Topic 'Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b' in forum 'Frontier Communications' - dslreports.com

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Tue, 23 Apr 2013 17:11:03 EDT

NormanS posted :

Yes well, the IPTV test is probably only over their fiber network, unless they want to do with with Youtube quality.

Well, having casually observed the quality of IPTV over copper, using VDSL, at a relative's house (AT&T U-verse, FTTN), YouTube quality seems to be okay.

Personally, I prefer satellite, or coax; but won't pay for any of it.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:50:59 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : Yes well, the IPTV test is probably only over their fiber network, unless they want to do with with Youtube quality.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:46:48 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by ITALIAN926:

Why are you under the assumption that IPTV is restricted to VDSL delivery?

Why are you under the assumption I am limiting IPTV to VDSL? I have no doubt IPTV works over fiber and cable; but the poster wondered about IPTV beyond the Frontier fiber footprint. Unless Frontier is planning on deploying coax, copper is most likely. While ADSL2+ probably could be used for IPTV, there wouldn't be as much bandwidth left for Internet as with VDSL.

Or is Frontier going to become a satellite service?
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:32:55 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted :

quote:
IPTV works with VDSL, but the copper loop should ideally be under 1500 feet. Unless some different RT cabinets are available, there will be backlash from neighbors to those cabinets. Do some research on AT&T VRADs (opponents refer to them as, "Lawn 'Fridges").

I don't see how this would reduce programming expense; even if it did, could it offset the expense of installing VRAD cabinets, and conditioning the copper plant?

Why are you under the assumption that IPTV is restricted to VDSL delivery?

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:15:34 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by pdxhz :

About a month ago a tech that stopped by a neighbor's house to do a new Fios internet installation mentioned that Frontier is currently doing IPTV testing in Indiana (select employees only). How that technology could translate into customers beyond the Fios footprint is unclear at this point. How this could reduce Frontier's steep TV programming expense is even more murky.

IPTV works with VDSL, but the copper loop should ideally be under 1500 feet. Unless some different RT cabinets are available, there will be backlash from neighbors to those cabinets. Do some research on AT&T VRADs (opponents refer to them as, "Lawn 'Fridges").

I don't see how this would reduce programming expense; even if it did, could it offset the expense of installing VRAD cabinets, and conditioning the copper plant?
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Tue, 23 Apr 2013 05:31:41 EDT

anon posted : About a month ago a tech that stopped by a neighbor's house to do a new Fios internet installation mentioned that Frontier is currently doing IPTV testing in Indiana (select employees only). How that technology could translate into customers beyond the Fios footprint is unclear at this point. How this could reduce Frontier's steep TV programming expense is even more murky.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 22 Apr 2013 11:25:16 EDT

darcilicious posted :

said by mikedz4:

will frontier provide video services other than wa, or, and in?

My best guess? It's unlikely.
--
♬ Dragon of good fortune struggles with the trickster Fox ♬

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 22 Apr 2013 10:58:14 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by darcilicious:

said by mikedz4:

I was just reading the other day how people with uverse fiber to the home are getting the same speeds as uverse fiber to the node customers. Apparently they are going to increase speeds soon.

Where did you read this exactly? I'd like to read about it.

See the second post I linked above. A (former?) AT&T FTTH user in the AT&T U-verse forum: ConstantineM . I think also some other user posts in that forum. Apparently AT&T offers an excuse which amounts to: "We don't want our FTTN user base demanding an upgrade to FTTH."
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 22 Apr 2013 09:26:44 EDT

mikedz4 posted : will frontier provide video services other than wa, or, and in?

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 22 Apr 2013 08:53:45 EDT

darcilicious posted :

said by mikedz4:

Will this u-verse video service be deployed in west Virginia?

No. U-Verse is provided by AT&T and as far as I know, there are no AT&T services in WV, just Frontier. AT&T is not likely to "ovebuild" into Frontier territory.

I was just reading the other day how people with uverse fiber to the home are getting the same speeds as uverse fiber to the node customers. Apparently they are going to increase speeds soon.

