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jasontaylor

join:2010-11-17
Kensington, MD
reply to MURICA

Re: [HD] Is Verizon lying about HD?

Another excellent post in this thread by Murica:

"... This makes little sense."

But does any of this make any sense? Remember, as I pointed out what, over a year ago on my twitter feed, this is the same company that removed the DVD and AUX buttons from their remotes because customers who didn't have surround sound systems complained they didn't know how to turn off their TVs, when a key reason to have FIOS is 5.1 audio in the first place (as opposed to Netflix+Hulu+, which at the time was stereo only), which indeed usually requires having a non-tv, non-set top box power ON/OFF capability.



PhoenixDown
FIOS is Awesome
Premium
join:2003-06-08
Fresh Meadows, NY
kudos:1
reply to jasontaylor

Its possible that Verizon is not receiving the content in HD from Oxy. Could be a lot of reasons for that, contractual and otherwise as opposed to say technical issues within the FIOS network or on how services are delivered in the home.



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to jasontaylor

quote:
But does any of this make any sense? Remember, as I pointed out what, over a year ago on my twitter feed, this is the same company that removed the DVD and AUX buttons from their remotes because customers who didn't have surround sound systems complained they didn't know how to turn off their TVs, when a key re
This is actually true, no matter what your opinion is. I heard dozens of customers complaining about those remotes, and I hated them as well. One point though, they should have BOTH versions available for the few that need to control additional components.


jimmybouy

@verizon.net
reply to jasontaylor

said by jasontaylor:

Another excellent post in this thread by Murica:

"... This makes little sense."

But does any of this make any sense? Remember, as I pointed out what, over a year ago on my twitter feed, this is the same company that removed the DVD and AUX buttons from their remotes because customers who didn't have surround sound systems complained they didn't know how to turn off their TVs, when a key reason to have FIOS is 5.1 audio in the first place (as opposed to Netflix+Hulu+, which at the time was stereo only), which indeed usually requires having a non-tv, non-set top box power ON/OFF capability.

sorry i didnt read ur twitter tweets from today or yesterday much less a year ago. people with high end systems tend to use remotes that come with the system rather than a cable remote.


Greg2600

join:2008-05-20
Belleville, NJ
reply to jasontaylor

The multi-function remotes definitely cause "difficulties" for the less tech savvy. Plus they were becoming outdated with some newer sets not having working codes. Plus the new remotes probably are cheaper for VZ to have produced.

As for IPTV, the key is the coming FIOS Media Server. This will be Verizon's standard going forward. But the move to IPTV is going to require a great deal of infrastructure hardware changeover which Verizon probably still has quite a bit to do.



thetruth

@verizon.net
reply to jasontaylor

said by jasontaylor:

Last night we had to watch the lance armstrong interview in low def. It was extremely painful and I may need to see an eye doctor, as my eyes are still hurting.

HAD to watch it? Did someone hold a gun to your head? IF it was so painful, why did you continue?

said by jasontaylor:

I'm sorry if this q is in the faq. But in the threads I just skimmed about Fios' HD channel selection, I'm getting mixed and contradictory data. One set of arguments, which are themselves buried deep in threads with hundreds of unrelated posts, say Fios has trouble paying subscription fees for HD vs. cheaper SD fees.

Subscription fees from FiOS to programmers is same if they pick up SD, HD, or both.

said by jasontaylor:

The other set of arguments says there is a data limitation on how many hd channels fios can carry. But I was thinking about this. I know fiber can carry a ton of data. According Fios's own marketers, that's supposedly why the PQ is highest on Fios. So the argument also makes little sense to me, unless Verizon is lying.

There is a limitation to how many HD can be carried. That is why they don't carry junk like OWN in HD. Did anyone including you watch OWN before last night?


jamiepoon

@verizon.net
reply to jasontaylor

said by jasontaylor:

Thanks guys. But is my q really answered? Hmmmm.

Ok, given the lack of a clear answer, perhaps I need to rephrase the q. Warning: this rephrasing is not for the math impaired.

1 HD channel is 4 mbps.
1 fiber optic cable is 26 Tbps.
1 terabit is 1048576 megabits.

Therefore, 26 Tbps / 4 mbps = 26 *1048576 / 4 =6815744 = about 7 million.
Therefore, 1 fiber optic cable can handle 7 million HD channels of data.
Ooops. I messed up. Silly me. I’m such an idiot. I forgot to subtract out my intense 30 Mbps data usage. Ok, so the actual # is (26*1048576-30) / 4 =6.999999 million. That’s a huge difference.

i may be math impaired but im not tech impaired. hd channels are 10-19mbps. where do u get the 4mbps figure from?


oprahslaw

@verizon.net
reply to jasontaylor

said by jasontaylor:

Very very nice posts by almost everyone. I'm very thankful. My rexpectations were high, then let down by the 1st post, and then surpassed by wide margin with that internal verizon gif. I guess, correct my quick skimming please, but the short answer is that yes, verizon was pulling the wool over my eyes again, all this pq stuff is bs, since the fiber to the curb is irrelevant, with the coax network being the real bottleneck. I should have known, since, if it is at all possible I'm being duped, it has to be the case that I'm being duped, since I'm extra gullible. (Jason's law.) (I'm selling my livestrong tees on ebay as we speak. I was the 2nd last person to get the news.) So it is sorta moca actually since that's related. (I was meaning by moca=retarded coax network, including qam crap, since they interfere and both take bandwidth anyways.)

