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deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas

Best Tires On Back Axle

I went to Discount Tire and they wouldn't rotate my tires. Has 3/32 on front and 6/32 on back. I read up on the reasoning of having your best tires on back due to under-steer on front and over-steer on back. That makes sense to me.

3/32 is pretty worn(I can see all of Lincoln's head) so I told them to order me two tires. They said they will have to put the new ones on the back. The back ones still have 54.5 of their thread left. What makes this crazy is according to their rules I will not be able to get them rotated in 5-6000 miles as they will be worn more than the back. So I will have to leave them there until they are worn out then buy two new ones and have them put on the back.

The thing is I am going to probably get a new car in 6 to 8 months and would like to not have to buy two more new tires at over $200 a pop before this which I wouldn't have to if I put the new ones on the front.


pmohr
Premium
join:2002-09-22
Maryville, TN
Generally speaking a tire store will refuse to put tires near or at the tread wear limits on the rear axle due to exactly that, people not knowing how to counter oversteer in wet conditions.

3/32" is just barely over the tread bars, 6/32" really shouldn't be a problem.

Any reason you don't just go to another tire store?


deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas
I checked with the tire store I usally buy from and they said they would put them where I want them. As I said I will probably trade this car off in about 6 to 8 months and if I can put the new ones on the front and just leave them there the backs one will still be decent.

I called DT today and cancelled the order from them.
Expand your moderator at work


TheTechGuru

join:2004-03-25
TEXAS
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reply to deke40

Re: Best Tires On Back Axle

Anytime I'm at Discount Tire Co I demand the tires be put where I want them. I always want the new pair on the front because I may drift from time to time and don't want to ruin the new tires.

I have jacks, stands, impact, and torque wrench to rotate them at home if need be.
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Beezel

join:2008-12-15
Las Vegas, NV

1 recommendation

reply to deke40
Steering tires should generally have the better tread. When in wet weather less tread equals easier chance of hydroplaning for starters. In our commercial heavy fleet when the front tires get to 6/32 they go to the rear and new one on the front.


deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas

1 edit
Your train of thought is like mine was. Here is an article that changed it.

If the front tires have significantly less tread depth than the rear tires, the front tires will begin to hydroplane and lose traction on wet roads before the rear tires. While this will cause the vehicle to understeer (the vehicle wants to continue driving straight ahead), understeer is relatively easy to control because releasing the gas pedal will slow the vehicle and help the driver maintain control.

However, if the front tires have significantly more tread depth than the rear tires, the rear tires will begin to hydroplane and lose traction on wet roads before the fronts. This will cause the vehicle to oversteer (the vehicle will want to spin). Oversteer is far more difficult to control and in addition to the initial distress felt when the rear of the car starts sliding, quickly releasing the gas pedal in an attempt to slow down may actually make it more difficult for the driver to regain control, possibly causing a complete spinout.

The two main points were understeer and oversteer and one being harder to control.

Since the tires I wanted left on the back were at 6/32nds I was willing to take the chance because the front ones wear at a very fast rate when on the front on my particular car.(HHR) I figured if I put the 6/32nds ones on the front like DS wanted they would be wore out before I trade the HHR in late in the year.

This info was from this link:

»www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/···echid=52

Notice the third paragraph. It is what I am striving for but actually not a good idea. But it fits my purpose. Although I rotated mine every 6k they still ended up with the ware they are talking about.


TheTechGuru

join:2004-03-25
TEXAS
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And if the tires aren't rotated at all, it's likely that the rear tires will still have about 1/2 of their original tread depth remaining when the front tires are completely worn out.

Funny, my rear tires wear out faster than my front tires. Oh wait, my car is RWD.
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deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas
reply to deke40
Steering, acceleration and braking are my wear factors where your RWD should factor in on mostly acceleration. I can scratch the fronts ones very little with only 172HP available and a wife that goes all door handle grabbing with a hard start.


SysOp

join:2001-04-18
Douglasville, GA
reply to deke40
Logic? Why not just buy 4 new tires or buy a new car already?


deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas
said by SysOp:

Logic? Why not just buy 4 new tires or buy a new car already?

With 54% left on the rears one that would be very wasteful and I am waiting on the 2014 CX5 to come out before buying a new car.

Also I am not Daddy Warbucks and on retirement for the last 18 years.

Bob4
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
reply to deke40
I don't care what the experts say. In a front wheel drive car, I want the tires with the most tread on the front.


TheTechGuru

join:2004-03-25
TEXAS
kudos:2
Reviews:
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reply to SysOp
said by SysOp:

Logic? Why not just buy 4 new tires or buy a new car already?

In this economy only people with credit can afford to get all 4 tires at once, that's nearly $800 for most non subcompacts to get a decent quality brand.
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CompTIA Network+ Certified


deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas
said by TheTechGuru:

said by SysOp:

Logic? Why not just buy 4 new tires or buy a new car already?

In this economy only people with credit can afford to get all 4 tires at once, that's nearly $800 for most non subcompacts to get a decent quality brand.

$840 to be exact for 215/50R17 95V XL 440 AA A Bridgestone Turanza Serenity Grand-Touring All Season including lifetime balancing.(09 HHR)


Cho Baka
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-23
there
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Reviews:
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reply to Bob4
said by Bob4:

I don't care what the experts say. In a front wheel drive car, I want the tires with the most tread on the front.

