| reply to mikefxu
Re: Cloneman's Tomato QoS Tips for adsl, vdsl2, and cable updated all my screens. Does the new shibby have min & max for downstream? |
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mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL | |
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Reviews:
 ·TekSavvy DSL
| reply to Cloneman
looks like shibby put in toastman QoS and the tvlz TC-atm patch. 
quote:
- Dodano wsparcie dla TC-ATM overhead w zakładce QoS – dzięki Tvlz
- Odświeżone regułki QoS – dzięki Toastman
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mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL | Tomato Firmware 1.28.0000 MIPSR2-105 K26 USB AIO
USB support integration and GUI,
IPv6 support,
Linux kernel 2.6.22.19 and Broadcom Wireless Driver 5.10.147.0 updates,
support for additional router models, dual-band and Wireless-N mode.
Copyright (C) 2008-2011 Fedor Kozhevnikov, Ray Van Tassle, Wes Campaigne
»www.tomatousb.org
OpenVPN integration and GUI,
Copyright (C) 2010 Keith Moyer,
tomatovpn@keithmoyer.com
"Shibby" features:
- Transmission 2.76 integration
- GUI for Transmission
- NFS utils integration and GUI
- Custom log file path
- SD-idle tool integration for kernel 2.6
- 3G Modem support (big thanks for @LDevil)
- SNMP integration and GUI
- APCUPSD integration and GUI (implemented by @arrmo)
- DNScrypt-proxy 1.0 integration and GUI
- TOR Project integration and GUI
- TomatoAnon project integration and GUI
- TomatoThemeBase project imtegration and GUI
Copyright (C) 2011-2013 Michał Rupental
»openlinksys.info
"JYAvenard" Features:
- OpenVPN enhancements & username/password only authentication
- PPTP VPN Client integration and GUI
Copyright (C) 2010-2012 Jean-Yves Avenard
jean-yves@avenard.org
"Victek" features:
- Extended Sysinfo
- Captive Portal. (Based in NocatSplash)
- HFS / HFS+ filesystem integration
Copyright (C) 2007-2011 Ofer Chen & Vicente Soriano
»victek.is-a-geek.com
"Teaman" features:
- QOS-detailed & ctrate filters
- Realtime bandwidth monitoring of LAN clients
- Static ARP binding
- VLAN administration GUI
- Multiple LAN support integration and GUI
- Multiple/virtual SSID support (experimental)
- UDPxy integration and GUI
- PPTP Server integration and GUI
Copyright (C) 2011 Augusto Bott
Tomato-sdhc-vlan Homepage
"Toastman" features:
- Configurable QOS class names
- Comprehensive QOS rule examples set by default
- TC-ATM overhead calculation - patch by tvlz
- GPT support for HDD by Yaniv Hamo
Copyright (C) 2011 Toastman
Using QoS - Tutorial and discussion
"Tiomo" Features:
- IMQ based QOS Ingress
- Incoming Class Bandwidth pie chart
Copyright (C) 2012 Tiomo
"Victek/PrinceAMD/Phykris/Shibby" feature:
- Revised IP/MAC Bandwidth Limiter
Based on Tomato Firmware v1.28
Copyright (C) 2006-2010 Jonathan Zarate
»www.polarcloud.com/tomato/
Built on czw, 17 sty 2013 22:15:38 +0100 by Shibby, »openlinksys.info |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
kudos:6
4 edits | reply to Cloneman
said by Cloneman:looks like shibby put in toastman QoS and the tvlz TC-atm patch.
Thank you, folks, for the updated info !
So does this mean that I ought to install the latest Toastman build which I downloaded around when the current thread began, and which had been discussed just before that in more detail here »Tomato QoS major bug (resolved - normal behavior) , or should I choose the latest Shibby build which you are discussing today in the current thread ?
MY currently installed Shibby build (v93, from sometime last year) has some stuff from Toastman in it, but as discovered in the other thread, NOT an Inbound Global Maximum Bandwidth limiting control, which looks to be a Tiomo feature rather than one of Toastman's, if I read the earlier replies about that properly.
As I see things, it's just that Toastman seems to have included this Tiomo tweak in HIS builds before Shibby did.
Bear in mind again that I have a Cisco-Linksis WRT54GL router, and it would depend upon whether or not Shibby has done a new version of his for that, using an older kernel as he did last time (v.2.4), and as I believe that my downloaded and ready Toastman (also built last year) is based too. |
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
| reply to Cloneman
I guess either one would be fine? I don't know how shibby runs on old hardware, I haven't tried the new shibby either.