Where did you read this exactly? I'd like to read about it.
--
♬ Dragon of good fortune struggles with the trickster Fox ♬

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 22 Apr 2013 07:44:57 EDT

mikedz4 posted : I was just reading the other day how people with uverse fiber to the home are getting the same speeds as uverse fiber to the node customers. Apparently they are going to increase speeds soon.

Will this u-verse video service be deployed in west Virginia? Would be nice to have competition here.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 15 Apr 2013 21:07:48 EDT

darcilicious posted : So move to Japan! :) They've got some awesome speeds in Scandinavia too :)
--
♬ Dragon of good fortune struggles with the trickster Fox ♬

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Mon, 15 Apr 2013 20:31:44 EDT

Melakion posted : »www.pcworld.com/article/2034643/···bps.html

2Gbps/1Gbps connection in japan, and what fancy new high tech physical plant are they deploying that on?

"So-net said its service uses the GPON, or Gigabit-capable Passive Optics Networks, standard"

Oh, the same stuff that's already strung to the side of my house that Frontier limits us to 35mbps on. Must be nice.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 30 Mar 2013 15:12:03 EDT

Melakion posted : Why are you not happy with 3mbps? I had 768k DSL I would have traded you any day, about 15 years ago.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 30 Mar 2013 14:52:40 EDT

isp10002 posted : Why are you guys not happy with 35 mbps? I have 3mbps dsl id trade you anyday, 35 mbps is good enough for anyone, you probally use alot of bandwidth. If your not happey with it move on.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 30 Mar 2013 03:53:09 EDT

Melakion posted : 75mbps? How did you manage that? It's not the 150/65 plan I want, but it's a lot faster than 35mbps.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 30 Mar 2013 02:58:33 EDT

NormanS posted :

said by ITALIAN926:

Wow, Uverse uses FTTP? Didnt know that. Exactly what percentage of Uverse subscribers are FTTP? .01% ?

Parts of Michigan (maybe other Midwest states which were "formally" (a play on "intensive" purposes*) Ameritech), parts of Teaxas, which was formerly Southwestern Bell Telephone, and parts of California, which was formerly The Pacific Telesis Group. And closer to 1% than 0.01%.

»Bad news! Notice the wording!

In which the OP states it is at least 5% of AT&T customers served by FTTP.

»Is Paxio real? Do they really offer service in San Jose?

Same poster is trying to identify where, in Santa Clara County he can get better FTTP service from another provider.

*"formerly" and "intents and purposes".
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 29 Mar 2013 06:09:48 EDT

anon posted : I'm enjoying my Frontier FiOS in the Portland Metro Area

»www.speedtest.net/result/2607826065.png

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 28 Mar 2013 13:36:32 EDT

Melakion posted : Got a Frontier Business FiOS offer in the mail that talked about FiOS download speeds up to 50Mbps. Anyone know what the upload speed is on that? On their normal business website it says up to 40Mbps.

»frontier.com/rightprice doesn't list any more details than are on the 1/3 page flyer.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sun, 03 Feb 2013 12:45:28 EDT

millerzone posted : Uh, that's "intents and purposes"

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 12 Jan 2013 14:02:59 EDT

jamesonnorth posted : My grandmother has Uverse over fiber to the house. I saw the orange fiber lines being installed. Fiber is up and down every telephone pole in her neighborhood. Why it's not underground is beyond me.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 12 Jan 2013 12:22:35 EDT

linicx posted : Thanks!

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 12 Jan 2013 07:25:47 EDT

Hank posted :

said by linicx:

Welcome to rural America where faux telco pretends to serves the vast majority of small towns from coast to coast. It is the same problem regardless of who is blowing the smoke or where you live.

You are absolutely correct linicx. It makes no difference where you live Frontier is getting almost as good at telling tall tails as Mark Twain. Faux is a very good discriptor.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 12 Jan 2013 05:50:29 EDT

wesm posted :

said by Hawkerbacker :

The main thing driving me crazy is you see all the new functionalities occurring with Verizon Fios such as the xbox 360 integration and ios app with Frontier you can't do any of those. It's frustrating knowing the fiber has such capabilities and it just sits there stagnant.

