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Speedy Petey

join:2008-01-19

2 recommendations

reply to pandora

Re: My addition will take almost 2 miles of Cat 6

said by pandora:

Each of my kids has 1 Xbox 360, 1 PS3 (bc with PS2), 1 wii, 1 PC, and 1 smart TV, 1 wired VOIP device, 1 network connected DVR, in addition to 1 laptop (often used wirelessly), 1 tablet (also wireless). Some kids have a small network printer / scanner.

I can't be certain where the kids will want their stuff to plug in. Only active ethernet cables need to be connected to a switch. It is possible the majority of cables will be unused for long periods of time.

I'm very tired of messy 8 port unmanaged switches sitting on the floor in a room. They not only are an eyesore, but they take a power slot.

EACH kid??? This make it all clearer.
Basically you are telling us that your kids are profoundly spoiled and that's the reason for all that cable.

pandora
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reply to SwedishRider

said by SwedishRider:

I have a DIR-655 router (which isn't even dual band), and I've streamed HD video alongside computer use with no problems. Then again, I don't have 17 Xboxes, 36 computers and 6 printers running simultaneously alongside the HD video.

For me, the convenience wins. Maybe I just don't have high demands of my equipment... but to each their own.

I tried a Vizio smart HDTV via wireless where my router was about 1' away from the TV. I couldn't stream HD video from Hulu Plus or Amazon without buffering issues. Amazon was smart enough to suggest switching to standard definition.

I wish wireless worked better, but for sustained HD streams, it's tough in my experience.
--
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand." - Milton Friedman"


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to pike

said by pike:

You also have quite a bit of overlapping technology there and most people don't go for that level of redundancy. A network switch is the ideal solution in this scenario as you're not likely to be using more than 2 (or even 1) of those devices at a time in any high-bandwidth demand.

I don't like using switches. I like everything home run. That way upgrading to a newer technology like 10 gig is easy, just replace the main switch and I'm done.

There's overlap but each device has services that the other doesn't have. The Smart TV has amazon instant video, while Apple obviously doesn't. Apple TV has AirPlay mirroring, the network receiver has siriusXM streaming radio and the XBOX is used for windows media center. The nice thing about the network receiver is I can leave the TV off while listening to the streaming radio.

My blu-ray player doesn't have streaming but it has bd-live. BD also requires periodic firmware updates to play newer discs. It's easier to do this over the network.


alkizmo

join:2007-06-25
Pierrefonds, QC
kudos:1
reply to pandora

For new constructions I can understand multiple outlets per room, maybe one per wall.

Eventually it's overkill to put multiple outlets per wall in a bedroom. You don't like switches but I'm sure that a switch can easily fit in the same shelf as the PS3, Xbox360, Wii, TV, etc etc.

Laptops typically run on WiFi, you can plug them in, but who bothers?

For existing constructions, the effort to get one outlet per bedroom is already a lot, so there's no point to go ahead and put a ton unless you KNOW you need them at said specific location.

MatrixHDV, what program is that? Can it be run on a router? Im curious of what noise is around my house, even if it's a single detached home with brick walls.


ke4pym
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reply to pandora

said by pandora:

I tried a Vizio smart HDTV via wireless where my router was about 1' away from the TV. I couldn't stream HD video from Hulu Plus or Amazon without buffering issues. Amazon was smart enough to suggest switching to standard definition.

I wish wireless worked better, but for sustained HD streams, it's tough in my experience.

Get a better access point.

ke4pym
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reply to fifty nine

said by fifty nine:

I don't like using switches. I like everything home run. That way upgrading to a newer technology like 10 gig is easy, just replace the main switch and I'm done.

Wish you the best on getting 10G on CAT6.


54067323

join:2012-09-25
Tuscaloosa, AL
reply to alkizmo

said by alkizmo:

MatrixHDV, what program is that? Can it be run on a router? Im curious of what noise is around my house, even if it's a single detached home with brick walls.

Not sure if the dongle is still available but it probably can be had from e-bay used or maybe another type USB dongle might work but the app can be downloaded here.

»www.ubnt.com/airview/downloads
»www.ubnt.com/airview

pandora
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reply to ke4pym

said by ke4pym:

Get a better access point.

Most of the wire is run and there is no problem (for me).

My cost will be approximately $4,000 for installation and $1,000 - $1,200 for all cables and connectors once it's all up. I'm comfortable with this. Others may not be. The server cost $600, I'll probably be paying nearly 1K per 48 port switch x 1 or 2. Cameras run $100 a piece times about 9.