I would get the latest toastman , maybe it's these for wrt54gl:
»www.4shared.com/dir/v1BuINP3/Toa···NH6DiVQV |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
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kudos:6
4 edits |
I believe that it depends upon whether or not a build has been done based on the Linux 2.4 kernel with 'ND' (new driver), as that is supposed to be OK with the electronics of my mature series of router, IIUC.
I'll check the your link and the other download site I mentioned in the other thread, and then post update(s) here of whatever I find.
Thanks.
= = = = = = =
UPDATE 1 :
Toastman's Builds :
Your above link (4share) = LOADING..... LOADING..... LOADING.....
Going to »www.linksysinfo.org/index.php?th···s.36106/ (see 2nd post) gives these links :
»www.4shared.com/dir/v1BuINP3/Toa···v1BuINP3 - This link seems active, and browses fine to what looks like YOUR link. [shrug]
»www.mediafire.com/?88t1vzzcgrphx - Seems OK - That's where I got my files on Jan 3rd.
Both of these have the same Toastman files that I already recently downloaded, and are from a build of March of last year (tomato-WRT54G_WRT54GL-1.28.7633.3-Toastman-IPT-ND series).
So the only things left to wonder/investigate now are whether Shibby made a newer build which is compatible with my WRT54 beast, and if yes, whether it has any OTHER advantages than only the Tiomo QoS tweak which itself is also in that Toastman build.
UPDATE 2 :
Shibby's site »tomato.groov.pl/ seems to have a current (3 days old) group of builds (v105) for the WRT54 series, at »tomato.groov.pl/download/K24/ , (as well as others for current routers), so I will download some of these and read the changelog, not necessarily in that order. 
SHIBBY's Changelog »tomato.groov.pl/?page_id=78 |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
kudos:6
4 edits |
Conclusions/Questions :
It looks like Toastman updated his K24-ND builds (for old routers like mine) last March, but not since.
That build includes the Tiomo tweak for adding an Inbound Global Maximum Bandwidth limiting control.
He apparently HAS updated his K26 builds since then (mostly intended for newer routers), but I've not investigated what changes are in those builds.
According to Shibby's changelog, the Tiomo control appears for the first time only in his newest (rev 105) builds, and there DOES seem to be a 105 version for his K24-ND branch, so I have downloaded the flavours of that which are designated for an earlier Non-USB router like mine.
The DSL tweak is irrelevant to me as I am on Cable, but also seems to be for the first time only in Shibby's 105 builds.
So should I install the latest Shibby, or last March's Toastman ?
Are there OTHER reasons for me to choose only one of them, besides the Tiomo control tweak which they both seem to have ?
I currently have Shibby's K24-ND-093 build, installed since last summer. |
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
| reply to Cloneman
hrm, not sure, I'm very confused myself with build numbers.
You could try latest shibby or Tvlz's toastman mod for K24 which I think uses a fairly recent toastman as a base, but im not sure.
»www.box.com/s/45a876412375574902···38575632 |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
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3 edits | said by Cloneman:....You could try latest shibby or Tvlz's toastman mod for K24 which I think uses a fairly recent toastman as a base, but im not sure....
Thanks.
Hmmmm....
Everyone seems to be releasing builds which include some or all of the other folks' earlier contributions.
TVLZ is the author credited with the mod called 'TC-ATM overhead calculation for DSL', which is included in the latest Shibby build #105 from Jan 23rd.
UPDATE :
I just checked and your linked TVLZ build's changelog does not say whether or not it contains the TIOMO control for Inbound QoS - nor anything else from any other authors, for that matter.
So I guess I'm back to the 2 choices mentioned in my last post. |
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mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL | reply to Cloneman
I screwed with this for many hours this weekend and never could get QoS working during upload stressing. Even going as far to carve out a static amount for VoIP versus everything else caused VoIP quality to drop per Visualware's online VoIP test. |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
kudos:6
4 edits | reply to Cloneman
said by Cloneman:looks like shibby put in toastman QoS and the tvlz TC-atm patch.
quote:
- Dodano wsparcie dla TC-ATM overhead w zakładce QoS – dzięki Tvlz
- Odświeżone regułki QoS – dzięki Toastman
Also in Shibby build #105 (for the first time) is the Tiomo Inbound QoS control (which is the part which might matter to ME), and bless my soul, do I see the kitchen sink in there too ?! 
BTW, methinks that Shibby had already included Toastman's own mods in MY currently installed build for Cisco-Linksys WRT54GL.
My 'About' page : Shibby K24-ND build #093 from 2012-06-01
Screenshot : »Re: Tomato QoS major bug (resolved - normal behavior) |
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
| reply to mikefxu
said by mikefxu:I screwed with this for many hours this weekend and never could get QoS working during upload stressing. Even going as far to carve out a static amount for VoIP versus everything else caused VoIP quality to drop per Visualware's online VoIP test.
