 Cthen
join:2004-08-01
Detroit, MI
 ·Verizon Wireless..
 ·Comcast
| reply to hagbard72
Re: Modem security If you are using a router I am assuming that you have more than one computer connected? If so these are more than likely the devices that are being counted.
Some hardware manufacturer's firmware will list everything as a "device" no matter what it is that is connected.
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"I like to refer to myself as an Adult Film Efficienato." - Stuart Bondek |
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 StuartMWWho Is John Galt?Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2
 ·CenturyLink
1 edit | reply to Mele20
You ask
said by Mele20:Why do you say that?
and then immediately state
said by Mele20: My ISP tried to get me to use a junk Motorola surfboard modem with router, wifi, and parental stuff, etc on it...
Didn't you prove my point?
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow! |
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| reply to Cthen
Well, its now reporting one and I have the same number of devices attached. Something else was going on. |
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Mele20Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:4 | reply to StuartMW
Maybe...LOL...touche...can't type that correctly...have no idea how to find it in Win 8...the OS from Hell.
BUT Oceanic did that only because they were out of the EXTREMELY POPULAR Surfboard 6141 then. I took the junk back and got a 6141.
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When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson |
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StuartMWWho Is John Galt?Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CenturyLink
| reply to Mele20
said by Mele20:...I don't think most ISP's are giving out combo modems except when they temporarily run out of plain modems. I disagree.
A "dumb" modem provides next to no protection from nasties on the internet. You'd only have "Windows Firewall" assuming you run WinXP or above. That's the equivalent of leaving all your doors and windows open and your valuables in plain view. Probably not going to end well. ISP's therefore provide their customers with modem/routers (& firewall) to provide minimal protection (most users will never change the password, customize the firewall etc).
ISP's also know that many people have multiple devices these days (PC's, tablets, phones, TV's, etc) and quite often those use Wi-Fi. It therefore makes sense to include that as well.
Additionally many households have children so it also makes sense to include "parental controls" etc.
Finally the technology to do all the above, in a single box, is both possible and relatively inexpensive. In short it makes perfect sense for ISP's to offer an "all-in-one solution" for their customers.
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow! |
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 NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
·Comcast Business..
 ·Vonage
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast
1 edit | reply to Mele20
said by Mele20:Maybe...LOL...touche...can't type that correctly...have no idea how to find it in Win 8...the OS from Hell.
BUT Oceanic did that only because they were out of the EXTREMELY POPULAR Surfboard 6141 then. I took the junk back and got a 6141.
Believe it or not, just because you and your ISP in paradise do it one way, that does not mean that most ISPs do it that way. Here on the mainland, many ISPs (both cable and telco based) are indeed pushing modem/router gateway boxes to their customers. In some cases, the customers have no choice (AT&T's U-verse comes to mind), and in some cases the customer can either insist on a standard bridge modem or purchase their own. But the ISPs are indeed pushing combo gateway boxes (which in most cases, the ISP has full control of) to their customers.
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -- US Constitution
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. -- Thomas Jefferson |
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NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro Reviews:
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1 edit | reply to hagbard72
said by hagbard72:Well, its now reporting one and I have the same number of devices attached. Something else was going on.
If the symptom returns, how about posting a screen shot of the modem status page, and also either a detailed description of what is connected to what (and how it is connected), or a simple diagram showing that information.
I know that when I was using a SamKnows monitoring box, and when I used a managed switch directly behind my cable modem, the cable modem would sometimes see the MAC addresses of those "passive" devices and display them as connected devices on its status page. I suspect that something similar is what happened in your case, but unless we know exactly what is physically connected to what, any remote diagnosis is going to be just a wild guess.
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -- US Constitution
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. -- Thomas Jefferson |
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| reply to hagbard72
I'll do that but so far its holding at one. The devices that are attached to the router are a computer and a switch. Attached to the switch is a TV and a Bluray player. Everything else is wireless. |
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NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium
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1 edit | said by hagbard72:I'll do that but so far its holding at one. The devices that are attached to the router are a computer and a switch. Attached to the switch is a TV and a Bluray player. Everything else is wireless.
What is needed for proper diagnosis is what is physically attached to the modem. The modem should not be able to see anything on the LAN side of a router if the only thing that is attached to the modem is a router's WAN interface. Unless the router involved is seriously mis-configured (or just plain defective), the modem should not be able to see the MAC address(es) of any device on the router's LAN (and MAC addresses are what a cable modem looks for to determine what devices are attached).
