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Cabal
Premium Member
join:2007-01-21

3 recommendations

Cabal

Premium Member

Security Flaws in Universal Plug-n-Play: Unplug, Don't Play



Full story: »community.rapid7.com/com ··· ont-play

jaykaykay
4 Ever Young
MVM
join:2000-04-13
USA

3 recommendations

jaykaykay

MVM

»www.grc.com/unpnp/unpnp.htm. Been using this for years.

Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium Member
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC

3 recommendations

Juggernaut to Cabal

Premium Member

to Cabal
UPnP has been disabled for years in services.msc. I've never had a problem with a device failing to work.

norwegian
Premium Member
join:2005-02-15
Outback

2 recommendations

norwegian

Premium Member


Also turned off in any router too - some ship with it on by default.

Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium Member
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC

1 recommendation

Juggernaut

Premium Member

Yep. I think it's on by default in pretty much every router. The funny thing is, I can't think of a reason why it should even be there.

siljaline
I'm lovin' that double wide
Premium Member
join:2002-10-12
Montreal, QC

siljaline to Cabal

Premium Member

to Cabal
This borrows heavily on what you already posted.

Researchers Find Serious Security Flaws in Universal Plug and Play

• »www.wired.com/threatleve ··· y-flaws/

»twitter.com/KimZetter/st ··· 95177728

DigitalXeron
There is a lack of sanity
join:2003-12-17
Hamilton, ON

1 recommendation

DigitalXeron to Juggernaut

Member

to Juggernaut
said by Juggernaut:

Yep. I think it's on by default in pretty much every router. The funny thing is, I can't think of a reason why it should even be there.

In large, end users can be lazy at times and UPnP facilitates that laziness as people don't have to configure their NAT routers to have a new program.

Allegedly it's supposed to be so applications like games and whatnot can automatically set up port forwarding. Unfortunately some program vendors set their programs up to dynamically allocate ports, rather than statically set them so you can set up the port forwarding once manually and leave it.

Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium Member
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC

Juggernaut

Premium Member

I see. I'm not a gamer, so it's something I've not encountered. Thanks.

services
@anonymouse.org

services to Juggernaut

Anon

to Juggernaut
said by Juggernaut:

Yep. I think it's on by default in pretty much every router. The funny thing is, I can't think of a reason why it should even be there.

I think its so people using certain services can get out to the net, like torrent or a game or program instead of having to set port forwarding. Portforward = port always open, upnp only opens the port when you launch an app. Correct me if im wrong, if I am I will also disable it on my router and see how it plays on the net with my apps!

Side note , if i remember correctly some mobos even have upnp in the bios, do you disable that too?

Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium Member
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC

Juggernaut

Premium Member

Of course, as I build my own boxes. I set up my mobo's by hand to tweak the performance, and eliminate this kind of stuff.
OZO
Premium Member
join:2003-01-17

OZO to Juggernaut

Premium Member

to Juggernaut
said by Juggernaut:

The funny thing is, I can't think of a reason why it should even be there.

What is even funnier - I'm using it for the last decade and never had any security problem with it

As with everything in this life there is a danger and there is a usefulness. Knife is an example. I'm sure that many. many people cut their fingers with knives every day. Nevertheless, they still use it... I think the same is true about UPnP. Take your time and get a knowledge how to use it safely and then ... use it safely

Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium Member
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC

Juggernaut

Premium Member

Bud, as I've stated, I've never needed it with any prog or device yet. And, I do practice safe hex.
OZO
Premium Member
join:2003-01-17

OZO

Premium Member

Good. I do the same.

Example of just two usages:
* dynamic port assignment - torrent app. New (random) port is forwarded on the router every time it starts. Port is immediately closed when it's done.
* almost static port assignment (I may change it time to time) - SIP server, FreeSWITCH. Achieved convenience is - I change it in one place (SIP server's configuration) only.

Again, IT life is not simple like black and white. It may bring you benefits and desired automation, but one has to learn how to use it safely (because there are always people, who want to exploit everything at their disposal against gullible and naive). Another controversial for some example - I use actively ActiveX without security problems. Or, JavaScript is always on, whatever site I visit (Flash, on the other hand, can be started on my demand only and BTW, on all my computers its elevated privileges are removed, search this forum for my posts how to do it). And at the same time, I don't run any AV products all the time. I simply don't need them, because I do what you're doing -- practice safe hex

The main problem INHO sits on a chair and clicks on any links or buttons it sees...

Juggernaut
Irreverent or irrelevant?
Premium Member
join:2006-09-05
Kelowna, BC

Juggernaut

Premium Member

The 'Zombie Surfer'! *Gasp*

trparky
Premium Member
join:2000-05-24
Cleveland, OH

trparky to Juggernaut

Premium Member

to Juggernaut
I ran the scan myself, I just inputted junk data into the program and it accepted it.
HELLFIRE
MVM
join:2009-11-25

HELLFIRE to Cabal

MVM

to Cabal
Haven't used what could be classed as a "home router" in a long time... what's UPNP? [/sarcasm]

Good read otherwise.

