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swe3tdave
join:2008-02-01
Sainte-Catherine-De-Hatley, QC

swe3tdave

Member

[Connection Sharing] Neighbourhood network using powerline?

Hi, i was looking at powerline network adapters and i was wondering if you could use them to connect two house 200-300m apart. Lets say i use 600V/20A outdoor rated electric cable between the two homes. it looks like a cheap enough solution. would that work? anyone ever tried that?

Powerline----->PowerLine Adapter--->/200m electric cable/---->Powerline Adapter---->network2
network1-------------/\

Thane_Bitter
Inquire within
Premium Member
join:2005-01-20

Thane_Bitter

Premium Member

Given the distance, the snow, the risk of electrocution, shorts, lighting damage and insurance policy cancellation, have you considered something infinitely safer such as a pair of media converters and length of fibre cable? Throw in some conduit to protect the cable from damage and come spring you can bury it once the grown thaws.

Alternatively if you have a good line of sight between both buildings you could use wireless repeaters and small directional antennas.

tschmidt
MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Consolidated Com..
·Republic Wireless
·Hollis Hosting

tschmidt to swe3tdave

MVM

to swe3tdave
As Thane_Bitter See Profile posted why not use Wi-Fi? Seems a whole lot simpler even if you need to use directional antennas.

If you have your heart set on using power line are both dwellings served by the same transformer? If so there is a good chance it will work without having to string cable.

/tom
swe3tdave
join:2008-02-01
Sainte-Catherine-De-Hatley, QC

swe3tdave to Thane_Bitter

Member

to Thane_Bitter
ok, well obviously if i bury a cable, fiber optic would be a better choice.. i've never considered it because the price of ready-made outdoor fiber cable seems outrageous considering that if something happen with the cable i'm gonna have to replace the entire run.. i'm in a rural area and the cable would pass pretty close to the field where there is a lot a machinery in the summer that turns the soil around. Burial doesn't seem to be a possibility here unless i bury the cable 2 feet under or more.

i thought about using something like a cow fence with the cable a few feet off the ground, following the field... but, ok that's probably a very bad idea. what was i thinking... :P

Even with the field, i dont exactly have line of sight, there are a few trees blocking the view so wireless, i dont know, i have no idea of what i need here...

NetFixer
From My Cold Dead Hands
Premium Member
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Netgear CM500
Pace 5268AC
TRENDnet TEW-829DRU

1 recommendation

NetFixer to swe3tdave

Premium Member

to swe3tdave
Are you trying to share a common internet connection between multiple residences, or are you just trying to build a LAN for local sharing between multiple residences?

If you are just trying to make a neighborhood LAN, and each residence already has internet access, then a VPN would be an easier and better choice than either powerline networking or wireless links.

If you are trying to share a common internet access (and you are sure that your ISP isn't going to disconnect you if they discover what you are doing), there are wireless bridges that use ~900 mhz instead of WiFi frequencies, and that lower frequency has a further reach for the same power levels, and is not as effected by trees as is WiFi. I don't recall any specific brands or models, but you should be able to do a Bing, Google, or Yahoo! search to find information and sources for such equipment.

tschmidt
MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Consolidated Com..
·Republic Wireless
·Hollis Hosting

tschmidt to swe3tdave

MVM

to swe3tdave
While fiber is preferred due to lightning issues there are a number of long range Ethernet solutions that can exceed 100 meters. In that case you only need to run outdoor rated cable using small conductors, and install lightning protection at each location. The range extender acts as a bridge linking the two Ethernet networks. Don't know about Canada but here in the US copper is pretty expensive.

As mentioned running power line voltage is dangerous, and unless both residences are served by the same transformer life will get very exciting if you inadvertently connect the far end of the cable to AC power.

In order of preference I'd try some form of wireless. As NetFixer See Profile posted the lower frequency stuff has better vegetation penetration. If that does not work, assuming you have access to rights-of-way between both locations, try a wired solution.

As has been pointed out depending on how you intend to use the connection may run afoul or your ISP's AUP. If they find out my decide to cut you off. If you decide to run copper need to check on the effect it will have on homeowners insurance. Many years ago we took a couple of lightning hits, one to the pole mounted power transformer and another a tree used to anchor a long wire shortwave antenna. The antenna was made out of 12 Awg copper wire and was vaporized. Did minor structural damage to the house and took out most of the electronics. Our homeowners insurance took care of it but I have no idea what would have happened if damage was caused because we had strung wire to our neighbor.

I don't mean to rain on your parade. What you want to do is possible, but it needs to be engineered properly.

/tom
Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium Member
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ

Kearnstd to swe3tdave

Premium Member

to swe3tdave
the lower frequency radio methods using directional antennas is likely a good starting point. With the advantage of no wires or fibers to risk damage of.
cramer
Premium Member
join:2007-04-10
Raleigh, NC
Westell 6100
Cisco PIX 501

cramer to swe3tdave

Premium Member

to swe3tdave

it looks like a cheap enough solution

Unless that spool fell off a truck, that shit is about as far from "cheap" as you can get. Those adapters aren't designed to be stand-alone powered; they get power from the grid into which they're dumping their signal. Your plan is creating a 600ft long extension cord. (and isn't likely to work over that distance anyway.)

As others have pointed out, there are much more readily available options that are far less of a lethal kludge... wireless, long reach ethernet, dsl bridge, fiber...
switchman
join:1999-11-06
ARRIS SB6183
(Software) OPNsense

switchman to swe3tdave

Member

to swe3tdave
A couple of these should work.
»www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti- ··· tation+M

They also have a 5Ghz version that may be better in your application.

Don't forget the POE injector:
»www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti- ··· c_text_y
swe3tdave
join:2008-02-01
Sainte-Catherine-De-Hatley, QC

swe3tdave

Member

Yeah i thought about ubiquiti nanostations. They do look great. But my closest neighbor is just the closest point of a network of about 5 or 6 houses inside a 2km wide area i would like to build for a few folks that can't get a real broadband internet connection. The reason why i was starting to look for cabled solutions is that these people are hungry for netflix hd streaming and things like that. They all live in an area much higher then me, about 70m to 110m higher... But they are surrounded by trees... i thought about 900mhz, but i'm not sure its gonna be fast enough for what they want to do.

anyway this is all assuming that i can get a fast enough connection from a provider that would actually let me do this... But even if i have access to cable internet where i am. To get the speed and bandwidth that would be needed for them, i might have to build a 30km network with a bunch of 200m towers.. And well, basically, i dont care that much about their connections problems to even think about going there...

Thanks everyone for all the help but i'm gonna wait for "IP over Hyperspace" or something...