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Perma
join:2011-12-20

Perma to BACONATOR26

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to BACONATOR26

Re: CNOC speed matching decision due next week

How long will it take for the higher uploads to actually take affect? Will we have to subscribe to new packages or will the 28/1 be bumped up to say 28/3 or whatever?
The Mongoose
join:2010-01-05
Toronto, ON

The Mongoose

Member

said by Perma:

How long will it take for the higher uploads to actually take affect? Will we have to subscribe to new packages or will the 28/1 be bumped up to say 28/3 or whatever?

Fair question, but this assumes CNOC is going to win which is by no means guaranteed. That being said, if they do win I would expect this to happen fairly quickly...thinking a few weeks, rather than a few months.

If the decision is that Rogers straight-up violated the speed-matching upgrade rules, then in theory everyone on 28/1 would automatically go to 35/3, and everyone on 18/1 to 25/2. If the decision is more complex and takes new tariff structures into account, no one can really know what the ordered remedy will be or how much it might cost.
resa1983
Premium Member
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON

resa1983 to Perma

Premium Member

to Perma
said by Perma:

How long will it take for the higher uploads to actually take affect? Will we have to subscribe to new packages or will the 28/1 be bumped up to say 28/3 or whatever?

Well, the decision for agg came on December 21, 2012, and Start began offering the new speeds as of January 15, 2013.

So probably about the same timeframe if CRTC orders it for disagg.

As for whether these'll be straight upgrades, or 'new' packages, that'll be in the decision as well. This decision will also deal with Agg as well.

hm
@videotron.ca

hm to The Mongoose

Anon

to The Mongoose
said by The Mongoose:

Fair question, but this assumes CNOC is going to win which is by no means guaranteed.

If it was bad news, then they would release the decision on a Friday, not a Monday.

BACONATOR26
Premium Member
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON

BACONATOR26

Premium Member

said by hm :

said by The Mongoose:

Fair question, but this assumes CNOC is going to win which is by no means guaranteed.

If it was bad news, then they would release the decision on a Friday, not a Monday.

New CRTC so older status quo may not apply but generally you may be right. The only thing is I'm still not sure it will be 100% in favour of CNOC due to the phase out of non-aggregated service and the fact that TekSavvy (the largest Rogers wholesaler) is already in the process of transitioning.
resa1983
Premium Member
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON

resa1983

Premium Member

Also, JF made a point to me via email last night, that the CNOC decision may not be Monday.. Apparently the Primus decision is bigger than the CNOC one, so that may be the decision released at 2 on Monday.

BACONATOR26
Premium Member
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON

BACONATOR26

Premium Member

Yeah, the Monday release was non-specific on which decision, typical CRTC but if that's a big decision they probably planned the release well in advance.

d4m1r
join:2011-08-25

d4m1r to The Mongoose

Member

to The Mongoose
said by The Mongoose:

Fair question, but this assumes CNOC is going to win which is by no means guaranteed. That being said, if they do win I would expect this to happen fairly quickly...thinking a few weeks, rather than a few months.

I would hope it would be quicker than that...Start was able to do it in 30 days so I'd hope TSI is prepared and will be able to do the same if given the green light from the CRTC....I am actually glad I hung in there and am anticipating a positive outcome for TSI

BACONATOR26
Premium Member
join:2000-11-25
Nepean, ON

BACONATOR26

Premium Member

said by d4m1r:

said by The Mongoose:

Fair question, but this assumes CNOC is going to win which is by no means guaranteed. That being said, if they do win I would expect this to happen fairly quickly...thinking a few weeks, rather than a few months.

I would hope it would be quicker than that...Start was able to do it in 30 days so I'd hope TSI is prepared and will be able to do the same if given the green light from the CRTC....I am actually glad I hung in there and am anticipating a positive outcome for TSI

It's not up to TekSavvy so much, Rogers has to apply new profiles for Tek's customers and they usually do it by area.
InvalidError
join:2008-02-03

InvalidError to resa1983

Member

to resa1983
said by resa1983:

Well, the decision for agg came on December 21, 2012, and Start began offering the new speeds as of January 15, 2013.