If they sent me an ad saying "hey, we've added HBO GO, enabled the Xbox streaming application, and might have even licensed the FiOS live TV app from Verizon, but it'll cost you a three year contract and $15 more per month," I'd sign up for HBO (which I don't currently get due to no HBO GO) and all they ask right now. :D

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Sat, 12 Jan 2013 05:45:23 EDT

anon posted : The main thing driving me crazy is you see all the new functionalities occurring with Verizon Fios such as the xbox 360 integration and ios app with Frontier you can't do any of those. It's frustrating knowing the fiber has such capabilities and it just sits there stagnant.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 15:32:32 EDT

wesm posted :

said by EdmondsFios:

If Italian926 gets your sense of humor, this is going to become great reading material. I am also thrilled to hear that my new Tivo with Lifetime Service will no longer function with U verse and I will have to suck it up and go back to Comcast - for all my trliple play services.

Same here. I'm quite familiar with the software U-Verse uses for their TV-over-IP setup. It can be awesome, but AT&T has compressed the video streams so much as to be unwatchable for fast-moving content like sports if there is more than one HD stream going at a residence. I must be the last person on the planet who likes linear video--especially how FiOS does it, whether Frontier or Verizon--its quality and relatively simplicity.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 15:10:24 EDT

darcilicious posted :

said by linicx:

You have 35/35 and you are not happy? I will trade you every day for my 10/.512 and kiss your hand for your generosity..

You're entirely free to move to a FiOS (most of which are not rural). Otherwise, I'm not sure why you're posting a thread that has nothing to do with you...
--
♬ Dragon of good fortune struggles with the trickster Fox ♬

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:58:22 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : You can have GPON and BPON out of the same hub, so you may have GPON, but your next-door neighbor could be on BPON.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:57:43 EDT

linicx posted : Welcome to rural America where faux telco pretends to serves the vast majority of small towns from coast to coast. It is the same problem regardless of who is blowing the smoke or where you live.

You have 35/35 and you are not happy? I will trade you every day for my 10/.512 and kiss your hand for your generosity..
--
Mac: No windows, No Gates, Apple inside

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:44:38 EDT

Melakion posted : Is most of Frontier's FiOS really BPON? I'm on GPON, and would assume everyone else coming out of Everett is too. Maybe just the East Side is BPON?

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:32:40 EDT

darcilicious posted : And now that we've looped all the way back to the status quo, what's next for this thread? ;)
--
♬ Dragon of good fortune struggles with the trickster Fox ♬

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:31:45 EDT

vidvid posted : gpon upgrade was the plan - has been scrapped
vz 2012 deadline - has been scrapped
uverse content - has been scrapped

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:27:51 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : Thank you wes. ;)

For you to GET GPON though, you dont have to convert the entire network ! lol Just add GPON to existing hubs ! Holy moly. A simple concept wasvznowftr managers cant comprehend. lol

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:25:36 EDT

EdmondsFios posted : If Italian926 gets your sense of humor, this is going to become great reading material. I am also thrilled to hear that my new Tivo with Lifetime Service will no longer function with U verse and I will have to suck it up and go back to Comcast - for all my trliple play services.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:13:47 EDT

wesm posted :

said by wasvznowftr:

See, chawk and I both work for Frontier in the Everett, WA Northwest HQ where the vast majority of Frontier's FiOS customers are served (Washington and Oregon) and thought we were being helpful by dropping some inside info.

But clearly you have more information than we do. I'll keep an eye on this and other threads to learn more from the users here. That way the next time I get a company email or have some director tell my department in a meeting what the future plans are , I'll know they're just full of it.

Italian sure does have a way with words.

