dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
1427
share rss forum feed


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to Robrr

Re: RIM Earnings Out, Stock Surges

The variable resolution means that developers of regular applications can't count on pixel-accurate positioning, for one thing. It's true that things like GPU performance and amount of RAM aren't nearly as relevant for a non-intensive app.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org



CanadianRip

join:2009-07-15
Oakville, ON

said by Guspaz:

The variable resolution means that developers of regular applications can't count on pixel-accurate positioning, for one thing. It's true that things like GPU performance and amount of RAM aren't nearly as relevant for a non-intensive app.

Yes but there's ways to work around pixel-accurate displays for the majority of applications. There's almost always a component that can consigned to the realm of variability in display. Whether its a view, listbox, or whatever object. It's more work, but you can target 90+% of the displays with minimal artwork and effort.

Think of what a web-developer faces, the challenge in comparison is fairly pale.

komal

join:2003-02-16
reply to Robrr

Wanted to add that RIM shares are down 20% today.

1 day.


komal

join:2003-02-16
reply to CanadianRip

said by CanadianRip:

said by Guspaz:

The iPad Mini is selling like gangbusters, stealing back a lot of lost marketshare for Apple. I think their general lack of software innovation is going to hurt them in the mid-term if not addressed soon, but I don't think the iPad Mini has anything to do with that.

The problem here is innovating as one, versus an entire giant group of people. Everyone yaks about "Fragmentation" like it's a bad thing.
Flip the word to diversity; which means the same thing. Now you realize it's actually an advantage. If you allow innovators to do what they want with minimal disruption and intervention - that's a good thing.

This is why the PC dominated for decades - it was the easiest platform to get done what you wanted! Want to build an Air Traffic Control system, no problem you're free to do with the hardware/software as you please.

Can't say the same about any platform other then Android at the moment.

When discussing Android, fragmentation refers to software and not hardware, because after all, Android is software, not hardware.

The PC was about having hardware for which anybody could write the software. It could run Linux, Unix, Windows etc.

Android devices run Android. End of story.

Fragmentation is a problem because of the jump in features available with Android 4.0. Developers wanting to incorporate those features ended up making apps incompatible with older versions of Android, the still popular and present Gingerbread (2.3).

It is similar to the problem Microsoft had with IE 6. People were too reluctant or slow to switch and that made developing web apps more difficult.

Similarly, people developing apps for ICS aren't able to sell those apps to Gingerbread users unless they go to lengths to make them compatible or have a different version.

That means Android developers can't make 1 app and sell to everybody. Gingerbread still has significant market share.

iPhone devs on the other hand can easily develop 1 application and sell to all iPhone users except for those whose handsets are outdated and no longer get updates, but by that point those users will be able to upgrade as their contracts expire.

That means developers have an incentive to develop for iPhone over Android.

This isn't such an issue now because most phones released over the past couple of years have been released with ICS or upgraded to ICS, but the next time there is a big update and new features, this fragmentation will become a huge issue all over again.


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable

said by komal:

Fragmentation is a problem because of the jump in features available with Android 4.0. Developers wanting to incorporate those features ended up making apps incompatible with older versions of Android, the still popular and present Gingerbread (2.3).

Even with same release version the same manufacturer of various devices does not offer a consistent experience.

Samsung, for example, has different menu options on the same exact release version between different phones and tablets, so you can't write a procedural enterprise document to guide users to complete the same tasks they can easily complete with their iPhone's or Blackberrys.

It's bad enough every manufacturer can do things differently but the same manufacturer's aren't consistent. An annoyance for documentation.

I'm also starting to hear regular user's using "Android" and "Samsung" interchangeably.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

said by urbanriot:

Samsung, for example, has different menu options on the same exact release version between different phones and tablets, so you can't write a procedural enterprise document to guide users to complete the same tasks they can easily complete with their iPhone's or Blackberrys.

That's because Samsung has their own version of TouchWiz as a home screen replacement app. In an enterprise environment you could install the default Android OS launcher and then find a way to lock it down if it really became that big of an issue. When there's a will, there's a way.

said by urbanriot:

I'm also starting to hear regular user's using "Android" and "Samsung" interchangeably.

