Topic 'Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage' in forum 'Comcast Cable TV' - dslreports.com

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Fri, 01 Feb 2013 11:25:18 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : Plug in the external drive and see what happens, that's what Comcast told me to tell customers, LOL
The 3400 series aren't officially supported so it's uncertain on performance and stability. Comcast says "sometime this year"

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Fri, 01 Feb 2013 10:08:30 EDT

jack b posted : Do you have the "a30" software, if so, it might.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Fri, 01 Feb 2013 09:36:58 EDT

davidros posted : External DVR Storage in pompano beach fl dcx3400,, do we know when it will be enabled?

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 13:23:53 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : True, however I was talking about the cable going out after the box has fully booted and everything has already been loaded.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 13:16:12 EDT

yhp posted :

said by Mike Wolf:

I agree with the network issue problems. As I've said before, what if the cable goes out and the DVR can't access the cloud storage, and Comcast decides to disable the internal drive for recording purposes, customers won't be able to access any recordings at all till the cable comes back on. At least with local storage they can still watch all their recordings.

I'm not sure that's exactly true.

After a cold boot, you can't access local DVR recordings on a DCX3400 until the software has "phoned home" and verified what services you are signed up for. Even then, it takes a while to do anything except hit the "MENU" button and see a message that services are being restored. So, what we have today is all the risk and service interruption of the cloud, with none of the benefits.

(Exception: I have seen a recording-in-progress get right back to business, even before DVR service was accessible from the menu.).

So while I haven't tried it, my guess is that you can't bring up a box disconnected from the xfinity mothership and watch recordings on the hard drive.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 13:06:43 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : I agree with the network issue problems. As I've said before, what if the cable goes out and the DVR can't access the cloud storage, and Comcast decides to disable the internal drive for recording purposes, customers won't be able to access any recordings at all till the cable comes back on. At least with local storage they can still watch all their recordings.

I think the program data you mentioned is actually stored on vram because when the power is lost and restored the box has to reload all 14 days.

I like the idea of being able to offload or master dump the entire DVR content into the cloud, swap boxes, and reload back onto the new DVR.

I'd like to think that in this day and age Comcast can stream the content of the drive over the web to other devices (sorta like TiVo can do or Slingbox can do)
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 12:32:21 EDT

mariod posted : I think we'll have hardware storage for the rest of our lifetimes, actually. If you go cloud only, you have a lot of network connection issues that are insurmountable.

I think cloud as backup/overflow storage is the best solution. If you switch STBs, you put it all in the cloud and then pull it back when you bring home the new box. If you go on vacation, you send everything to the cloud to be watched remotely, and leave the local HD empty so it has capacity to record everything while you're gone.

But the best solutions are always the simplest, and that would be to keep local storage as well. Hell, 500gb of storage is crazy cheap now anyway, its not like the harddrives are some great cost to making STBs, since they need a hard drive for guide software and program data et al.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 11:48:22 EDT

teddystacker posted : @mariod

I agree , storing a users recorded data in their cloud would mean much less data storage on Comcast's end. It will be very interesting to see what route they actually take.
I for one will be keeping my hardware storing DVR for as long as They let me , but in the end I guess they will move everyone to cloud storage , so they can have as much control over the process as possible. As Apple have done , these companies want the user to have less and less control where possible.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 11:39:05 EDT

mariod posted :

said by teddystacker:

You may be correct , I was basing my 2-3 week "guess" on two factors:

1) The reputation Comcast has had for many years for not quite exactly giving its Customers "value for money".

2) To store 100's of Channels in real time for both SD and HD for a six month time frame will require some pretty funky data storage. Even though many of the more popular titles they will already have stored as part of their existing VOD services.

You are right about the legal implications though , I had not given that a thought , I wonder what ABC will think about Comcast storing all their content for weeks/months at a time..

Another thing to think about is that they will have to edit out the commercials for all these shows , as I am sure they will just not capture each programs raw , as that will mean commercials being intact.

I know there are theories that they will have one copy of each show that we'll all access.