It's not easy to configure QoS, I lost a lot of sleep over the last few years.
If you want to keep it simple for testing, set all UDP traffic to high and everything else to normal. You should be able to maintain less than 8 ms average jitter and less than 0.4% packet loss. Don't use visualware's guidelines, they are overly strict. |
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mikefxu
join:2004-10-05
Titusville, FL | said by Cloneman :It's not easy to configure QoS, I lost a lot of sleep over the last few years.
If you want to keep it simple for testing, set all UDP traffic to high and everything else to normal. You should be able to maintain less than 8 ms average jitter and less than 0.4% packet loss. Don't use visualware's guidelines, they are overly strict. Correct me if I am wrong but my understand was Highest or Lowest were only labels and did not correlate to priority but are merely for categorizing data into groups and then you establish QoS by setting your groups limit. |
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
2 edits | said by mikefxu:Correct me if I am wrong but my understand was Highest or Lowest were only labels and did not correlate to priority but are merely for categorizing data into groups and then you establish QoS by setting your groups limit.
You are indeed incorrect. They are 2 seperate entities. Items that have higher priority on the list will always be prioritized. The bandwith resitricts % is a "bonus" secondary system that should be used mostly to prevent high classes from using _too_much bandwith.
Here's an example setup for upload QoS:
Classifi. type MIN MAX
Priority 1 VoIP 10% 40%
Priority 2 ICMP 2% 10%
Priority 3 HTTP 1% 100%
In this setup, VoiP and ICMP will _ALWAYS_ push http out of the way, even if http is using 100%. For instance when we give ICMP a 10% max, we are saying:
"although we want ICMP to always have priority over http, we don't want the total amount of ICMP traffic to ever exceed 10%"
The purpose of this is that, we assuming that if ever ICMP or VoIP starts using a bunch of bandwith, we're going to assume there's an application misbehaving and we dont want it using up all the bandwith.
If you wanted to, you could set everything to 100% MAX and your QoS would still work, because the most important thing is the order on the list from highest to lowest. My recommendation however is to set some high priorty things to a lower MAX. For example, you could decide that UDP should have a higher priority than http but never use too much bandwith on its own.
I actually made the some of the same assumptions as you which is what inspired making this thread. |
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| OMG...the lights in my brain just came on!  Thanks Cloneman for that lucid explanation. I had been trying to get my head around it for a while and was also making the wrong assumptions.
Now, can you, or anyone, back up those assumptions with a reference? It's not that I doubt you but it is counter-intuitive like you said.
Btw, this thread inspired me and I went and grabbed the latest shibby for my Asus RT-N16, (2.6...105.1 AIO). Upgraded without a hitch from an older beta 2.6 Tomato USB-VPN build. I am blown away by how much stuff is in there. |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
kudos:6
1 edit | said by rdcanuck:....Thanks Cloneman for that lucid explanation....
+1
Yes indeed !
Well stated and understandable.
Now you said in your example that it applied to the Upload (Outbound) QoS, for which most alternate firmwares do contain support to some degree (for example, I noticed something of QoS in DD-WRT when I used it as a step-up to get my existing Tomato installed).
But what about settings for the Inbound (Download) QoS, such as this Tiomo contribution which has myself and some others looking at moving to one of either the newest Shibby or Toastman builds (which both seem to contain it), what would you suggest doing about setting THAT ? |
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| reply to Cloneman
Great thread
. Thx |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
kudos:6
4 edits | reply to Davesnothere
Well, I did her !
Below (next post) is my 'About' screen, showing Shibby K24-ND build #105 of SD-VPN flavour, for Non-USB routers such as my Linksys WRT54GL.
I upgraded just over 3 hours ago, using the internal function of my existing Shibby K24-ND build #093 of SD-VPN.
BTW, I chose Shibby again this time, mainly because I did not wish to reset my NVRAM and figured that staying with the same author would give me the best chance of getting away with being that cocky (and lazy), as I have quite a few custom settings, including a non-standard subnet range and some port fwds.
Also, the Shibby build I have been running since last summer has been flawless - that is, within the range of things which it was inteneded to do.
Also BTW, the credits are getting so long now that I had to zoom to 90%, even on my 1280x1024 older screen, and set the browser to full screen mode, just to grab it all in one piece.
Thanks to Cloneman and the other contributors, of BOTH threads, for the info and psychological support to get me to do this.
Now, I just need to see how the new QoS behaves.... |
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DavesnothereNo-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
join:2009-06-15
START&Cogeco
kudos:6 | Here it is : ^^^ |
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