Your managers may be giving you accurate information, and they probably are. Personally, I have no reason to suspect that your managers are lying to you. The question still remains: Why would Frontier swap all currently-deployed BPON equipment for GPON when they are both 1) still installing new BPON equipment in customer environments and 2) there would be no benefit to doing so based on the current service offering?

I sincerely, fervently hope that Frontier actually is going to convert the entire network to GPON. I really, really want you to be right. Why? We might get 300/65. :D

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:58:57 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : LMAO, you have a paypal account? You want to BET Frontier does not migrate everyone off BPON? If they did make such a ludicrous choice, you should start sending out your resume to other companies.

Replacing not only ALL customers ONT's but CO PON cards as well. Then you have situations where ONT's are located within someones home, and you have to inconvenience the customer as well. Absurd.

BPON can handle 50Mbps per sub, possibly more, yet Frontier will force migrate everyone to GPON when like 90% of their overall footprint is still copper?

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:44:34 EDT

wasvznowftr posted :

said by ITALIAN926:

BPON ont's do not work on GPON CO equipment, the point is Frontier would not switch all customers off of BPON to GPON. Imagine having to revisit all customers, its absurd. People will get GPON as new customers or when they upgrade their speeds.

Sorry, italian.

Didn't know you had so much information.

See, chawk and I both work for Frontier in the Everett, WA Northwest HQ where the vast majority of Frontier's FiOS customers are served (Washington and Oregon) and thought we were being helpful by dropping some inside info.

But clearly you have more information than we do. I'll keep an eye on this and other threads to learn more from the users here. That way the next time I get a company email or have some director tell my department in a meeting what the future plans are , I'll know they're just full of it.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:45:36 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : BPON ont's do not work on GPON CO equipment, the point is Frontier would not switch all customers off of BPON to GPON. Imagine having to revisit all customers, its absurd. People will get GPON as new customers or when they upgrade their speeds.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:59:24 EDT

wesm posted :

said by wasvznowftr:

No. You misunderstood my original post.

All BPON customers will be force migrated to GPON beginning sometime this year.

That would be the height of lunacy. The ONT that they installed for me ~3 months ago would be replaced? Even Verizon doesn't do this and they actively market services that require GPON. A BPON ONT will still work with GPON equipment.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:41:56 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : That doesnt make any sense at all. Why would they waste all that equipment? Frontier is already having enough trouble making money, so they will migrate people unnecessarily? Please explain why it would be necessary to move ALL existing customers to GPON.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:24:25 EDT

wasvznowftr posted :

said by ITALIAN926:

and btw, if Frontier does adopt GPON or better widespread, not all ONT's get replaced, that would not be economical at all. They would install them on new and upgrading customers.

No. You misunderstood my original post.

All BPON customers will be force migrated to GPON beginning sometime this year.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:03:03 EDT

wesm posted :

said by ITALIAN926:

Wow, Uverse uses FTTP? Didnt know that. Exactly what percentage of Uverse subscribers are FTTP? .01% ? Who has more FTTP customers, Comcast, AT&T or Google?

Based on what I know of AT&T's network, Frontier has more FTTP subscribers than AT&T's U-Verse. ("FTTP subscriber" means someone served by fiber to their house, which AT&T does for greenfield U-Verse deployments. There is an ONT at those houses that does exactly what ours do: outputs a copper service.)

I suspect that the July 2012 deadline for linear video was a "deadline" for some sort of strategic partnership to get someone else to provide video service to Frontier's customers, thus not breaking all of those franchise agreements they didn't get out of. Since virtually every "cancel by" date has passed for Frontier in Washington state, they're stuck with the franchises. Since no one, including AT&T, wanted to do a video-only service on someone else's network, my theory is that linear video will remain as-is until management either figures out how to get out of the franchise agreements entirely (possible, but not likely, given how revenue-strapped some of these cities are) or the FiOS service goes back to Verizon.