But what if it simply is just cloud storage of your recording? Would it really take that much space? If they put a 6 month expiration date on anything in the cloud, and we all use local DVRs as primary storage, I think we're overestimating how much cloud storage would actually be needed.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 11:29:02 EDT

teddystacker posted : @yhp - Well said , when I connected my External 2TB drive to my "un supported" DCX3400 I am actually expecting it to fail at any time , just as I am with the internal drive that's almost Four years old :-)

Getting the most of of these devices and pushing them to their limits (without doing anything illegal) is what gives people like me a buzz , I have never been and never will be a "off the shelf" person. But I have the greatest respect for those people that are scared they may loose all their recorded seasons of Desperate Housewives or Katie.... but in the real world they run about the same risk as I do , The so called "support" people at Comcast or WD don't have much chance of recovering data once the bearing in a drive fail as they often do..

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 11:14:27 EDT

yhp posted :

said by Mike Wolf:

Your mileage may vary. »forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-···7#M65656

Thanks for the direct URL. I was aware that the DCX3400 hadn't passed testing. LOL'ed this:

quote:
The exact issues observed are actually confidential and proprietary.

where "confidential and proprietary" == embarrassing.

The Comcast DVR model as is is to keep the single internal drive spinning 24/7 unless you remove the Motorola STB from a power source. Failure is not only an option, it's pretty surely an inevitability.

I figure my newly purchased external has a good year of service in it. My DCX3400, however, is old enough that if this were my home desktop system, I'd be busy about replacing the drive simply because it's time. Losing recordings is part and parcel of any DRM-controlled ecosystem. It goes with the territory.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 10:52:07 EDT

THZNDUP posted :

said by mariod:

said by SpHeRe31459:

said by mariod:

http://forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-and-Equipment/New-Features-for-Scientific-Atlanta-Cisco-Cable-Boxes/m-p/1535557#M63740

Our goal this year is to be able to use the cloud for DVR recordings.

So, again, is it really worth $100 out of pocket for such a short time?

Oh I see you're back to crap all over the idea of an external hard drive based on some very tentative language in a couple of comments by Comcast again, eh?

There are a few key pieces to pay attention to in your quote:
1. "our goal" -- it is not in any way a given
2. "this year" -- it's still January, that means they have until December to make it work, if it even sees the light of day in broad deployment at all in 2013.
3. There is no mention of target footprint for this "goal", that means that there could simply be an expanded beta test by year's end and it would satisfy the criteria of the very non-specific nature of his comment.

Remember Ted is basically being nice and giving those of us who are more interested in the bleeding edge a preview of things that are in testing, not necessarily something that is imminent for deployment to the masses.

So how about, as I said in a previous comment, you stop pointing out a feature that is effectively non-existent at the moment (cloud DVR storage) and telling us we're all a bunch of fools for being interested in expanded local capacity. You've said your piece many times over in this thread.

Actually, I brought new information to the table. You're the one blindly parroting yourself.

Go ahead and waste your money, I don't care. But stop acting like its such a brilliant decision.

said by Zoder:

said by beachintech:

If you have SA/Cisco equipment, you can already do this.

We're Motorola.

Hummmmmmmm.........
--
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 10:48:58 EDT

teddystacker posted : You may be correct , I was basing my 2-3 week "guess" on two factors:

1) The reputation Comcast has had for many years for not quite exactly giving its Customers "value for money".

2) To store 100's of Channels in real time for both SD and HD for a six month time frame will require some pretty funky data storage. Even though many of the more popular titles they will already have stored as part of their existing VOD services.

You are right about the legal implications though , I had not given that a thought , I wonder what ABC will think about Comcast storing all their content for weeks/months at a time..

Another thing to think about is that they will have to edit out the commercials for all these shows , as I am sure they will just not capture each programs raw , as that will mean commercials being intact.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 09:39:26 EDT

mariod posted :

said by SpHeRe31459:

said by mariod:

http://forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-and-Equipment/New-Features-for-Scientific-Atlanta-Cisco-Cable-Boxes/m-p/1535557#M63740

Our goal this year is to be able to use the cloud for DVR recordings.

So, again, is it really worth $100 out of pocket for such a short time?

Actually, I brought new information to the table. You're the one blindly parroting yourself.