Shown below is a redacted screen shot of my modem's device status page:
My cable modem shows five MAC addresses because I have five devices with visible MAC addresses connected to the modem. Shown below is a diagram that shows that interconnection (the five devices are the Netgear router, the D-Link router, the Linksys router, and the WAN interfaces of my two server boxes):
For a while, I used a VLAN segment on my Netgear GS108E (managed) switch directly behind my cable modem, but I had to stop doing that and replace it with a non-managed ZyXEL GS105S switch because the cable modem would randomly detect the GS108E's MAC address, and that would prevent some other device from getting internet access (I only pay my ISP for five IP addreses, and they consider that each visible MAC address equates to an IP address whether it really does or not).
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -- US Constitution
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. -- Thomas Jefferson |
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StuartMWWho Is John Galt?Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CenturyLink
| said by NetFixer:What is needed for proper diagnosis is what is physically attached to the modem. Already stated.
said by StuartMW:I assume your modem only has one RJ-45 (ethernet) connector on it and that's going to your router.
» Re: Modem security
»Re: Modem security
In other words. One connection from the modem to router and multple devices behind the router.
»Re: Modem security
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow! |
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NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium
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1 edit | said by StuartMW:said by NetFixer:What is needed for proper diagnosis is what is physically attached to the modem. Already stated. said by StuartMW:I assume your modem only has one RJ-45 (ethernet) connector on it and that's going to your router.
» Re: Modem security» Re: Modem securityIn other words. One connection from the modem to router and multple devices behind the router. » Re: Modem security None of that says that only the router's WAN interface is connected to the modem. When one has done tech support for many years, one learns to not assume anything. Believe me, I have run into many cases where a customer had a router's LAN interface connected to the modem (even though that was not the intention). If the OP's ISP allows multiple devices to obtain IP addresses from the ISP's DHCP server (as mine does), what you describe above could still work if the router's LAN interface were connected to the modem instead of the router's WAN interface (and that could explain multiple devices being visible on the modem's status page).
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -- US Constitution
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. -- Thomas Jefferson |
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StuartMWWho Is John Galt?Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CenturyLink
| said by NetFixer:None of that says that only the router's WAN interface is connected to the modem. Ok then. I'll leave that for others to decide. I asked the question and IMO the OP gave the answer. If one of the routers LAN ports (instead of the WAN) was connected to the modem that'd explain a lot.
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow! |
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NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro Reviews:
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1 edit | said by StuartMW:said by NetFixer:None of that says that only the router's WAN interface is connected to the modem. Ok then. I'll leave that for others to decide. I asked the question and IMO the OP gave the answer. You asked a question; you did not ask the definitive question, and you did not get the definitive answer. Asking the definitive question(s) and getting the definitive answer(s) can make the difference between a minimum bill and a quick email/phone fix, or a big bill for the customer, and a long drive for the tech when you do network troubleshooting for a living.
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -- US Constitution
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. -- Thomas Jefferson |
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| reply to hagbard72
Showing two devices now. Last time I got a device identifying itself as UNKNOWN, I blocked its mac address. Now I have another UNKNOWN (same time as the modem registered two devices) and I've now blocked it. |
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NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro Reviews:
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage
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1 edit | said by hagbard72:Showing two devices now. Last time I got a device identifying itself as UNKNOWN, I blocked its mac address. Now I have another UNKNOWN (same time as the modem registered two devices) and I've now blocked it.
The question of exactly where you see the additional devices still remains (at least in my mind). Are you seeing them in the modem's status page, in a router status page, or are you using a utility on a PC to see these devices? Also, since you know the MAC addresses, you can look them up online ( »aruljohn.com/mac.pl is one such place) and that could provide a clue as to their source.
And where exactly are you blocking those MAC addresses? Does your modem actually have that capability?
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -- US Constitution
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. -- Thomas Jefferson |
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StuartMWWho Is John Galt?Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CenturyLink
| reply to hagbard72
Ok, let me ask the question the way NetFixer  wants.
You have one RJ-45 connector on your modem and one CAT5 cable from it to your router. Is the cable going into an RJ-45 labelled "WAN" on your router? It should not be plugged into a router LAN port. That would effectively make your router a switch.
Also did you change anything? For example turn your TV/Blu-Ray player on or a wireless device?
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow! |
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| reply to NetFixer
I'm seeing the two devices on the modem diagnostics page. I'm blocking the UNKNOWN on the router. |
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| reply to StuartMW
Yes, things are properly plugged in, modem to router's WAN port. Nothing else is connected to the modem. |
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StuartMWWho Is John Galt?Premium
join:2000-08-06
Galt's Gulch
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CenturyLink
| reply to hagbard72
Ok. Is the modem showing their MAC addresses? If so I'd try and figure out if any of your devices have those MAC addresses.
I keep a text file that contains the MAC addresses of all my devices. Comes in handy for things like this.
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Don't feed trolls--it only makes them grow! |
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| No, it doesn't. But the UNKNOWN devices have these addresses according to the router:
00:25:71:01:D1:7F
00:90:A2:8E:36:AA
But they could just be some computer or phone that I'm not aware of. |
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