Haha, like the way people annoyingly use Mac and Apple interchangeably, no doubt.


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to Robrr

To be fair to those people, Samsung is the only relevant manufacturer of Android handsets anyhow. After all they're the only one making any money doing it (assuming the 99% of profit in smartphone market being made by Apple and Samsung thing is still true). I guess you could argue that LG is going to get some relevance for the Nexus 4.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org



kingb71

join:2000-10-09
Mississauga, ON
reply to Robrr

RIMM Selloff: Justified?
»market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=215184



urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable
reply to Gone

said by Gone:

Haha, like the way people annoyingly use Mac and Apple interchangeably, no doubt.

I'm guilty of that... although to be fair to myself, I realize I'm stupid and make a correction immediately thereafter.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

said by urbanriot:

I'm guilty of that... although to be fair to myself, I realize I'm stupid and make a correction immediately thereafter.

I can tolerate calling the computers Apple far more than I can calling the company Mac, which happens far more than people would ever think it does.


koira
Keep Fighting Michael
Premium
join:2004-02-16
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

said by Gone:

said by urbanriot:

I'm guilty of that... although to be fair to myself, I realize I'm stupid and make a correction immediately thereafter.

I can tolerate calling the computers Apple far more than I can calling the company Mac, which happens far more than people would ever think it does.

let me test for understanding. Is it okay to call my powermac g5 a mac? And it's not okay to call my ipod a mac?


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to Robrr

It's perfectly fine to call an Apple Macintosh an Apple, because it is; it's an Apple computer. This is the same as calling your Camry a Toyota. That sort of thing is common.

Calling the company Mac, though, is just bizarre and wrong. You don't say "The Hilux company makes good cars", because that's just confusingly wrong.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org



dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
reply to komal

said by komal:

I hope you're joking when you say that, because stock price doesn't indicate value of a company, market cap does.

If thats how you compare companies, you're going to lose a lot of money...

i realize that...so lets use market cap...RIM's market cap is just over $5 Billion...Apple's is just under $500 Billion.
--
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

- George Orwell


CanadianRip

join:2009-07-15
Oakville, ON

1 edit
reply to komal

said by komal:

When discussing Android, fragmentation refers to software and not hardware, because after all, Android is software, not hardware.

It refers to both. The exact same thing happened in the PC era with vendors putting skins over-top of DOS and Windows.

Android is a base OS with a set of utilities on top of it, no different then Windows was. In the mobile world those base utilities have morphed to fit the implementation metaphor - nothing more nothing less.

I recall these exact same discussions occurring among peers in the days of OS/2 Warp. At the time I was in the banking industry and everyone in it thought that Warp was going to be the ways thing went due to its superior architectural design. In fact it had everything going for it - well except for the fact that there wasn't critical mass.

In the end we ended up with Windows and its fragmentation. There was driver issues, and absurd skins including Microsoft's own "Bob" product which I think they've effectively written out of the history books.

What endured is that it was open enough to get done what you had to. Whatever your single purpose was, with all the different "fragments" of Windows hardware and software you could find a suitable fit for your particular use case.

That fragmentation led to competition, innovation, and some products ranging from fantastic to abysmal. This is a good thing, because seriously I was bored at IPhone 3. I don't know if I could take IPhone 8, there's only so much of rehashing the same thing for $ 700 one can stomach.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to Guspaz

said by Guspaz:

It's perfectly fine to call an Apple Macintosh an Apple, because it is; it's an Apple computer.

No, an "Apple computer" is a the name of a line of long-discontinued computers, the last of which was the Apple IIgs that was discontinued in 1992. The computer product sold now is called Macintosh, shortened to Mac.

Do you call your iPad or your iPhone an "Apple" ?

Warez_Zealot

join:2006-04-19
Vancouver
reply to komal

said by komal:

Wanted to add that RIM shares are down 20% today.

1 day.

