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eots
join:2003-02-04

eots to elitefx

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to elitefx

Re: Well written article about TSI and the copyright deal

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info. Anyone can collect IP addresses and file a request for a court order to access private customer info without requiring any proof that they have a valid claim. The burden of proof needs to be on the plaintiff. Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.
The Mongoose
join:2010-01-05
Toronto, ON

The Mongoose

Member

Courts can order the information released regardless of whether the case is civil or criminal. TekSavvy has made it very clear they will never release such information without a court order, but if the court order is issued of course they're going to comply with it. They're not going to break the law.
bt
join:2009-02-26
canada

bt to eots

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to eots
said by eots:

Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

That's not how the law works, though. Fact is, they are required to turn it over if there is a court order. It doesn't matter if it's a civil or criminal case.

eots
join:2003-02-04

eots

Member

said by bt:

said by eots:

Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

That's not how the law works, though. Fact is, they are required to turn it over if there is a court order. It doesn't matter if it's a civil or criminal case.

I'm just saying TSI should oppose the release of customer information in civil matters. The courts should also require the plaintiff to prove their claim is legitimate before they order any release of private information. In this case it's pretty clear the plaintiff is not legit.

Tx
bronx cheers from cheap seats
Premium Member
join:2008-11-19
Mississauga, ON

1 edit

Tx

Premium Member

said by eots:

said by bt:

said by eots:

Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

That's not how the law works, though. Fact is, they are required to turn it over if there is a court order. It doesn't matter if it's a civil or criminal case.

I'm just saying TSI should oppose the release of customer information in civil matters. The courts should also require the plaintiff to prove their claim is legitimate before they order any release of private information. In this case it's pretty clear the plaintiff is not legit.

Considering Voltages reputation for this. They have already basically stopped filming and decided it's a better revenue stream to go after people. Toss a shit film online, let the internet swallow it and bring it a better revenue then the film would have made in theaters... especially coming from them.

Then i see shit like this happening...
This is how it's going to be in the future...

Voltage: Hey Marc, how was the ball game?
Marc: good, 6-1 we lost
Voltage: Got a list of IPs here
Marc: Happen to have the court papers so i can hand it over
Voltage: Yup, judge didn't even look it over, just signed it
Marc: here and don't forget about the game on saturday
Voltage: see you again next month bud

Obviously not exactly like that, i'm being rather over the top but words that come to mouth are "floodgates"
said by KPaul:

Lot's of non-Canadians seem to be angry too

»torrentfreak.com/canadia ··· -121218/

Seems a lot of people non-canadian and canadian are pretty furious at Marc's decision to stand back and wash his hands clean of it. I usually ignore reading the comments on TorrentFreak but wow, a lot of idiots on there but a lot of valid points.
funny0
join:2010-12-22

funny0 to eots

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to eots
said by eots:

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info. Anyone can collect IP addresses and file a request for a court order to access private customer info without requiring any proof that they have a valid claim. The burden of proof needs to be on the plaintiff. Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

tell me how seeing someones ip address in batch of others equates to commerical gain for that ip address?

haha ....
resa1983
Premium Member
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON

1 recommendation

resa1983

Premium Member

said by funny0:

said by eots:

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info. Anyone can collect IP addresses and file a request for a court order to access private customer info without requiring any proof that they have a valid claim. The burden of proof needs to be on the plaintiff. Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

tell me how seeing someones ip address in batch of others equates to commerical gain for that ip address?

haha ....

They've done that so they can attempt to sue for statutory damages..

If THEY sue for non-commercial, they give up statutory damages, and then any infringement of OTHERS' copyrighted works done before Voltage's filing automatically waives statutory damages as well.

They're leaving the door open for other suits by others against Teksavvy customers.

erfans
join:2008-10-10
Canada

erfans to eots

Member

to eots
said by eots:

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info. Anyone can collect IP addresses and file a request for a court order to access private customer info without requiring any proof that they have a valid claim. The burden of proof needs to be on the plaintiff. Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

Exactly!