Go ahead and waste your money, I don't care. But stop acting like its such a brilliant decision.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 09:36:23 EDT

mariod posted :

said by teddystacker:

My guess about cloud storage DVR is that they will only allow you to store recordings for a short period of time (2-3 weeks) before it "expires". For many people this is fine , but I for one have some recordings on my DVR that go back months. Somehow I cannot see dear old Comcast letting us store months worth of data - hope I am wrong :-) . But thinking about it they are not actually storing "your" data on their servers just a link to a file they have recorded for you , with the amount of data involved and Comcast not exactly have a great rep for being generous to its Customers I would still say 2-3 weeks would be the limit..

Considering that federal copyright law also prohibits you from storing recordings after you've watched them, you're likely correct. But I highly doubt it will be just 2-3 weeks. People taking a 10 day vacation would fall victim to such a short time span. More likely something like six months.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 02:33:35 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : I kinda feel forced to warn to just be careful because the 3400 isn't officially supported yet(there are apparently bugs and undesired behavior with this model) and recordings could possibly be lost. Your mileage may vary. »forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-···7#M65656

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 31 Jan 2013 00:34:03 EDT

yhp posted : DVR Extender service is apparently alive and well in Center City Philly.

said by jblues:

Also available at Amazon:
»www.amazon.com/Book-Expander-eSA···extneder

This is the one that just arrived on our doorstep from Amazon today. $99, I put it on my powered-on DCX3400 (340GB on the internal drive), followed the prompts, and it was a breeze. Went from north of 90% to 21%.

My service area is Center City Philly, and about 4-5 GB of recording went to the new device just this evening. Software version on the Motorola is A30/R25.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 30 Jan 2013 21:32:47 EDT

SpHeRe31459 posted :

said by mariod:

http://forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-and-Equipment/New-Features-for-Scientific-Atlanta-Cisco-Cable-Boxes/m-p/1535557#M63740

Our goal this year is to be able to use the cloud for DVR recordings.

So, again, is it really worth $100 out of pocket for such a short time?

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 30 Jan 2013 20:52:06 EDT

Mike Wolf posted :

said by mariod:

http://forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-and-Equipment/New-Features-for-Scientific-Atlanta-Cisco-Cable-Boxes/m-p/1535557#M63740

Our goal this year is to be able to use the cloud for DVR recordings.

So, again, is it really worth $100 out of pocket for such a short time?

With the way Comcast does things, it's going to be years before it's seen everywhere.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 30 Jan 2013 20:51:19 EDT

Mike Wolf posted :

said by teddystacker:

I can beat that, my mother had movies and multiple seasons of Showtime and HBO shows on her 8300 from 2006 to 2012 before the internal hard drive blew up in December.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 30 Jan 2013 19:34:48 EDT

The Q posted :

said by mariod:

http://forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-and-Equipment/New-Features-for-Scientific-Atlanta-Cisco-Cable-Boxes/m-p/1535557#M63740

Our goal this year is to be able to use the cloud for DVR recordings.

So, again, is it really worth $100 out of pocket for such a short time?

do you really think that X1 with cloud DVR will be available to everyone and all areas this year? I don't and that's why I have have an external DVR now. For me it's worth it.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 30 Jan 2013 17:30:25 EDT

teddystacker posted : My guess about cloud storage DVR is that they will only allow you to store recordings for a short period of time (2-3 weeks) before it "expires". For many people this is fine , but I for one have some recordings on my DVR that go back months. Somehow I cannot see dear old Comcast letting us store months worth of data - hope I am wrong :-) . But thinking about it they are not actually storing "your" data on their servers just a link to a file they have recorded for you , with the amount of data involved and Comcast not exactly have a great rep for being generous to its Customers I would still say 2-3 weeks would be the limit..

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:34:24 EDT

mariod posted : »forums.comcast.com/t5/XfinityTV-···7#M63740

Our goal this year is to be able to use the cloud for DVR recordings.

So, again, is it really worth $100 out of pocket for such a short time?

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Sat, 26 Jan 2013 22:34:24 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : Glad everything is working for you. I do feel I have to caution others that everyone's mileage may vary and not everyone may have the same quality of results. The AV hard drives from Western Digital and Seagate (such as the one built into the DVR) are designed specifically for audio and video use and constant buffering and spinning 24/7 so the use of any old hard drive not designed for said abuse may fail faster or not have the correct spin speed. From what I've discovered the Seagate AV drives spin at around 5900rpm and the Western Digital AV drives are dynamic.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Sat, 26 Jan 2013 18:36:41 EDT

teddystacker posted : I have been around long enough to know that people do not usually like "cross posting" in different threads , but I have done so here as I think this info will be of great interest to those that want to add a external drive to their Motorola DCX3400 DVR and also people that do not want to buy the "official" (and more expensive) extender.