So probably about the same timeframe if CRTC orders it for disagg.

Since the CRTC granted exclusivity of new speeds as extra incentive for TPIAs to migrate to aggregated sooner rather than later, I would be a little surprised if they turned around on this one... even more so now that there are less than 10 months left until the sunset clause on non-aggregated TPIA.

If the CRTC did not think it made sense to order Rogers to do something for a to-be-discontinued service when there was over two years left, it would make little sense to turn around at the 10 months mark.

d4m1r
join:2011-08-25

d4m1r

Member

said by InvalidError:

Since the CRTC granted exclusivity of new speeds as extra incentive for TPIAs to migrate to aggregated sooner rather than later, I would be a little surprised if they turned around on this one... even more so now that there are less than 10 months left until the sunset clause on non-aggregated TPIA.

If the CRTC did not think it made sense to order Rogers to do something for a to-be-discontinued service when there was over two years left, it would make little sense to turn around at the 10 months mark.

So you don't believe it will be favourable to TSI? If it isn't, I can't wait till the end of 2013 for increased upload speeds...

As well, so are we expect this decision tomorrow, this Friday, next week Monday, are can it literally be any day of this week?
34764170 (banned)
join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

34764170 (banned)

Member

said by d4m1r:

So you don't believe it will be favourable to TSI? If it isn't, I can't wait till the end of 2013 for increased upload speeds...

As well, so are we expect this decision tomorrow, this Friday, next week Monday, are can it literally be any day of this week?

Unless the rates are adjusted for aggregated to not be so crazy then I am not looking forward to that move.
bbhog
join:2010-07-05
North York, ON

bbhog

Member

said by 34764170:

Unless the rates are adjusted for aggregated to not be so crazy then I am not looking forward to that move.

I'm also fearful of what aggregated will bring to consumers. Seems it might bring higher prices and stricter bandwidth restrictions
InvalidError
join:2008-02-03

InvalidError

Member

said by bbhog:

I'm also fearful of what aggregated will bring to consumers. Seems it might bring higher prices and stricter bandwidth restrictions

You already have a general idea of what to expect since Start.ca is already on aggregated.

Another thing that the CRTC has to take into consideration is that if they do allow speed matching on non-aggregated, it would put Start.ca at a disadvantage for adopting aggregated from launch, which would be somewhat unfair when this is Start's only competitive edge for the time being.

And even if the CRTC did decide to force Rogers to offer the new speeds on non-aggregated, you would still be looking at a few more months before Rogers files new tariffs and the CRTC approves them - assuming the TPIAs do not dispute the rates if Rogers decides to adjust (inflate) non-aggregated rates to minimize potential prejudice to its aggregated TPIA clients.

So, worst case, the CRTC avoids shooting themselves in the foot and stick to its previous decision. Best case, non-aggregated ISPs will enjoy a short-lived victory and Start.ca who did the "right thing" by going with aggregated instead of betting the barn on end-of-life tariffs gets screwed by the CRTC and non-aggregated ISPs for the time being.

Whatever happens, everybody loses. Only thing that changes is who and how much.

Instead of wasting effort on silly/temporary stuff like this, that effort should go into having the aggregated per-Gbps rates sanity-checked (should be possible to get them down to about 8$/Mbps) and getting 10G aggregation into tariffs since everyone will inevitably be stuck with the former and need the latter to reduce recurring load balancing problems, which enables more efficient use of each purchased Mbps of capacity.

TakeOffEh
@teksavvy.com

TakeOffEh

Anon

said by InvalidError:

Another thing that the CRTC has to take into consideration is that if they do allow speed matching on non-aggregated, it would put Start.ca at a disadvantage for adopting aggregated from launch, which would be somewhat unfair when this is Start's only competitive edge for the time being.

I would say going Aggregated still gives Start one big advantage, over others like TekSavvy who are still on Disaggregated.

Access to Rogers' entire footprint. They can offer service in some areas where TekSavvy, et al, can't.

However, my understanding is that the rates on Aggregated are higher. Which is the reason other TPIA providers have been avoiding Agg. for as long as possible. So in that sense, yeah, Start has been screwed over.