In each bedroom, I anticipate one nearly full box of 7 Ethernet connectors used, and the other boxes mostly unused. I will only connect active cable to a switch (aside for testing).

I have yet to get very good streaming from any access point, and when multiple devices are streaming, failure is always the result.

You may have a different situation and better experience. For me, this is a solution that works. I was just amazed to think of wires by the mile instead of by the foot or meter which is how I usually think of them.
--
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand." - Milton Friedman"


Cho Baka
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-23
there
kudos:2
reply to pandora

Success at streaming also depends on what is being streamed.
Is it a 700 mb hour long show, or is it an 8 gig hour long show?

Different people have different standards.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.



mattmag
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-04-09
NW Illinois
kudos:3

2 recommendations

reply to pandora

said by pandora:

I was just amazed to think of wires by the mile instead of by the foot or meter which is how I usually think of them.

That's OK, we were all amazed by 7 network cable runs per wall plate....

pandora
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reply to Cho Baka

said by Cho Baka:

Success at streaming also depends on what is being streamed.

I have no idea what the bandwidth of Netflix, Hulu plus or Amazon HD videos are. Those and youtube account for almost all streaming. It is not uncommon for 3 or 4 streams to be active at once in the house.
--
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand." - Milton Friedman"

Speedy Petey

join:2008-01-19

said by pandora:

I have no idea what the bandwidth of Netflix, Hulu plus or Amazon HD videos are. Those and youtube account for almost all streaming. It is not uncommon for 3 or 4 streams to be active at once in the house.

Funny. I have a typical 10/100 router with 5e and N600 wireless. Even with two Netflix streams and YouTube or XBox going the only time I hit a buffer is with YouTube and 1080p videos..

pandora
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said by Speedy Petey:

Funny. I have a typical 10/100 router with 5e and N600 wireless. Even with two Netflix streams and YouTube or XBox going the only time I hit a buffer is with YouTube and 1080p videos..

Obviously WiFi is a great solution for your streaming needs. Kudos!
--
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand." - Milton Friedman"


Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1
reply to pike

How effective would be networking over a powerline be?
I use that in my home, but it's only hooked up to a roku player and a computer.
Hence I seldom notice any speed issues.
I have the power line adaptor connected to a switch, then the PC and roku device are connected to the switch.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.


AVonGauss
Premium
join:2007-11-01
Boynton Beach, FL
reply to pandora

The challenge with wireless and video isn't so much an issue of bandwidth or "speed" but rather the protocol overhead which can go up exponentially depending on the number of active devices and other networks within reach.



leibold
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join:2002-07-09
Sunnyvale, CA
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reply to alkizmo

said by alkizmo:

But you'll never see a fridge with RJ45.

Sorry, but you are wrong on that one. I have already seen that at the local Fry's Electronic store.
--
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pandora
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reply to AVonGauss

said by AVonGauss:

The challenge with wireless and video isn't so much an issue of bandwidth or "speed" but rather the protocol overhead which can go up exponentially depending on the number of active devices and other networks within reach.

I read from some who have had great experiences with Wi-Fi, and others such as myself who haven't. I did pick up an Amazon Kindle Fire HD and it seems to stream better than the other tablets I have. Why that would be I don't know.
--
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand." - Milton Friedman"


alkizmo

join:2007-06-25
Pierrefonds, QC
kudos:1
reply to leibold

said by leibold:

Sorry, but you are wrong on that one. I have already seen that at the local Fry's Electronic store.

10 years ago?
What?
Which fridge?
And what's the point?
My car's on Bluetooth, why aren't the fridges too?

robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1

Bluetooth -- doesn't do much distance and doesn't do walls very well. Works decent in a car, but would be total junk in a fridge.



NotTheMama
What Would Earl Do?

join:2012-12-06
reply to pandora

Peak--likely as much as you can get (I've gotten up to 30mbps when a stream starts, which is my max); sustained--maybe around 3mbps, but probably closer to 2mbps (maybe a bit more for HD), so not all that much really. I've heard some HD streams hover around 7mbps, but I haven't seen that myself (which could just be my case).
--
"...but ya doesn't hasta call me Johnson!"



fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to leibold

said by leibold:

said by alkizmo:

But you'll never see a fridge with RJ45.

Sorry, but you are wrong on that one. I have already seen that at the local Fry's Electronic store.