OK , so we got the A30 Guide update here in NE Philly (19111) around Tue 22nd 2013.

I have Motorola DVD DCX3400 , it is not listed on the "supported" list of DVR's that Comcast issued a while ago , but still thought I would give it a try after reading the other posts at this thread and some others.

I used a old 1TB WD Green Series SATA 11 hard Disk that I had laying around my workshop , and also a $30 USB Enclosure that also has a ESATA port on it.

All works Perfectly , as soon as the drive spun up , a message came on screen and asked me if I wanted to format the External drive , I said YES , and this took about 10 seconds. My available space for recordings on the DVR then dropped from 47% to 9%!

I then installed a 2Tb Seagate Hard disk into the enclosure that I also had spare and my available space went from 47% to just 5%!

All new recordings from that point on, were made to the New 1.0TB drive , if this drive is switched off and you try and play those "new" recordings , a message on screen prompts you to switch on/connect the external drive (it says the Hard disk model number).If you do this, the recordings then play perfectly.

All previous recordings you made before you installed the external drive are available when the external is switched off and play perfectly.

So to conclude:

1) You do not have to use the WD Extender "approved" external drive - you can just use a El cheapo external enclosure as long as it has a external ESATA port on it. I tried it with both a 1.0TB WD Drive and a Seagate 2.0TB Drive , both worked perfectly.

2) All works perfectly (for me anyway) as along as you have the New A30 guide on the Motorola DCX3400.

3) If the External hard disk breaks down or you have to swap out the main DVR for any reason, you will loose any recordings you have made on the external hard drive (as the recordings made on the external are tied to the serial number of the DVR) - but that's just the risk we take I guess.. but its a risk I am very willing to take,in order to have 2.35 TB of recording space compared to the pathetic 350gb I had before.. in my case this cost me very little as I had the hard disk and enclosure laying around doing nothing.

Please feel free to ask any questions...

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 15:03:32 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : I'm still pleased to see on that second image the hard drive temperature. I wonder if the "max temp" is the temp the drive got to at some point, or if it's the temp threshold the drive is capable of for it to be within normal operating parameters. I wonder if I connect my Seagate DVR External drive to a Motorola box if it will list the "airflow temp" along with the drive temp as it does on a computer.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 14:54:34 EDT

Mike Wolf posted : I ment that it doesn't seem like it's a clear cut square image on the first pic.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 13:45:10 EDT

yhp posted :

said by jack b:

With the a30 update it works.

Not also a firmware update? I've never seen the menu screen you provided a snap of.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 12:17:35 EDT

jack b posted : With the a30 update it works.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 12:03:41 EDT

yhp posted : Interesting. Official Motorola documentation says the DCX3400 is supported.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 11:53:31 EDT

jack b posted :

said by Mike Wolf:

For Motorola customers with the A30 guide and using an external drive, do these features appear?

The only dialog box that appeared when I connected the drive was alert #1, asking to format the drive.

For what it's worth, prior to connecting the external drive, I had turned off and unplugged the DVR. I powered up the external drive, waited a minute then powered up the DVR. Nothing happened.

The blue power button blinked once then the DVR wouldn't respond to the remote or start up manually.

So I disconnected the eSATA cable then turned on the DVR, it started up OK. I plugged in the eSATA cable and right away alert #1 dialog box appeared.

I don't recall seeing the success dialog, but the drive is registered and my DVR recording capacity percentage went from something like 75% full to 12% full.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 11:33:42 EDT
jack b posted : If you're referring to the wavy lines they are probably just moire pattern artifacts created from the camera angle.

The panel doesn't have them while direct viewing it.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 10:21:39 EDT
Mike Wolf posted : What happened on the first picture on the lower right corner? jack b?

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Thu, 24 Jan 2013 09:05:26 EDT
Mike Wolf posted : Came across this. »www.motorola.com/Video-Solutions···ps_US-EN
For Motorola customers with the A30 guide and using an external drive, do these features appear? »www.motorola.com/staticfiles/Vid···uide.pdf Is the external drive utility accessible?