LOL, yeah. The funny thing is that I sold my companies shares yesterday to buy RIM, and they were just bought out today!!! (WTF!!!) I basically lost out in a 30% jump in share price, and RIM is down!!!! lol Luckily it wasn't much money, but I have to laugh.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

If you didn't know that your own company was being bought out... well... haha, what else is there to say?


Warez_Zealot

join:2006-04-19
Vancouver

Exactly. The stock market is a casino basically.



zirG

join:2012-12-18
Ridgeway, ON
reply to komal

said by komal:

said by zirG:

RIM's stock price has doubled since September. Nice return in 3 months. No, I didn't. But I though about it.

Uh, thats a pretty skewed way of looking at things.

You could also say that RIM lost more than half its share value from January to September.

People who had RIM at the beginning of the year have lost money.

The only thing its done in 2012 is go down and up like crazy. Overall its not too far from where it started the year, its about $2 down so far. That is a piss poor return.

Not really. It's all about timing. When things looked bleak in September, anyone who took a risk (thinking RIM would pull through) would have been handsomely rewarded. Like I said, I did think about it but I didn't have the stomach for it.


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to Gone

said by Gone:

said by Guspaz:

It's perfectly fine to call an Apple Macintosh an Apple, because it is; it's an Apple computer.

No, an "Apple computer" is a the name of a line of long-discontinued computers, the last of which was the Apple IIgs that was discontinued in 1992. The computer product sold now is called Macintosh, shortened to Mac.

Do you call your iPad or your iPhone an "Apple" ?

Toyota Camry can be called "a Toyota". Apple Macintosh can be called "an Apple".

You can call an iPad "The Apple iPad", or "the Apple tablet". You could call it "the Apple" only in the context of tablets, since that name would, out of context, be normally assumed to belong to their computers (which have been called an "apple" for much longer).

I grew up with the things, lots of people called the mac an Apple.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

said by Guspaz:

I grew up with the things, lots of people called the mac an Apple.

I grew up with the things too, having used Macs since the 80s back when most kids were playing on C64s.

You could call it the Piece of Poop On a Logic Board for all I care. It's still a Macintosh. Even though everyone calls them Apples and everyone understands what they mean, a Mac is made by Apple, but it of itself is not an Apple. Those were discontinued 20 years ago.

If Toyota made a product called the "Toyota" it is unlikely anyone would ever call their Corolla a "Toyota" today without further qualifying it.


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3

I'm going to start calling Corollas, Camrys, Prius', "Toyotas" from now on. I'm also going to call computers "hard drives" and it's built by "LG" cause that's the name on my monitor.



Ian
Premium
join:2002-06-18
ON
kudos:3
reply to Robrr

Until iFanBoi Corp starts paying me marketing fees to "properly" use their brand names, I'm going to call them and any of their products by whatever name I choose.

In any case RIMM was down almost 24% on the day based on this earnings announcement. When people dug into the fine print they realized that they only made their numbers with a favourable tax ruling. Also handset unit sales continue to plummet, as do the already pitiful playbook numbers. Why they haven't wised-up and cancelled all future Playbook production or development is beyond me. They can not, and will not compete in the tablet market. At least not with their proprietary OS that nobody seems willing to support with any software.

The biggest problem I see long-term for RIM is that, however good or not BB10 turns out to be, BB11 is already fucked. The only way the company stayed alive was by annihilating their global workforce. They already had enormous problems releasing a product on time with the people they had.

But I think most assume RIM will be a division of a larger company in the near to medium future. They are likely wanting to leverage any success of BB10 to make that fire-sale price a bit higher.
--
“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong



Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8

I don't think RIM has much of a future, sad to say, and what killed it was not the lack of great products, but the typical hubris that affects many companies that have become very successful very fast. Even their venture into the tablet market was evidence of all of that -- they produced a great product, but they thought they could keep a closed platform like Apple, and priced it outrageously high as if it was going to be the definitive iPad killer without even a price advantage. Not to mention releasing it before the OS was really ready. If the Playbook had had the features it has today, and priced the way it is today, it would have taken the market by storm. Now of course it's too late, as it is for RIM.



Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to urbanriot

said by urbanriot:

I'm also going to call computers "hard drives"

You asshole.


