Topic 'Interesting article about the state of lighting.' in forum 'Electronics' - dslreports.com http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962025 en Wed, 19 Jun 2013 22:17:18 EDT Wed, 19 Jun 2013 22:17:18 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975620 said by kruser:

I agree with that fully. Not sure what happens if you plug a standard T12 or T8 tube into a socket that has been re-wired for direct 120 volt line voltage!

If the LED tube is fed with 120 volts at one end and the other is simply a mechanical attachment plugging a florescent tube puts 120v across the filament. That would probably be prettying exciting.

quote:
OSRAM SYLVANIA’s LED T8 Commercial Grade replacement lamps are an energy saving LED alternative to traditional T12 or T8 fluorescent lamps combining innovative optical and mechanical design features. These lamps have a dedicated internal driver (120-277V) allowing them to be powered with direct AC by simply disconnecting the fluorescent ballast. The long 40,000 hour life (L70) lamps are available in 11W, 2-foot and 22W, 4-foot versions saving up to 30% in energy costs over 17W and 32W fluorescent lamps, respectively. There are a variety of color temperatures 2700K, 3000K, 3500K, 4100K and 5000K to choose from and good color rendering properties with a 84-87 CRI.

»www.sylvania.com/en-us/products/···mps.aspx


Florescent tubes work by ionizing mercury. Once the filament burned out I assume line voltage would be able to maintain an arc, since we are only talking about a half inch between filament supports. With nothing limiting current (assuming socket is directly wired to mains) the end will get very hot very quickly and probably shatter. All this will probably occur at current and time-frames that will not trip circuit over-current protection. But that is just a guess.

Someone up for an experiment? :)

/tom ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975620 Sun, 03 Feb 2013 18:30:50 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975550 said by tschmidt:

I am intrigued by LED lighting but think that tubular form should use a different connector then standard T8/T12 bulbs since they are not compatible.

/Tom

I agree with that fully. Not sure what happens if you plug a standard T12 or T8 tube into a socket that has been re-wired for direct 120 volt line voltage!
The only thing good about it that I could see (other than the cost savings) was the fact that the LED lamp would simply not light if you insert a new one backwards.
I guess you could wire both end sockets with line voltage so it would not matter which way you insert the LED tube. The tube I looked at had dummy pins (still brass pins) on the non powered end. They did not go to internally.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975550 Sun, 03 Feb 2013 18:00:54 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975520
The T8 ballasts I have (not sure if it applies to all) are instant start, they do not use the heater. You need to bridge both contact together in each socket. Failure to do so causes the arc to migrate to one end of the filament, rather then the center, reducing tube life.

I am intrigued by LED lighting but think that tubular form should use a different connector then standard T8/T12 bulbs since they are not compatible.

/Tom ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975520 Sun, 03 Feb 2013 17:53:23 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975376
The lamps I've seen have an internal reflector strip as there are no LED's on the backside of the tube so you lose any reflector properties from your fixture.
The lamps claim to draw 12.5 watts at 120 VAC input. Not cheap though at $50+ per lamp.

Of course you can use them to replace T12's or T8 tubes.

I don't know who made the one I saw but I don't think I'd like it for direct lighting except maybe above a test bench or something. Used in a fixture with a diffused reflector lens may be ok.
It was bright that's for sure. I noticed it also said "not dimmable". I took that as the lamp must contain some type of electronics that can't handle a conventional dimmer.

Are standard 4 foot T12 or T8 bi-pin sockets even rated for line voltage? I know the old T12 single pin 8 footers used line voltage rated sockets as they often used one socket to interrupt power to the ballast when the lamp was removed but I'm not sure about the typical bi-pin 4 foot sockets found in the old shop lights you could buy for 10 bucks (or less with lamps even) at your old hardware store. I tried looking at my spare sockets but did not have any old bi-pin sockets for some reason.
I'm thinking I remember seeing them stamped with a 600 volt rating but something tells me my memory is wrong.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27975376 Sun, 03 Feb 2013 17:05:30 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27967520 said by lutful:

I just wanted to mention that RF induced light emitting plasma (LEP) technology has the potential to lower energy consumption even more than banks of T12 with electronic ballast.

I think one of the major problems with LEP technology is going to be RFI. Plasma TV's are already a concern in that area. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27967520 Thu, 31 Jan 2013 22:29:33 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27965672 said by tschmidt:

Interesting seeing all the development going into new lighting ...

I just wanted to mention that RF induced light emitting plasma (LEP) technology has the potential to lower energy consumption even more than banks of T12 with electronic ballast.

Unfortunately very few companies make LEP bulbs at this time and they are focusing more on high value lighting systems. Luxim has a comparison of a factory that replaced 60 T12x4 fixtures consuming total 9KW with about 5kW worth of LEPs which last 6+ years.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27965672 Thu, 31 Jan 2013 13:49:55 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27964381 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27964381 Thu, 31 Jan 2013 08:08:11 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962219 said by leibold:

How did you get to 1/2 the power consumption, did you reduce the number of fluorescent tubes ?

I used GE UltraMax L series ballast.
»genet.gelighting.com/LightingObj···ecId=176

Claims to use only 49 W with 2 tube. Given the series has multiple ballasts I'm assuming they are running bulb at less then maximum wattage. From what I have read about T8 retrofits they are brighter then T12 so I took a chance. Visually they look the same but that is logarithmic. My wife has a light meter for plants so in an unscientific test of light output they seem to be about the same.

They are available at subsidized prices through the NH saves program for $14 a ballast for two tube unit.

T8 tube prices are all over the place $2-6 per tube. I found a contractor package at Lowes.

»www.lowes.com/pd_291833-3-22265_···cetInfo=

The Sylvania site says they do not meet 2012 energy requirements but have been grandfathered due to rare earths shortage. I don't understand since the Lumen output is the same as much more expensive bulbs.
»www.worldelectricsupply.com/Cust···2%29.pdf

I believe a 2-tube T12 magnetic ballast comes in about 90W. Which is how I came up with the 50% power saving, I did not actually measure it.

/tom]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962219 Wed, 30 Jan 2013 14:28:44 EDT Re: Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962125 said by tschmidt:

For my part just finished converting all our 4' dual florescent 40W T12 magnetic ballast fixtures to 32W T8 electronic ballast. I'm very pleased with the result. Same amount of light, instant on, no flicker and about 1/2 the power consumption.

How did you get to 1/2 the power consumption, did you reduce the number of fluorescent tubes ?

I have a kitchen light fixture with 6 T12 (40W 4ft) that I will need to replace eventually. I have been thinking about keeping the same fixture and just replacing the ballasts (using 6 T8 bulbs with 32W). However that would only result in a 20% power saving.

Of course, I'm also thinking about LED lighting.
--
Got some spare cpu cycles ? Join Team Helix or Team Starfire!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Re-Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962125 Wed, 30 Jan 2013 14:02:23 EDT Interesting article about the state of lighting. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962025
»ntbpdf.techbriefs.net/2013/LT0113.pdf

»www.lightingtechbriefs.com/

For my part just finished converting all our 4' dual florescent 40W T12 magnetic ballast fixtures to 32W T8 electronic ballast. I'm very pleased with the result. Same amount of light, instant on, no flicker and about 1/2 the power consumption.

On a much smaller scale replaced a 7W night light I was using to illuminate our wood stove with a white LED. That to also turned out great. Much better light at less power.

/tom]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/Interesting-article-about-the-state-of-lighting-27962025 Wed, 30 Jan 2013 13:29:16 EDT