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 23 Jan 2013 23:35:48 EDT
Streetlight posted : Your suggestion that a saved item in a VOD is interesting but the result might appear to produce exactly the same result for the sub as what I suggested. In either case one of the problems with a cloud storage might be Comcast's retransmission rights. That is, VOD material is usually up for a limited time for selection whereas what is implied by storing media is that it's available forever unless the user deletes it. For a home cable box, once the hard drive is near full something has to go to provide space for any new items. CC may limit the amount of cloud "storage" customers may use. On the other hand, if something "stored" is made available for many (thousands, millions?) folks and only one copy is actually on CC's servers, why limit subs as to what's available. This suggests that everything broadcast on all CC's channels should be permanently available to all subsibribers. This would again result in the same kind of problem Netflix has had with content producers allowing it to send out disks or stream content. Even there, Netflix's catalog of content seems to change so some stuff comes and goes and may not be always available .

It seems to me that DVRs are great for time shifting entertainment, but not for permanent storage. If cloud DVRs come about it's likely to mean some limitation on the amount of "storage" to enable time shifting only. If one wants permanent access to a particular item one either must purchase it on DVD or Blu-Ray or record it oneself. I don't know of any Blu-Ray recorders but there are options for capturing stuff on DVD disks. Or, get as many $100 external disk drives as needed, but then you can only get your stuff back if you still have the DVR from which the recordings were made. The content producers will still be in control of what's available.
--
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 23 Jan 2013 22:45:40 EDT
SpHeRe31459 posted :
said by Streetlight:
Comcast's storage might not be quite so colossal if they're smart about how they store customers' data. It's possible that they could store only one copy of a "recording" any number of customers wanted to store and tag each item with unique cable box identifiers such as its MAC address for those customers who wanted to access the item. The cable box would only need to access a data base table making the connections between saved items and customer cable box. There's likely to be a lot of redundancy of saved programs by 22 million customers. I think this is the way Amazon, or is it Google, is saving online music files for its customers. This is likely the way Amazon "saves" purchased books for Kindle users rather than multiple copies of the same book for its millions of users.

Yep, that's a pretty reasonable way for an MSO to do it, and that's actually one of the legality issues that Cablevision encountered, though they technically won the ability to keep using remote storage, it's still a hotly contested feature. The DVR copy is supposed to be a person's fair use right to make a single copy for timeshifting purposes. Various content providers argued that if the cable company holds the copy then the cable company is in effect retransmitting the content and without paying extra licensing fees, etc.

There is also debate that to uphold the idea of a fair-use copy when using remote storage, a copy for every person that scheduled the recording must be kept separately, to keep the remote DVR concept in the same spirit as a traditional local DVR.

There is another proposed solution which is similar but different in a significant way: the "recording" is really a placeholder in the DVR menu which actually just sends the user the OnDemand version of the episode. The cable company already has an agreement in place to have the episode in their VOD library so it wouldn't get the content providers up in arms about retrans agreements. As we know, the OnDemand version is not the same thing as one recorded on a DVR, many times the OnDemand version has advertisements that cannot be skipped, and often the quality is lower (especially for less popular channels). And of course the OnDemand library is rather limited in comparison to the number of linear channels available.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 23 Jan 2013 04:28:49 EDT
Mike Wolf posted :
said by Streetlight:
Comcast's storage might not be quite so colossal if they're smart about how they store customers' data. It's possible that they could store only one copy of a "recording" any number of customers wanted to store and tag each item with unique cable box identifiers such as its MAC address for those customers who wanted to access the item. The cable box would only need to access a data base table making the connections between saved items and customer cable box. There's likely to be a lot of redundancy of saved programs by 22 million customers. I think this is the way Amazon, or is it Google, is saving online music files for its customers. This is likely the way Amazon "saves" purchased books for Kindle users rather than multiple copies of the same book for its millions of users.
This sort of sounds like a type of On Demand or Netflix thing, I think.

said by Streetlight:
I may have been the person who started to conversation about re-purposing the hard drive that might be used as a DVR extender for external storage on a computer. I think several folks in this thread have it right - it's a possibility that might be very useful. As I understand it, this hardware has both SATA and USB ports, but I don't know which version of either.