Well, I have had a few FWD cars with new tires (or snow tires) on the front.

Making a left turn with one at moderate speeds saw a reaction similar to trailing throttle oversteer in the snow. Very unpredictable and not at all easy to control. I spun it twice, and went with 4 snows the following winter.

Another sees the rear end very loosey-goosey in the snow. This one is also FWD, but is slightly more controllable in the slip condition.

The basic premise is that a vehicle can transition from having a very predictable nature with 4 equal tires to having very unpredictable handling characteristics with 2 new tires on the front.
Those same people who fought to put the new tires on the front will also happily sue the tire manufacturer and tire shop in the event of an accident.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.

Bob4
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
So if I have 8/32" on the front and 6/32" on the back, my car turns into a death trap?


TheTechGuru

join:2004-03-25
TEXAS
kudos:2
reply to deke40
Just learn how to and be proficient at drifting and you'll be fine with the better tires on the front.
--
CompTIA Network+ Certified


Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
there
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to Bob4
said by Bob4:

So if I have 8/32" on the front and 6/32" on the back, my car turns into a death trap?

That is a pretty disingenuous reply.

I didn't say that. Not even close.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.

Bob4
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
said by Cho Baka:

said by Bob4:

So if I have 8/32" on the front and 6/32" on the back, my car turns into a death trap?

That is a pretty disingenuous reply.

I didn't say that. Not even close.

OK, but it's a serious question: At what point does the difference in tread depth become a problem?


Blogger
Jedi Poster
Premium
join:2012-10-18
reply to deke40
Sorry if this has all ready been said but one of the easiest things to do both in time or money spent is regularly rotate your tires. The benefit over the long run is amazing and saves one from a lot of tire issue or decisions.

Also, it never ceases to amaze me when I replace normally worn tires at or before the conservative time to change them with new tires that when I go out on the road, even low speed city street or parking lots for that matter how noticeably better and easier the car turns or responds to the steering wheel input.
--
The signal is usually drowned out by the noise.


Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
there
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reply to Bob4
said by Bob4:

OK, but it's a serious question: At what point does the difference in tread depth become a problem?

I personally don't see an issue with the scenario you described. A little common sense is needed.

New tires on the front, and 5 year old tires with 4/32" on the rear, I would be more concerned.
We have arrived at this situation because the lawyers will take advantage of any opportunity to make a buck, and people are always looking for a reason why an accident wasn't their fault.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.


BonezX
Basement Dweller
Premium
join:2004-04-13
Canada
kudos:1
reply to Bob4
said by Bob4:

OK, but it's a serious question: At what point does the difference in tread depth become a problem?

not at all when they are both bald as hell.

basic thing, if the conditions are beyond what the tire can support at the tread level it is at you will have issues, if not, the difference doesn't really matter too much, IE: don't try to out drive the tires.

easiest is just don't drive to the limit of the best tire. if you know the rear ones are bad figure out where their limit is, and drive accordingly.

but try telling your average all season awd SUV driver to drive according to the conditions, you get some amusing replies.

:edit: yea completely forgot the lawyer thing, that's going to be an issue no matter how big/small, front/back the difference is.


CL65AMG

@67.21.182.x
reply to deke40

Note!
Your vehicle came from the factory with "Staggered Fitments", meaning the front and rear tire sizes are different.

245/40-19 (Front)
275/35-19 (Rear)

So what do I do? lol.


Cho Baka
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-23
there
kudos:2
Open your wallet on a regular basis.
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The talented hawk speaks French.


Anonymous_
Anonymous
Premium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
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Reviews:
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1 edit
reply to deke40
said by deke40:

said by TheTechGuru:

said by SysOp:

Logic? Why not just buy 4 new tires or buy a new car already?

In this economy only people with credit can afford to get all 4 tires at once, that's nearly $800 for most non subcompacts to get a decent quality brand.

$840 to be exact for 215/50R17 95V XL 440 AA A Bridgestone Turanza Serenity Grand-Touring All Season including lifetime balancing.(09 HHR)

Bridgestone/firestone tire still have unsolved tread separation issues use that brand at your own risk
It was a tire from 2010 so it was not that old at lest I notice it before it cause a crash from a blow out.


deke40
Premium
join:2003-01-23
Texas
said by Anonymous_:

Bridgestone/firestone tire still have unsolved tread separation issues use that brand at your own risk

My original Firestones lasted 44000 miles and the two Bridgestones lasted 41k and the back two still have 6/32nds on them with no problems what so ever. Maybe they are not all bad.

Bob4
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
said by deke40:

My original Firestones lasted 44000 miles and the two Bridgestones lasted 41k...
Maybe they are not all bad.

That's pretty crappy. My Michelins had 110k on them and were still above the tread wear bars.


TheTechGuru

join:2004-03-25
TEXAS
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Look for tires with a treadwear rating around 800.

I like Pirelli P4 Four Seasons which have a treadwear rating of 760 and a 85,000 mile warranty.

Another to look at is Michelin Defender and Goodyear Assurance TripleTred All Season
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CompTIA Network+ Certified