Frontier FiOS going back to Verizon has been a theory of mine for the past few months, based on actions visible in the public sphere and the latest one has come to pass: First, the Reverse Morris Trust deadline that Verizon used to foist our areas onto Frontier has now passed. Those assets can be used in an RMT again without penalty. Second, Frontier now has business and customer service offices open in every market where Verizon does copper and FiOS, but with copper on a greater scale (e.g. semi-rural Texas). Third, at least in Texas, Verizon's copper service is being provided by GTE Southwest d/b/a Verizon Southwest of Texas, a regulated utility, which no longer officially provisions dial-tone services over the FiOS networks owned by Verizon Infrastructure. In one of Verizon's latest SEC filings, they continued to downplay the role of their copper network.

All of this added together means that Verizon is in a position to "trade back" for its former FiOS areas, leaving Frontier saddled with the debt Frontier incurred to take them along with the copper markets. Ergo, Frontier gets to do just copper (like it wants), and Verizon gets back FiOS markets in regions that would be wildly popular if not for the build-out costs in those relatively small areas. At least in Puget Sound, Verizon Wireless and Xfinity can still continue their partnership unabated because Seattle is covered by Comcast but not Frontier.

(Why did Verizon force Frontier to take the FiOS systems that Frontier obviously didn't want? My theory is to make the deal more palpable to Frontier shareholders... "We're getting an advanced network, too!")

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 23:10:58 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted : Wow, Uverse uses FTTP? Didnt know that. Exactly what percentage of Uverse subscribers are FTTP? .01% ? Who has more FTTP customers, Comcast, AT&T or Google?

and btw, if Frontier does adopt GPON or better widespread, not all ONT's get replaced, that would not be economical at all. They would install them on new and upgrading customers.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 23:00:20 EDT

wasvznowftr posted : Not quite sure what makes no sense to you.

AT&T has fiber to the home (fttp) in some areas. Their u-verse iptv video product is deployed over this network.

Frontier is looking to deploy some variation of u-verse over their fttp and conceivably the DSL network as well.

Not quite sure what makes no sense to you.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 22:47:29 EDT

Smith6612 posted : He's talking about U-Verse Lightspeed, which is a Fiber to the Home flavor of U-Verse which is closer to FiOS than DSL for delivery.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 22:27:03 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted :

quote:
U-verse can and already does run over FTTP.

That statement makes NO SENSE whatsoever.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 21:39:22 EDT

wasvznowftr posted : All that chawk has posted is pretty much accurate. Plans ARE in place to replace BPON equipment with GPON equipment.

Yes, that does involve a massive undertaking of replacing every BPON ONT.
I will go so far as to say that the manufacturer is Calix and that company has even designed their ONT to fit into existing Tellabs ONT closures.

Frontier has a number of areas that are already GPON served. The largest office in Oregon - Beaverton, has had both GPON and BPON equipment for years.

"Italian926's" misunderstanding is that U-verse video product is dependent on an FTTN DSL architecture. U-verse can and already does run over FTTP.

Frontier will be terminating their agreement to recieve the linear video product from Verizon soon. Don't ask me when because at one point it was a July 2012 deadline until it was extended.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 19:04:29 EDT

ITALIAN926 posted :

quote:
the company has a platform in place to increase the speed of FiOS to 1 Gbps to homes, McAdam said.

All that means is they have the network in place to offer Gbps, which is true being 100% fiber. The network can support Tbps, it doesnt mean youre gonna see it. Id be shocked if they upgrade beyond GPON this year.

quote:
My MISunderstanding is they will not renew their contract with Verizon but go with AT&T U-Verse instead.

Uverse is a completely different architecture, they will not replace their current FTTP with FTTN. They may replicate Uverse in other areas, but they surely wont scrap FTTP for FTTN.

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:54:23 EDT

darcilicious posted :

said by Chawk12:

Yes and new ONTs in many cases.

Huh. Seems unlikely to me then... but what do I know? :D
--
♬ Dragon of good fortune struggles with the trickster Fox ♬

Re: [FiOS] Frontier FiOS customers falling further and further b

Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:52:36 EDT

Chawk12 posted : Yes and new ONTs in many cases.