Both the $99 version and the $129 version are identical, including both having the dual interface. They literally are identical, only the part number being different for marketing purposes so they can charge more. I go into detail about it here »Re: DVR Extender w/Moto Boxes

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 23 Jan 2013 04:17:10 EDT
Mike Wolf posted :
said by mariod:
said by Mike Wolf:
Yes, but then you wouldn't be able to use it with the DVR in the meantime, so you'd be losing out on the added DVR capacity. I'd think It would be smarter to get the DVR extender so you can use it with the DVR and then when it may no longer be needed, you can then use it on the computer or whatever.

You're being weird about this.

The point was not to use it as an external hard drive simultaneously.

I said, it seemed like a waste to spend $100 for an external HD that would be defunct in a couple years.

Someone else said "but when its no longer used with your STB, then you can just use it as a external to your computer"

All I'm pointing out is that if I was going to use it as an external to my computer, I can get an HD for much cheaper, so that post-defunct functionality isn't really of much value.

Yes that's true however you'd still be missing out on the added capacity on the DVR in the meantime, so it would be a smarter option to go with the dual interface My Book AV, even at the added cost.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Wed, 23 Jan 2013 01:27:53 EDT
Streetlight posted : Comcast's storage might not be quite so colossal if they're smart about how they store customers' data. It's possible that they could store only one copy of a "recording" any number of customers wanted to store and tag each item with unique cable box identifiers such as its MAC address for those customers who wanted to access the item. The cable box would only need to access a data base table making the connections between saved items and customer cable box. There's likely to be a lot of redundancy of saved programs by 22 million customers. I think this is the way Amazon, or is it Google, is saving online music files for its customers. This is likely the way Amazon "saves" purchased books for Kindle users rather than multiple copies of the same book for its millions of users.

I may have been the person who started to conversation about re-purposing the hard drive that might be used as a DVR extender for external storage on a computer. I think several folks in this thread have it right - it's a possibility that might be very useful. As I understand it, this hardware has both SATA and USB ports, but I don't know which version of either. Anyway, wrt computers, particularly laptops, having the new solid state drives with relatively low capacity and high price, fast external storage is probably a must and SATA being particularly fast would serve very well for this purpose. External drives with SATA ports are likely more expensive than those with only USB, even USB 3. It appears that the solid state drives can wear out from multiple writes, but not reads, so they're great for the OS and application software, but not the swap file or data storage that may be updated frequently. Desk top computers typically have room for multiple drives but the newer style laptops seem to place an emphasis on being so thin and lightweight that having both an SSD and spinning drive crammed in is impossible.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 23:07:54 EDT
Mike Wolf posted : One of the reasons why I like the Motorola boxes, it shows the hard drive temp. Congrats on the successful install.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 18:32:29 EDT
Russ posted : There is no guarantee that Comcast will actually provide DVR recordings in the cloud or if they do when it will be available to every customer. Currently, Comcast is doing a small scale test of this in Boston.

For example, the TiVo interface was ported to the Motorola DVRs years ago and was offered to customers in the New England area. This option was never expanded beyond the New England area. Now, Comcast has a deal with TiVo to allow certain TiVos to access Video on Demand, but its in only a few markets.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 18:23:45 EDT
SpHeRe31459 posted :
said by mariod:
All I'm pointing out is that if I was going to use it as an external to my computer, I can get an HD for much cheaper, so that post-defunct functionality isn't really of much value.

Actually you seem to be missing the point. We're all well aware that there are cheaper (and probably better too) solutions for external computer data storage.
That's not the point. The point is if you like idea of expanded DVR storage right now, today (assuming you have the A30 update), $100 seems pretty reasonable for lack of hassle of trying to swap out a DVR for a newer model that has a larger hard drive (but still won't be as large as a DVR with the 1TB expander drive connected).

So then if it ever comes to pass that this cloud DVR storage thing happens, oh well you've had the utility of the 1TB of DVR storage for what's likely years to come (at least 2 years), so big deal you've paid $100 for 2 years of greatly expanded DVR storage and then you can re-purpose it for data storage at that point in time.

It's not that you can use it for data storage now, which is what you keep talking about with the price comparisons to other external hard drives, it's that hey you paid $100 and yeah it was eventually made obsolete, but it still has standard PC/Mac compatible interfaces on it so it can still be re-purposed into computer data storage duties, it isn't a proprietary piece of hardware and it isn't something you have to give back to the cable company.

