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NOYB
St. John 3.16
Premium
join:2005-12-15
Forest Grove, OR
kudos:1
reply to Mele20

Re: Windows 8 is blocking Linux-based recovery environments


That's why I ended by saying this:
"make sure it can easily be turned off in the BIOS"


Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

1 recommendation

reply to Smokey Bear

Re: Windows 8 Secure Boot proves problems for Acronis True Image

This all reminds me greatly of the driver fiascos with Vista. Microsoft blamed vendors for being late to the party with Vista-compatible drivers, vendors blamed Microsoft for slowness in spec releases and approvals, OEMs blamed both of them for problems with Vista on their computers, and the poor user who had problems was left to flounder around and try to pick up the pieces however he could, including frequenting forums like these. It was one of the key reasons Vista was less than a blinding market success.

With things like the SecureBoot issue, Win 8 is lining up in the same vein... and unless both the OEMs (at least any that don't bless or permit BIOS tweaking, such as Dell) and Microsoft get their acts together and end up on exactly the same page about SecureBoot, they'll all end up losing out in eventual sales dollars. Word gets around, even if it's only partially correct. And if word gets out that many Win8 systems won't boot properly after a hard-drive or major software catastrophe, the damage will be done across the board, regardless of who's primary fault it is or even whose computer brand it is. And Win8 will be guaranteed a position right up there with Vista and Win98ME, deservedly or not in each case.
--
“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.” A. de Tocqueville

microcomp

join:2001-01-30
Santa Rosa, CA
reply to Smokey Bear

Re: Windows 8 is blocking Linux-based recovery environments

This is a problem I recently experienced when I tried to clean-up my Windows 8 install due to problems with several programs and then couldn't boot from my True Image 2013 Recovery CD to load my backup. I did find the secure boot setting in the BIOS and turned that off but that still didn't work. I then had to change the UEFI setting in the BIOS and sure enough I could finally boot from the CD. Unfortunately with the UEFI setting changed the system no longer recognized my external backup drives where my True Image backups were saved. So now what are we supposed to do to use True Image to make backups that can be accessed from a boot CD. The program for me has become useless as I guess any other backup program that uses a boot CD. Microsoft really didn't think this through when creating Windows 8 and how it was going to effect all these software programs. I now have no backup solution that runs from CD which is what you need when you drive fails and there is no software available on the hard drive. Any ideas of what will work for backups now?
Expand your moderator at work


nwrickert
sand groper
Premium,MVM
join:2004-09-04
Geneva, IL
kudos:7
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
reply to Smokey Bear

Re: Windows 8 Secure Boot proves problems for Acronis True Image

I guess I never noticed this thread before today.

I purchased a box with Win 8, in February.

A few days later, I decided to take an initial Acronis backup, since the computer did not come with recovery disks.

I inserted the Acronis CD and booted, then hit F12 during boot to get a BIOS boot menu. The system booted straight into Windows.

I went to the BIOS, turned off secure boot. I again booted and hit F12. The Acronis CD was there among the choices. I booted it, and backed up the system to an external drive. Then I turned secure boot back on.

This does not seem a problem to me.

More recently, I installed opensuse 12.3. I was able to do that with the system entirely in secure boot mode. As far as I know, the same is possible with Fedora and Ubuntu. If Acronis wants to base its recovery environment on a distro with secure boot support, they could probably do that easily. Or, leave it as it is. I don't see a problem with turning off secure boot for backup/recovery purposes.
--
AT&T Uverse; Buffalo WHR-300HP router (behind the 2wire gateway); openSuSE 12.3; firefox 20.0


Ian
Premium
join:2002-06-18
ON
kudos:3
reply to Blackbird
said by Blackbird:

Is there any imaging software product that doesn't currently face this Win8/SecureBoot barrier that requires BIOS intervention to resolve... especially in case of a drive/hardware failure?

I wondered the same thing.

The entire feature is more or less designed to prevent booting non Windows 8 operating systems. An Acronis recovery disk fits the general definition of "not Windows 8", since it uses Linux.

Now Microsoft might counter with "No no. It's a security feature! Really!" But it doesn't really matter.

I agree though that the people we're talking about here that would be tripped up is probably pretty limited. The number of people knowledgeable enough to know how to image their system, but don't know how to make a fairly simple bios adjustment I would wager is a pretty small group. And a simple google search of the problem will in due course, turn up this workaround in seconds.

If I were Acronis, I'd be plastering this warning far and wide.

That said, the time to verify that your backup method is behaving as it should, is not "after my system crashes". You should make sure your recovery media is bootable before it needs to be.
--
“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong


HA Nut
Premium
join:2004-05-13
USA
Yeah Ian, I wonder this too.

A month or 2 ago, I tried to boot a Clonezilla CD in the only Win 8 machine I've had the (dis?)pleasure to work with. It would not boot until SecureBoot and UEFI were disabled.

I understood what was wrong but as you note, many users would not.


Bluefish
Premium
join:2010-02-23
I just wanted to point out that this has been fixed by Acronis (well, at least in my case it was) for anyone that has a UEFI bios and wants to use Acronis. I have a Sony Vaio T Series Ultrabook and tried to create recovery disks using Vaio Care and no matter what I did I could not create all the disks. The create recovery disk utility in Vaio Care would not recognize most of the DVD's I tried to use to create the disks, even though outside of the utility these same disks were recognized fine by Windows 8 and I was able to write to them. Sony Chat support was telling me to do things I had already done to try to fix the problem, so I gave up on creating the recovery disks and made a system image with Acronis. After I was done creating the SI, I tried to boot to Acronis and could not because of Secure Boot. I googled and found a patch which I downloaded, installed and created a new bootable Acronis CD and then was able to boot from the Acronis disk I had created. »kb.acronis.com/content/38965.

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:5
So Acronis finally signed their loader! That is good news.