville |
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 La LunaSurvived AshrafulPremium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
kudos:3 | reply to Archivis
said by Archivis:said by La Luna:I think you would be hard pressed to find any true Christians
Fixed. Nope. My statement stands. But I'm not going to get into a debate about religion. Westboro is wrong. Period. Any thinking, rational human wouldn't do what they do. Their deeds speak louder than their words.
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The Alien in the White House
20,085 DEADLY TERROR ATTACKS SINCE 9/11 |
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kingdome74Emotionally UnavailablePremium
join:2002-03-27
Syracuse, NY
kudos:3 Reviews:
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| said by La Luna:Westboro is wrong. Period. Any thinking, rational human wouldn't do what they do. Their deeds speak louder than their words.
While that may be true I think you'd agree with me that they still deserve the same right to freely express their views as you and I do. As we know people have the right to freely express their stupidity. We certainly see enough of that every day.
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Stayed #4. Next up on 12/15 Canisius. Nassib was named All-American over Bridgewater in Pro Football Weekly. Grats Ryan! |
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BlackbirdBuilt for SpeedPremium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
| reply to trparky
Caution: don't make Westboro's actions anything about religious belief. What Steve posted earlier about what is going on is true: this is, as it's always been in similar cases, about setting up public confrontations involving outrageous picketing in order to stimulate lawsuits over "free speech" rights. That is, it's about the money. Over and over again.
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“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville |
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 scelliNative New YorkerPremium
join:1999-08-07
FLOT/FEBA
kudos:1 | reply to La Luna
said by La Luna:said by Archivis:said by La Luna:I think you would be hard pressed to find any true Christians
Fixed. Nope. My statement stands. But I'm not going to get into a debate about religion. Westboro is wrong. Period. Any thinking, rational human wouldn't do what they do. Their deeds speak louder than their words. Seconded, La Luna!
In addition:: The childish editing of comments to reflect different viewpoints than what the original poster intended has long ago worn out its welcome. 
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The maximum effective range of an excuse is ZERO meters! |
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La LunaSurvived AshrafulPremium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
kudos:3
1 edit | reply to kingdome74
said by kingdome74:said by La Luna:Westboro is wrong. Period. Any thinking, rational human wouldn't do what they do. Their deeds speak louder than their words.
While that may be true I think you'd agree with me that they still deserve the same right to freely express their views as you and I do. As we know people have the right to freely express their stupidity. We certainly see enough of that every day. They have the right, but others also have the right to THEIR privacy. Westboro doesn't (or shouldn't) have the right to force their skewed beliefs (which are all about making $ anyway) onto others, especially in times of grief. That only proves they are hoping to get sued sue to try and make $ and are falsely using "religion" as an excuse.
"Rights" work both ways. You have the right to say it and I have the right to tell you to take a hike, get lost, I don't want to hear it, and you should abide by that. That's the part Westboro purposely ignores in their quest to pad their bank account.
Edit: corrected context
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The Alien in the White House
20,085 DEADLY TERROR ATTACKS SINCE 9/11 |
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kingdome74Emotionally UnavailablePremium
join:2002-03-27
Syracuse, NY
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
·RoadRunner Cable
| True, true but was there anything illegal about their website and was there any legal ground for the hacking thereof? WBC follows the laws that they are faced with when they come to town. Every town/city can make their own laws regarding their ability to protest anywhere near where the people are grieving. Even the ACLU has begrudgingly given them some support. Beyond that I think it's pretty cowardly hide behind a keyboard. I guess from what I'm reading in a security forum if I don't like a something I can hack without regard to the laws because I have "right" on my side. Why do people bitch when they get their World of Warcraft account hacked? It's the same thing. Either way it's illegal.
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Stayed #4. Next up on 12/15 Canisius. Nassib was named All-American over Bridgewater in Pro Football Weekly. Grats Ryan! |
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 NormanSPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:9 | reply to fuziwuzi
said by fuziwuzi:Every one of the 217+ recognized denominations of christian churches claims to be the only correct one.
Oh, wait. Just foolish hyperbole. No need to ask foolish question in response.
Saying that one nonsense is more correct than another nonsense is, well, nonsense.
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Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum |
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ArchivisYour DaddyPremium
join:2001-11-26
Earth
kudos:18 | said by NormanS:More nonsense! Sure is a lot of nonsense in this thread today!
It sure is. Everyone wants to debate about which version of fiction is the truest form of fiction.
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A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have. -MLK |
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 HankSearching for a new FrontierPremium
join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV
kudos:1 | said by Archivis:said by NormanS:More nonsense! Sure is a lot of nonsense in this thread today!
It sure is. Everyone wants to debate about which version of fiction is the truest form of fiction. So if it was something, like atheist or Islam, it would be true in your eyes? |
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