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vue666
I love Lanny Barbie
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Halifax, NS
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Memorial UniversityStudents can't identify continents on map

There is something wrong when university students can not even identify North America or the Atlantic Ocean on a blank map....

»www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundl···115.html

But not surprised as we as a society now spend more time & money on entertainment and escapism then on education and enlightment...

Expand your moderator at work


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to vue666

Re: Memorial UniversityStudents can't identify continents on map

I remember in school we had maps that were not labelled. There were many kids that could not find North America. I was astounded at how stupid they were (my exact thoughts at the time).



ekster
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I don't get it, I figured that, if anything, people should know these things better now because of computers and Internet as it takes 2 seconds to find a place on a map, and everyone is constantly exposed to people from across the world...



Kardinal
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said by ekster:

I don't get it, I figured that, if anything, people should know these things better now because of computers and Internet as it takes 2 seconds to find a place on a map, and everyone is constantly exposed to people from across the world...

True, but it would require *retaining the info* after one has looked it up, and that seems to be a fading skill. If everything is at one's fingertips, why bother trying to learn/remember when "I can just Google it when I need to know".
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Thane_Bitter
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reply to ekster

said by ekster:

I don't get it, I figured that, if anything, people should know these things better now because of computers and Internet as it takes 2 seconds to find a place on a map, and everyone is constantly exposed to people from across the world...

That's the osmosis theory of learning, don't teach, just show stuff to kids and they will learn on their own. Forget theory, knowledge and facts, all kids should be able to formulate complex ideas, relationships, and theories without any tools or underpinning logic. Naturally, why know anything when the answer can be found nearly instantly either from a computer, smart phone or someone else.

Once you couple that with today’s classroom and student management "you get a gold star just for coming to class! / you failed but welcome to the next grade" the end result is a generation which started off being curious but ignorant and successfully transformed them into utterly stupid narcissistic beings full of want.

PX Eliezer7
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reply to ekster

Memorial University Students suffer from incontinence

GPS devices in particular have lead to:

a) Decrease in map-reading skills.

b) More subtly, a decrease in understanding how things fit together geographically.

With a GPS, a young person can easily drive from Ottawa to Montreal, then on to Quebec City. But to understand that the direction of travel is east and then northeast, is not consciously thought of or recognized.

And a young person might make this trip a hundred times, yet not be able to find these cities on a map....



elwoodblues
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Unfortunately that's what technology brings, makes people "stupid' as they don't need to think.

I can't count the number of times I've watched people look at the cash register to see what change they need to provide, when I've already calculated the amount in my head.

I will admit there are times in which I'm just plain lazy and will use a calculator instead of doing the math in my head.
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ekster
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reply to PX Eliezer7

I know that it can make people lazy. I know some people who have been driving for 10+ years and still don't know the 4 major highways in Montreal that every single one of them takes at least twice a day... and I grew up with Google and all the other technologies, I have a GPS that I've occasionally used, and I still find that it actually helps me know the city better because I could easily look at the map and have a dot telling me where I am that helps me associate the area even better.

Same as in high school, when Google was just launched (and I think we had yahoo or altavista that was the hot thing prior to that?), I found that having all that information so easily accessible helped me learn more as I could get all the answers in seconds. I didn't even need to try and learn, or remember anything, as a small part always just stuck... and when you're constantly looking at things, that small part becomes big.

I understand someone mixing up some smaller countries in Europe or Asia... but continents? There aren't that many, and they are all shaped very uniquely. Hell, you don't even need to know the shape of all of them to know that Africa has to be in the south because it's so hot there. How can anyone even think of placing Africa in the north? :\


PX Eliezer7
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said by ekster:

I understand someone mixing up some smaller countries in Europe or Asia... but continents? There aren't that many, and they are all shaped very uniquely.

Depressing, isn't it....

Geopolitics is so important to understanding the world.


loosedobbs

join:2006-06-13
Toronto

said by PX Eliezer7:

said by ekster:

I understand someone mixing up some smaller countries in Europe or Asia... but continents? There aren't that many, and they are all shaped very uniquely.

Depressing, isn't it....

Geopolitics is so important to understanding the world.

Not depressing and not surprising. at least to me. I have people in office who think Ottawa is in Quebec.
But people laughed when I posted here. I think we know more about US than Canada.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
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Peterborough, ON
reply to elwoodblues

said by elwoodblues:

Unfortunately that's what technology brings, makes people "stupid' as they don't need to think.

No, it only makes people retain and analyze information they need or want in their daily life and is not a reflection of their intelligence.

I'm sure a teenage "twit" to you could rhyme of a stack of facts, figures and analysis about the latest fashion and social venues relevant to her in which you are utterly and completely ignorant.

peterboro
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reply to PX Eliezer7

said by PX Eliezer7:

Geopolitics is so important to understanding the world.

Having lived in the US I will point out that Americans have to be the most clueless group of people on this earth when it comes to anything outside their country. Heck even their county or state for that matter. Except you of course.