I'll nver understand any of this. Gave up long time ago. But, if I try, just to please those kind enough to respond to my post, I'm still confused. I mean, if it were me, and I were verizon's presdent, I'd ditch the coax bs network, all this QAM BS, all this moca bs, and just allow fiber into the home, so we have each set top box with a pure IP TV. Unlimited boxes, no problems with any limits, no bs. High enders would pay $$$ to get everything in HD. No mess. Perhaps I'd watch japanese anima in hd all night long. Simple. VZ rakes in $$$$. CEO smokes cigars, orders hokkers, pizza, retires to island, pays off fat divident, etc., everyones happy and his hokkars can eat.

Clearly I'm an idiot, since they aren't doing that. Please explain. What am i missing. Are onts just too $$$?

Jason

if u were verizons president u would ditch all the bs qam,moca,coax? well that would mean the $20billion invested in fios would have been wasted and i would have to change out equipment in homes of my 5 million customers. no smoiking cigars for the fired president for wasting money. all this complaining because u couldnt watch oprah in hd?

jasontaylor

join:2010-11-17
Kensington, MD
reply to jamiepoon

"where do u get the 4mbps figure from?"

I got it from a website forum discussion. You're correct, it's off by about a factor of 3 or so. If I had more time I'd edit the original math post to let future readers know of the error, but DrDrew and others also pointed out this error.



icemannyr1

join:2001-04-11
Township Of Washington, NJ

You can still order the 4 button remote from the FiOS Accessories Store.
FiOS TV Remote Control (4 Device) $11.99
»www22.verizon.com/FORYOURHOME/GO···quipment

Whatever Verizon's plans are it would be nice if they announce something with moving to MPEG4 or IPTV soon.


PJL

join:2008-07-24
Long Beach, CA
kudos:2

said by icemannyr1:

...Whatever Verizon's plans are it would be nice if they announce something with moving to MPEG4 or IPTV soon.

Unfortunately Verizon doesn't announce anything until it happens. They used to, always missed the dates, got burned for it, and stopped.


ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

Not true actually, I saw a youtube video on Home Media Server like last year. LOL

Home Media Server is a fairly large change in architecture. Wouldnt it have been nice if any installs going forward were IPTV delivery for the new setup?

Does Uverse have cable cards for Tivo's?



DrDrew
So that others may surf.
Premium
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:12

2 edits

said by ITALIAN926:

Does Uverse have cable cards for Tivo's?

No. Tivos are not compatible with Uverse since it's all IPTV and doesn't use CableCARDs. I guess they could release a software client to run on the Tivo...

That might be a future problem on FIOS too if they roll out IPTV... unless they release Tivo compatible client software. Hmmm.... "TV Everywhere"

PJL

join:2008-07-24
Long Beach, CA
kudos:2
reply to ITALIAN926

said by ITALIAN926:

Not true actually, I saw a youtube video on Home Media Server like last year. LOL

They announce something but do not give an implementation date. To me, "plans" includes dates; "future services" alone would not. Semantics.

yyzlhr

join:2012-09-03
Scarborough, ON
kudos:2
reply to jasontaylor

Anyone know why FiOS didn't launch with IPTV from the get go? That would've given them the ability to virtually carry as many HD channels as they want and if anyone has the capacity to deliver IPTV it would be FiOS. If AT&T and other telcos can do it adequately over copper, Verizon can certainly do it over a fibre last mile. I can't see TiVO and retail STBs being the deciding factor to not go the IPTV route as MSOs don't like supporting 3rd party devices to begin with.



DrDrew
So that others may surf.
Premium
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:12

1 edit

IPTV wasn't ready for prime time. Backend systems couldn't handle it and end user client software wasn't available when FIOS launched several years ago.

AT&T spent their money creating a scaleable IPTV system and couldn't really afford to replace then last mile infrastructure. Now they're stuck with a mediocre service that has limited video streams, bandwidth, and quality per home. They don't have a lot of ways to fix it without upgrading the last mile infrastructure.

Verizon spent their money on replacing the last mile infrastructure, then overlaid a standard digital video distribution service over it. They have plenty of ways to push more channels over it. They can benefit from most of the advances and tech the rest of the cable industry has developed. It's a matter of costs in which way they do it and if the channels are worth the investment.


guppy_fish
Premium
join:2003-12-09
Lakeland, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to jasontaylor

All Verizon has to do is go 100% Mpeg4, they already use it, but for cost reasons are keeping the 6000 series in service. Once they make the switch, they will have all the capacity they need for more channels.