Regards
Mele20
Premium Member
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI

1 recommendation

Mele20 to Cabal

Premium Member

to Cabal
Their application to determine if you have these "flaws" requires full name, physical address, phone number, email address etc. in order to "register" your free program. You cannot use the "free" program until you cough up the personal information.

So, I deleted the program. Why didn't you warn us? I would not have downloaded this crap if you had warned us!

I had to enable UPnP in my router many years ago. It is still enabled and will remain so.

TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium Member
join:2000-11-08
Da Bronx
·Verizon FiOS
Ubiquiti NSM5
Synology RT2600ac
Apple AirPort Extreme (2013)

TamaraB to Cabal

Premium Member

to Cabal
Is there a remote test to determine if your Upnp implementation is vulnerable?

Everything posted so far here requires installing test software on a windows PC. None of them run on Mac. I have an airport extreme (Time Capsule) router and run Upnp for Vonage and for back to my Mac.

skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium Member
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170

4 edits

skeechan

Premium Member

I'm not seeing any Apple products, the ABES, TC, etc on any of the hardware lists unless I am missing something. I'm assuming because Apple uses NAT-PMP.
skeechan

skeechan to Mele20

Premium Member

to Mele20
For the registration, as mentioned previously you can enter anything in there. I just put x x x x x on down.

TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium Member
join:2000-11-08
Da Bronx
·Verizon FiOS
Ubiquiti NSM5
Synology RT2600ac
Apple AirPort Extreme (2013)

TamaraB to skeechan

Premium Member

to skeechan
said by skeechan:

I'm not seeing any Apple products, the ABES, TC, etc on any of the hardware lists unless I am missing something.

Thanks. What hardware vulnerability "lists" are you referring to?

skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium Member
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170

skeechan

Premium Member

The ones linked to in the whitepaper.
Mele20
Premium Member
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI

Mele20 to skeechan

Premium Member

to skeechan
Click for full size
said by skeechan:

For the registration, as mentioned previously you can enter anything in there. I just put x x x x x on down.

I didn't think it would allow xxxxx. Thanks.

AVD
Respice, Adspice, Prospice
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Onion, NJ

2 recommendations

AVD to jaykaykay

Premium Member

to jaykaykay
said by jaykaykay:

»www.grc.com/unpnp/unpnp.htm. Been using this for years.

decades almost

norwegian
Premium Member
join:2005-02-15
Outback

norwegian to TamaraB

Premium Member

to TamaraB
said by TamaraB:

Is there a remote test to determine if your Upnp implementation is vulnerable?

To be quite honest I didn't run the tool - why would you download, install or run a program, it basically voids any test - if it was a web based probe I would understand, but install internal to the network defeats the test, unless I miss something here?

TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium Member
join:2000-11-08
Da Bronx
·Verizon FiOS
Ubiquiti NSM5
Synology RT2600ac
Apple AirPort Extreme (2013)

1 recommendation

TamaraB

Premium Member

said by norwegian:

To be quite honest I didn't run the tool - why would you download, install or run a program, it basically voids any test - if it was a web based probe I would understand, but install internal to the network defeats the test, unless I miss something here?

No, you didn't miss anything. The only way to know for sure if your router's UpNp implementation is accessible from the Internet is to probe it from the Internet.

Cartel
Intel inside Your sensitive data outside
Premium Member
join:2006-09-13
Chilliwack, BC

Cartel

Premium Member

US Government Warns of Hack Threat to Network Gear

CERT in turn has tried to contact the more than 200 companies whose products Rapid7 have identified as being vulnerable to attack, including Belkin, D-Link, Cisco Systems Inc's Linksys division and Netgear.

Belkin, D-Link and Netgear did not respond to requests for comment.

»www.voanews.com/content/ ··· 376.html

siljaline
I'm lovin' that double wide
Premium Member
join:2002-10-12
Montreal, QC

siljaline to jaykaykay

Premium Member

to jaykaykay
said by jaykaykay:

»www.grc.com/unpnp/unpnp.htm. Been using this for years.

Kicking the tires now

TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium Member
join:2000-11-08
Da Bronx
·Verizon FiOS
Ubiquiti NSM5
Synology RT2600ac
Apple AirPort Extreme (2013)

TamaraB

Premium Member

said by siljaline:

Kicking the tires now

You are kicking the tires from inside the car though. How do you know for sure you are protected from the outside? Only kicking the tires from the outside can tell you for sure. I have yet to see a test to do that.

NOYB
St. John 3.16
Premium Member
join:2005-12-15
Forest Grove, OR

NOYB to TamaraB

Premium Member

to TamaraB

Wonder if there will be a BBR / DSL Reports tool for testing for UPnP security flaws.