QuantumPimp
join:2012-02-19

QuantumPimp

Member

Well before taking any action against TekSavvy I need to hear more public discussion of the law. I am particularly confused if any laws compel or even allow an ISP to ensure the privacy of their customers when that privacy is challenged vs they ought not to be a safe harbor behind which customers can hide.
funny0
join:2010-12-22

funny0 to resa1983

Member

to resa1983
said by resa1983:

said by funny0:

said by eots:

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info. Anyone can collect IP addresses and file a request for a court order to access private customer info without requiring any proof that they have a valid claim. The burden of proof needs to be on the plaintiff. Teksavvy should only be required to provide customer info to law enforcement under a court order, not to any joe blow in a civil matter.

tell me how seeing someones ip address in batch of others equates to commerical gain for that ip address?

haha ....

They've done that so they can attempt to sue for statutory damages..

If THEY sue for non-commercial, they give up statutory damages, and then any infringement of OTHERS' copyrighted works done before Voltage's filing automatically waives statutory damages as well.

They're leaving the door open for other suits by others against Teksavvy customers.

NO they haven't Show me where they PROVED BEYOND A RESONABLE DOUBT that they showed that commercial gain was had by any of the ip addresses YOU CANT
and thats part im talking about....voltage screwed up they are trying to use the new law in the wrong way...and it don't take a lawyer to know this...geist himself even mentioned it...

this isn't the trial NOR a hearing on evidence YET before any evidence is pruned OR discovered properly other then some list of ips your saying it equates to commercial infringement?

HOW does an Apache Web Server log at a church full of ip addresses then differ from a bit torrent swarm list....in your opinion it doesn't and both equate to some weird notion of commercial use?
NO your utterly wrong and if you want to press the issue put up some intellectual property pm me ill dl it without permission and you can try and sue me for commercial copyright infringement ....i wish i was part of this case and perhaps ill file like cippic to make sure this issue is brought up.

Ya see dear sir the new law makes it quite clear there are two variations of infringement commercial and NON commercial.

a kid downloading a music tune is not the same as one selling the tune on a dvdr at a street corner....
ONE does real harm the other does far far less.

feel free to look up what commercial means ...one you read it your gonna go back to your voltage company and realize you filed wrong....and that it wont be worth the time and money to file this type a suit as NON commercial.THAT also allows every poor person legal aid...

and waiving those what rights? they don't have the right to waive statutory damages in the way you think...this isn't the broke states of america buddy. THE law is clear the max i can get for all infringements for non commercial infringement is 5000 dollars...

Believe you me you never will get 5000 for a single or a few movies either..so go on keep paying those troll lawyers lets see whom the scum bag lawyers are in Canada so we can look at deporting economic terrorists.

DarkStar33
join:2008-03-27
Toronto, ON

DarkStar33 to eots

Member

to eots
said by eots:

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info.

Yes, they have the business to lose. If the court says "give us that data" and you say "no" they dont just go away.

They come seize your shit and put your management in cuffs.

Good plan....

eots
join:2003-02-04

eots

Member

said by DarkStar33:

said by eots:

I think Teksavvy stands to lose a lot of customers over this if they hand over customer info.

Yes, they have the business to lose. If the court says "give us that data" and you say "no" they dont just go away.

They come seize your shit and put your management in cuffs.

Good plan....

Voltage can't seize Teksavvy's servers or have them arrested, this is not a criminal matter, it's civil and you've completely taken my comment out of context. I'm just saying Teksavvy will lose customers by not opposing Voltages request for a court order and handing over private info if the court order is granted. Everyone including Teksavvy knows full well that Voltage is just abusing the law to extort money out of customers and Teksavvy is aiding them with this by not opposing their request. 2000 customers is a lot of business to lose, not to mention collateral damage by losing other customers who feel their personal info is up for grabs to anyone who wants to file a court order and Marc won't oppose it and will just hand it over without question.