As an aside, I can't see why you are so hung up on this DVR Expander drive thing. So what? let people spend $100 on it, if you think you know better, so be it, don't buy one.

Cloud DVR storage is a lot easier said than done. Aside from the legal issues about holding copies of a person's recordings in the cloud (which may or may not be considered a fair use copy) the biggest issue from an end-user perspective is the bandwidth required to make it work just like local storage. An hour of HD recording is roughly 7GB an hour, so that could use up your broadband data cap pretty quickly. Let alone the other issues with trying to get remote storage to behave as quickly as local storage to pausing, playing, fast forwarding, etc.
Then there's the nightmare of the cable company side, where the data storage demands would be colossal.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 16:12:36 EDT
mariod posted :
said by Mike Wolf:
Yes, but then you wouldn't be able to use it with the DVR in the meantime, so you'd be losing out on the added DVR capacity. I'd think It would be smarter to get the DVR extender so you can use it with the DVR and then when it may no longer be needed, you can then use it on the computer or whatever.

You're being weird about this.

The point was not to use it as an external hard drive simultaneously.

I said, it seemed like a waste to spend $100 for an external HD that would be defunct in a couple years.

Someone else said "but when its no longer used with your STB, then you can just use it as a external to your computer"

All I'm pointing out is that if I was going to use it as an external to my computer, I can get an HD for much cheaper, so that post-defunct functionality isn't really of much value.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:42:03 EDT
jack b posted : I just installed a new WD external drive to my moto DCX3400 DVR and it worked!

Powered down the DVR, hooked up the eSATA cable, powered on the WD, then the DVR. A dialog box appeared asking if I wanted to format the external drive, and chose yes.

Done.
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Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:27:27 EDT
Mike Wolf posted : Yes, but then you wouldn't be able to use it with the DVR in the meantime, so you'd be losing out on the added DVR capacity. I'd think It would be smarter to get the DVR extender so you can use it with the DVR and then when it may no longer be needed, you can then use it on the computer or whatever.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 12:02:01 EDT
mariod posted :
said by Mike Wolf:
Um, the Western Digital My Book AV DVR Expander has both USB and eSATA connections, so it can still be used on a computer or other device with USB.
I'm not sure why anyone would be mentioning a My Book Essential for DVR backup due to it only having USB.

You're still missing the point.

Someone posted that if DVR goes to the cloud, then you have an extra external HD to use as backup for your PC.

My point is that I can get an extra backup external for my PC for much cheaper than the one required for use with a DVR.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 10:26:50 EDT
Mike Wolf posted : Um, the Western Digital My Book AV DVR Expander has both USB and eSATA connections, so it can still be used on a computer or other device with USB.
I'm not sure why anyone would be mentioning a My Book Essential for DVR backup due to it only having USB.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Tue, 22 Jan 2013 09:14:04 EDT
mariod posted :
said by The Q:
pretty sure you need a drive with esata and not USB for the comcast DVR.

That's my point. You're paying more for an external HD that isn't even USB, making it less functional to then start using with a computer when cloud storage arrives.

Re: [DVR] External DVR Storage

Mon, 21 Jan 2013 23:38:01 EDT
yhp posted :
said by mariod:
said by yhp:
My point was that $100 for a TB of DVR storage now (mariod's rhetorical question) is a great deal when compared to playing waiting and service games with Comcast.

Except you're not paying $100 for a TB of storage.

I already have 500gb of storage.
And I have 340GB on my DCX34xx.

Some customers have only 250GB on their DCX34xx.

You're paying $100 for GBs 501 through 1501. For only a year or two before its defunct. Is that really worth $100??
I don't get a chance to watch a lot of TV. So I "record" lots of interesting things and delete many unseen because the occupancy on my 340GB drive is pretty reliably north of 90%. That's life with Comcast today.

Someday, when Comcast's awesome technology renders my purchase "obsolete" (LOL) "a year or two" (your words) from now, I will have had a "year or two" of not thinking for even a minute about what shows to delete or whether I should really record something in standard-def to save space.

It's an annoyance. In 2012, it's an insult. It takes time. Time adds up. It's easily worth $100.

YMMV.