PX Eliezer7
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said by peterboro:

Having lived in the US I will point out that Americans have to be the most clueless group of people on this earth when it comes to anything outside their country.

This is very true....

If the American people OR their leaders had any understanding of the history of the Afghanistan region (it's not accurate to call it a "country") then we could have been spared much grief.

How arrogant of us to think that we could have succeeded where the British Empire and the Soviet Union both failed....

---------------------------------------

Understanding how things "fit together" is so important, from Quebec's situation in Canada, to Iran's strategic location in the middle east, to understanding that Oman has an exclave [Musandam] that controls the Strait of Hormuz, to the current dangerous island disputes between China and Japan, to the always festering Kashmir (India and Pakistan), to the fact that Russia has an exclave [Kaliningrad] that's now surrounded by NATO/EU countries....

The kids won't get this by plodding from point A to B to C on a GPS, like a Colour By Numbers.


Anav
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reply to vue666

Re: Memorial UniversityStudents can't identify continents on map

Too funny the spouse and I listening to that looked at each other and said simultaneously OMFG we are becoming the US. LOL

Seriously as alluded things like GPS dont help. Worse than that is the lack of general knowledge unless its media related. To me the real culprit are things like facebook. When I was a kid I was outside running around or inside perusing stacks of encyclopedias frome time life to ancient civilizations etc...... Nowawdayd kids spend free time watching youtube of stupid things or looking at pictures of themselves or facebooking it. ----- a euphism for taking information and advice from a like minded group of peers instead of from their parents and certainly not expanding their knowledge base or range of interests.
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loosedobbs

join:2006-06-13
Toronto
reply to PX Eliezer7

Re: Memorial University Students suffer from incontinence

said by PX Eliezer7:

said by peterboro:

Having lived in the US I will point out that Americans have to be the most clueless group of people on this earth when it comes to anything outside their country.

This is very true....

If the American people OR their leaders had any understanding of the history of the Afghanistan region (it's not accurate to call it a "country") then we could have been spared much grief.

How arrogant of us to think that we could have succeeded where the British Empire and the Soviet Union both failed....

---------------------------------------

Understanding how things "fit together" is so important, from Quebec's situation in Canada, to Iran's strategic location in the middle east, to understanding that Oman has an exclave [Musandam] that controls the Strait of Hormuz, to the current dangerous island disputes between China and Japan, to the always festering Kashmir (India and Pakistan), to the fact that Russia has an exclave [Kaliningrad] that's now surrounded by NATO/EU countries....

The kids won't get this by plodding from point A to B to C on a GPS, like a Colour By Numbers.

well said. After Sep 11 incident Canada joined the fight and there was a debate in office about this. I was against this and told them story of Alexander the great. I was ridiculed and seen as a traitor and terrorist supporter by some of office friends . Most were from NF I have to say.

But people who dont know history ( or geography as in OP) have no clue what he heck they say and think. Or people who dont learn from history or geography pay very high price.

Now about those who failed the geo lesson in OP, will have very good managerial like or VP like posts. These things don't matter when you grow up. I see them here in few years posting such lesson/knowledge don't matter.


EUS
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reply to vue666

Re: Memorial UniversityStudents can't identify continents on map

Saw this over the holidays, »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy and as I'm a fan of Clarke, Heinlein, and of course Asimov, I'm afraid that the future may turn out to be more like idiocracy, and not like that proposed by any of those fine writers.
--
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nonBell

@steadfastdns.net
reply to vue666

I heard it on the radio. One particular person who said he traveled to Spain but couldn't find it on the map. That is sad - traveling to me is a way to know more about the world, and if the person did not bother to learn where he is going, why bother? (Even going to warm resort areas, I tried to go to ones where it is not just beach and resorts).



lugnut

@communications.com
reply to vue666

Considering we all learned the 7 continents and 5 oceans in grade 4 geography, I have to ask, "WTF are they teaching kids today in elementary schools?"

Imaginary self esteem?

Advanced sharing?

Tournament Nintendo?

Or are the schools leaving it all up to PBS and videogames to teach the kids nowadays? Where in the World is Carmen Sandiego?

I tell ya, I'm just sooooooooooooooo damned happy I never had any kids of my own. It would bust my hump to realize I was paying a sh*tload in school taxes to teach my kids that every problem could be solved by pushing the right buttons.


peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

said by lugnut :

I tell ya, I'm just sooooooooooooooo damned happy I never had any kids of my own.

Until you spend your last years a lonely desolate lost soul.

PX Eliezer7
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reply to EUS

said by EUS:

Saw this over the holidays, »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy and as I'm a fan of Clarke, Heinlein, and of course Asimov, I'm afraid that the future may turn out to be more like idiocracy, and not like that proposed by any of those fine writers.

Asimov's story "The Feeling of Power": People could not do ANY arithmetic without a calculator/computer, they didn't even know they had the capacity.

Cyril Kornbluth's 1951 story "The Marching Morons": Sounds like that "Idiocracy" movie you saw was ripped off from this story.