Interestingly enough when I worked at Fujitsu in 1999/2000 they had a concept of an e-fridge and I believe they had a working prototype. It had a barcode scanner and a network jack and you would scan stuff as it went in and scanned it when it was empty. That way you kept track of stuff.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to ke4pym

said by ke4pym:

said by fifty nine:

I don't like using switches. I like everything home run. That way upgrading to a newer technology like 10 gig is easy, just replace the main switch and I'm done.

Wish you the best on getting 10G on CAT6.

Technically I have 6A but the way I have it setup I can upgrade the cabling easily and even run fiber if I wanted to.

I doubt I'll be going 10 gig anytime soon but I'm relatively future proof.


leibold
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Sunnyvale, CA
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reply to alkizmo

said by alkizmo:

Which fridge?

I really don't remember. I don't think it was as long as 10 years ago but it might have been. The one thing I do clearly remember is the thought that immediately popped into my head: "Oh no, I didn't wire the kitchen!".
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NotTheMama
What Would Earl Do?

join:2012-12-06
reply to fifty nine

And it warned you before an item was ready to get up and walk out on its own?
--
"...but ya doesn't hasta call me Johnson!"


medbuyer

join:2003-11-20
kudos:4
reply to TheTechGuru

said by TheTechGuru:

I would also do some CAT3 runs for a wired phone system unless you're going to use IP phones.

with 28 runs of cat6, he certainly can use one for phone either POTS or Voip based....

ke4pym
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reply to alkizmo

said by alkizmo:

said by leibold:

Sorry, but you are wrong on that one. I have already seen that at the local Fry's Electronic store.

10 years ago?
What?
Which fridge?
And what's the point?
My car's on Bluetooth, why aren't the fridges too?

Doesn't have an RJ45 jack. But does have WiFi -

»www.samsung.com/us/appliances/re···HARS/XAA


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to fifty nine

said by fifty nine:

Interestingly enough when I worked at Fujitsu in 1999/2000 they had a concept of an e-fridge and I believe they had a working prototype. It had a barcode scanner and a network jack and you would scan stuff as it went in and scanned it when it was empty. That way you kept track of stuff.

LG makes one similar - tied into a grocery service, even, so you can make a shopping list or order stuff straight from the touch screen on the door... I helped install a bunch of them in a high-end condo development a friend of mine worked on.


leibold
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reply to ke4pym

said by ke4pym:

Doesn't have an RJ45 jack. But does have WiFi -

Those Samsung ones are more recent products. I looked at one of those as well (for curiosity, not with the intend to buy) and based on where the wireless antenna was located was wondering how well it would work. It seemed to me that the stainless steel exterior would block most of the wireless signal ?
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alkizmo

join:2007-06-25
Pierrefonds, QC
kudos:1

said by leibold:

said by ke4pym:

Doesn't have an RJ45 jack. But does have WiFi -

Those Samsung ones are more recent products. I looked at one of those as well (for curiosity, not with the intend to buy) and based on where the wireless antenna was located was wondering how well it would work. It seemed to me that the stainless steel exterior would block most of the wireless signal ?

My original point exactly: WiFi is now for such appliances. RJ45 was 10-12 years ago when WiFi wasn't very main stream and expensive.

These were just computers in refrigerators. That fad probably came along with TVs in the refrigerator doors. It was a gimmick.

With laptops and tablets, nobody needs a computer in the refridgerator (for the women *wink wink*).

If appliances have internet hook up these days, it would only be for monitoring/remote control, which requires very little bandwidth and wifi would be most practical.

As for where the antenna is located, could be anywhere, maybe along the edge where there's a rubber pad protecting a corner so the stainless panels don't interfere.


leibold
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The antenna on the model I looked at was deep inside the door behind ice/water dispenser. It seemed to allow for only a narrow angle of exposure (towards the front of the refrigerator).

That might be fine if the fridge is installed along an exterior house wall since then the fridge front would face into the house. The only way that it would work if the fridge is installed along an interior wall is if you can pick up your neighbors wifi

It will be interesting to see what form of wireless home automation will ultimately prevail. There is nothing to prevent using wifi but Zigbee seems currently leading actual product availability (limited as it is). Bluetooth (as already mentioned) is being considered for this purpose as well.

The Internet fridge (depending on how it is being used) might be more bandwidth intensive (and hence wifi the more logical choice) then typical home automation tasks (sensors and controls).
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