Ian
Premium
join:2002-06-18
ON
kudos:3
reply to Wolfie00

said by Wolfie00:

I don't think RIM has much of a future, sad to say, and what killed it was not the lack of great products, but the typical hubris that affects many companies that have become very successful very fast.

Actually, I think their biggest problem was complacency. They made slightly shinier versions of the same products that businesses had loved (for a while) due to Enterprise friendly features like their e-mail and full keyboards. They got caught flat-footed. They assumed (incorrectly) that they could hang onto the corporate market. But as more and more people started having personal cell-phones as well....

Their other big problems were absolutely terrible management, and an awful business reputation.

A few examples;

The keypads were made by a process called in-mold-decorating. This involved screen-printing ink on the backside of Polycarbonate, vacuum-forming the sheet to form the keys, then inserting that into a mold to inject polycarbonate resin behind. At the time, this was high tech. The inks had to withstand the heat of vacuum forming as well as the hot resin without discolouring or flaking off.

A Mississauga company worked closely with RIM to develop the inks, and processes to do this, in-bulk. They had the business and had to ramp up to between 2 and 3 full shifts to meet the demand.

Quietly, RIM engineers were transferring the technology to a Chinese company. Overnight the orders to the Mississauga company went to zero. No warning, no ramp-down, no % of the business to maintain a relationship. Just, flat-out, screwed them over. Nearly destroyed that company. People talk. And RIM had a notorious reputation as being colossal assholes to deal with.

They would also heavily use Temp Labour in Waterloo. After 2 or 3 years of no benefits, they might get hired on as a RIM employee. When they were, as a giant insult, an HR lady would give these "new" employees a Plant Tour.
--
“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong


Wolfie00
My dog is an elitist
Premium
join:2005-03-12
kudos:8

No disagreement with you there, except I'd say that hubris and complacency are closely related. And Balsillie, for one, certainly seemed to have a major case of asshole-itis.

One of the major vulnerabilities that affects high-tech companies that have achieved explosively rapid success is the ingrained belief that they are masters of a particular technology, and being the best, they are invulnerable. Sometimes they really are the best, sometimes it's a delusion, but ignoring the market reality around them will be their undoing in either case. Betamax really was better than VHS, DECnet/OSI really was better than TCP/IP, and OpenVMS really was better than Unix, but in the end it didn't matter.
--
"The promoters of the global economy see nothing odd or difficult about unlimited economic growth or unlimited consumption in a limited world."
Wendell Berry



FFH
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
reply to Robrr

said by Robrr:

RIM earnings are out and again beat the street. Stock has surged 13% since trading resumed for it at 4:40 pm EST.

»www.businessinsider.com/rim-earnings-2012-12

And it went down 23% the next day.
»www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:RIMM
--
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasury.

Merry Christmas »goo.gl/Y2AEF


TLS2000
Crazy Canuck
Premium
join:2004-02-24
Mississauga, ON
reply to Robrr

I think the ultimate goal here is for a buyout to happen. I'm probably going to get a BB10 phone to play around with, but I think that someone that's interested in QNX integration will buy out RIM in the end.
--
Tom


Warez_Zealot

join:2006-04-19
Vancouver
reply to Wolfie00

said by Wolfie00:

No disagreement with you there, except I'd say that hubris and complacency are closely related. And Balsillie, for one, certainly seemed to have a major case of asshole-itis.

One of the major vulnerabilities that affects high-tech companies that have achieved explosively rapid success is the ingrained belief that they are masters of a particular technology, and being the best, they are invulnerable. Sometimes they really are the best, sometimes it's a delusion, but ignoring the market reality around them will be their undoing in either case. Betamax really was better than VHS, DECnet/OSI really was better than TCP/IP, and OpenVMS really was better than Unix, but in the end it didn't matter.

Man, I didn't know RIM pulled stuff like that. Problem is when you start acting arrogant in a customer service sector -- you won't last long. What goes around comes around.
--
"You're not supposed to be so blind with patriotism that you can't face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who says it."-Malcolm X