Verizon is just running the numbers, they have determined they make more NOT having every HD channel ... its a simple as that


MURICA

join:2013-01-03
reply to jasontaylor

Google Fiber is an example of doing it right. They carry the high definition feed, if there is one available, of every channel they carry. And their IPTV boxes support MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 so they do not re-encode anything at all. They just pass through what the network sends whether it's MPEG-2 or MPEG-4. They've got some HD rarities on that lineup like 3net, the C-SPANs, NASA, and Sprout because they have unlimited space.

Maybe Verizon should ask Google for some tips? Google has already stated that their goal with Google Fiber is not to dominate the entire American ISP industry but rather to force the current players to roll out FTTH. This is why they haven't been selecting Verizon FiOS territories.

I'm sure they'd be glad to help Verizon out as Verizon is the only one who has done what Google is wanting.



ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

Are you joking? Verizon has been doing FTTP for almost ten years, and they need to ask Google for advice? Lets be serious here.

Google has the luxury of using tech and infrastructure a decade more advanced. Big deal to what theyre doing in KC

Oh, and lets not forget that Google has like 200 TV subscribers. LOL .. tips.

Expand your moderator at work

jasontaylor

join:2010-11-17
Kensington, MD
reply to MURICA

Re: [HD] Is Verizon lying about HD?

"They've got some HD rarities on that lineup like 3net, the C-SPANs, NASA, and Sprout because they have unlimited space."

This thread is making me more and more upset at vz. I used to work at nasa. The point, at least for my area, was to get *good* pictures of stuff in space using space telescopes. Do analysis of pics, etc. And now, it's given back to the masses in low def? It's a little ironic. Ticks me off. How's pizza in kansas?



kennedyspace

@verizon.net

low def? what is that? i know about standard def and high def. can anyone get jobs at nasa? even if you have no technical skills?

said by jasontaylor:

"They've got some HD rarities on that lineup like 3net, the C-SPANs, NASA, and Sprout because they have unlimited space."

This thread is making me more and more upset at vz. I used to work at nasa. The point, at least for my area, was to get *good* pictures of stuff in space using space telescopes. Do analysis of pics, etc. And now, it's given back to the masses in low def? It's a little ironic. Ticks me off. How's pizza in kansas?



DrDrew
So that others may surf.
Premium
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:12
reply to jasontaylor

said by jasontaylor:

Do analysis of pics, etc. And now, it's given back to the masses in low def? It's a little ironic.

Many of the NASA pics I can download off their website are well above HD resolution of 1080x1920... so HD wouldn't do it justice.

NASA is nice enough to stream all of their channels (they have more than one) content and more from their website, not much of a need for a dedicated TV channel much less three.

It's ala carte IPTV and accessible from any internet provider for free.
--
If it's important, back it up... twice. Even 99.999% availability isn't enough sometimes.

MURICA

join:2013-01-03

Internet streaming video really isn't up to par with a proper HDTV feed.

said by ITALIAN926:

Are you joking? Verizon has been doing FTTP for almost ten years, and they need to ask Google for advice? Lets be serious here.

Google has the luxury of using tech and infrastructure a decade more advanced. Big deal to what theyre doing in KC

Oh, and lets not forget that Google has like 200 TV subscribers. LOL .. tips.

Clearly, they do need Google's advice. Verizon's speeds are pretty sad for a fiber product. Every other fiber to the home service around the developed world was doing symmetrical 100 Mbps by the mid-2000s; now the majority of FTTH projects are able to deliver symmetrical 1 Gbps. 1 Gbps fiber like Google Fiber is common in Japan & South Korea.

Verizon FiOS has been a consistently subpar fiber product when compared to the fiber projects launched by other companies and foreign governments.

Verizon's TV service needs a complete overhaul because it just isn't up to snuff. It's not taking advantage of fiber's capacity. Duplicating all the limitations of copper cable over fiber optic wire is a sad state of affairs here in the year 2013.

I like FiOS. It's definitely ahead of the rest of its American competition. But it is still under-performing due to mismanagement on Verizon's part.


ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:2

Wow, you should apply for CEO, and hop in your time machine while youre at it.



bohratom
Jersey Shore is back again.

join:2011-07-07
Red Bank NJ
reply to MURICA

said by MURICA:

Google Fiber is an example of doing it right.

Doing it right?

Guess U never heard of sports channels that 50% of viewers appreciate....
Expand your moderator at work

batsona
Maryland

join:2004-04-17
Ellicott City, MD
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
·Vonage
reply to jasontaylor

Re: [HD] Is Verizon lying about HD?

Sooo.. The limitation here is the RG6 coax connecting to the STB, where VZ is only utilizing 860Mhz (~810 usable) correct? Mathematically, that does limit the number of QAMs, as was seen in an earlier post.

Any Dish implementation uses RG6, and the signals come off that dish somewhere between 1,000 and 1,500Mhz, right? Plus... Any VZ installer makes sure that the coax cabling has good integrity anyway.. why not allow the use of ~1.5Ghz of space, instead of the current 860Mhz on that coax?

One reason is that they might not trust the integrity of that cabling, since attenuation increases with the higher frequency...

Expand your moderator at work