Another Kornbluth story that overlaps: "The Little Black Bag".

John D. MacDonald's "Spectator Sport" (1950):
See here for a discussion:
»thetrapofsolidgold.blogspot.com/···ort.html


lugnut

@communications.com
reply to peterboro

said by peterboro:

said by lugnut :

I tell ya, I'm just sooooooooooooooo damned happy I never had any kids of my own.

Until you spend your last years a lonely desolate lost soul.

Having kids is no guarantee that you won't be lonely. I know a lot of people who haven't traded more than 5 words with their kids in the past 30 years.


A Lurker
that's Ms Lurker btw
Premium
join:2007-10-27
Wellington N
reply to vue666

I'm not surprised at all. I took a travel course a couple of decades ago. One of the segments was geography. Identifying all provinces, states, capital and/or major cities (generically placing them close to where they were) was a requirement. ie. it's more important to know where NYC is than Albany. The same was done for the other continents, although less detail for some areas. Airport codes as well were required.

Now, you have a group of people in the room who (you would think) are interested in travel since they want to work in the field. Most were clueless. Of course, for a long time I kept a couple of blank maps and coloured in where I'd visited. There's a couple of online versions of the same idea kicking around.


peterboro
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Peterborough, ON
reply to lugnut

said by lugnut :

said by peterboro:

said by lugnut :

I tell ya, I'm just sooooooooooooooo damned happy I never had any kids of my own.

Until you spend your last years a lonely desolate lost soul.

Having kids is no guarantee that you won't be lonely. I know a lot of people who haven't traded more than 5 words with their kids in the past 30 years.

Ok there is a pretty good chance, and very likely, you will spend your last years a lonely desolate lost soul.


EUS
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canada
reply to PX Eliezer7

Feeling of Power, I remember that short story.
I have not read Kornbluth...
--
~ Project Hope ~



horsey

@eastlink.ca
reply to vue666

said by vue666:

There is something wrong when university students can not even identify North America or the Atlantic Ocean on a blank map....

»www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundl···115.html

But not surprised as we as a society now spend more time & money on entertainment and escapism then on education and enlightment...

WOW what a great vid that prof is spot on. We need more teachers like her.
My pet peve is math...Are we that hard up for carpenters in Halifax we give them calculator's?
One of my all time fave math vids.

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-QA2rkp···A2rkpBSY


koira
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reply to ekster

Re: Memorial University Students suffer from incontinence

said by ekster:

I know that it can make people lazy. I know some people who have been driving for 10+ years and still don't know the 4 major highways in Montreal that every single one of them takes at least twice a day...

But do they reach their destination? I think this is a bad analogy, if you have a decent sense of direction you can find your way without knowing the name of the road. I do this all the time going to the cottage , take all kind of backroads knowing which is north and which is east and sensing direction from the daylight. But i cant tell you the names of the roads.


Kitlope

join:2004-07-29
Edmonton, Ab
reply to Thane_Bitter

Re: Memorial UniversityStudents can't identify continents on map

said by Thane_Bitter:

said by ekster:

I don't get it, I figured that, if anything, people should know these things better now because of computers and Internet as it takes 2 seconds to find a place on a map, and everyone is constantly exposed to people from across the world...

That's the osmosis theory of learning, don't teach, just show stuff to kids and they will learn on their own. Forget theory, knowledge and facts, all kids should be able to formulate complex ideas, relationships, and theories without any tools or underpinning logic. Naturally, why know anything when the answer can be found nearly instantly either from a computer, smart phone or someone else.

Once you couple that with today’s classroom and student management "you get a gold star just for coming to class! / you failed but welcome to the next grade" the end result is a generation which started off being curious but ignorant and successfully transformed them into utterly stupid narcissistic beings full of want.

It's like the old skill of remembering phone numbers. Shit, I think in my mid teens in late 80s early 90s I remembered 30 or 40 numbers for different family and friends. Today I can still remember a few of them even though I haven't called them in 20 years. Now I can barely remember my own 2 numbers, as all the work is done for me within the address book of the phone.


vue666
I love Lanny Barbie
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reply to vue666

I resemble that remark....



urbanriot
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reply to vue666

said by vue666:

There is something wrong when university students can not even identify North America or the Atlantic Ocean on a blank map....

I disagree. I feel it's meaningless.

I could identify tiny islands on a map and tell you what languages they speak and the primary religion, if one exists, but it's only useful to me as geographical facts were a necessary aspect of my job a while back. Now... they're just trivia.

Some people feel that history is important. I know plenty about wars in other countries and how they effect the current political climate and how today's citizens in foreign lands feel about wars they won / lost generations ago... but North American trivia? I knew there were wars and I know some names that were involved, but I couldn't tell you what the years were or who won what war.

As far as I'm concerned, it's all trivia unless it has a direct application on your life. Eventually you hit an age where all that information is replaced with other information anyhow. I was a decent C / C++ coder in the early 90's and now I doubt I could complete a hello world function without googling.