dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
651
share rss forum feed


Bootes
Premium
join:2005-01-28
New York, NY
reply to Simba7

Re: Pocket change for the 2nd run Samsung

Apple is a hardware company. Google is an advertising company. They have very different motives.


Cheese
Premium
join:2003-10-26
Naples, FL
kudos:1
iAds...


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
reply to Bootes
said by Bootes:

Apple is a hardware company.

Riiight.. and the software that it runs just happens to make itself? How easy would it be to put in monitoring software when the entire platform is locked down?

..not to mention, if someone found out about it, they'd call it a "feature" to make their "experience" smoother and more enjoyable. Whatever.

At least I can utilize third-party firmware (Cyanogenmod, etc) on my phone. Can you?


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit
reply to Simba7
Oh, I tried lots of custom firmware but they were all super buggy or plain broke stuff. When I had tried CM9, it would break lots of stuff like BT, the camera and even rotation. Even now, while CM9 has progressed, it is still a bug filled and broken feature mess, making ICS still unusable on the player. It's moot now as I have ditched my Galaxy WiFi 5.0.

At the time, c.2011, all the talk was about HC coming on new HTC handsets like the Pyramid/Sensation (they ended up shipping with GB I think) so I was hoping to see it on my player...then later ICS also not available on the player. And it isn't like it can't run. HTC's new budget handset, I think it's the Desire or something is single core, same 800 x 400 resolution, 1/2GB of RAM...will be running ICS.

The 2nd Gen touch is 3-4 years old, originally released back in 2008. The Galaxy S WiFi and Galaxy Player are still currently shipping models and still aren't shipping with ICS. If I had known that Samsung was never going to update the player I wouldn't have bought it.


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
Never had many issues with CM9. Of course, I ran the latest build. CM10 gave me a few issues initially, but the 20121215 build was the best. CM10.1 has been a bit sluggish, but I'll give it more time to mature before I switch over.

I've been eyeballing the Galaxy Player 5.0 and been thinking of grabbing one. I'll keep an eye on xda-developers to see if anyone is building a ROM for it.

My Samsung Captivate is 3 years old.. and there are still recent ROMs being made for it to make it do recent stuff. I swear, that Captivate is the most versatile phone I've seen in quite awhile. The only phone I won't buy is Motorola. They lock it down severely so you can't dev for it, then ignore it for updates. This happened with my D2G.
--
Bresnan 30M/5M | CenturyLink 5M/896K
MyWS[PnmIIX3@3.2G,8G RAM,500G+1.5T+2T HDDs,Win7]
WifeWS[A64@2G,2G RAM,120G HDD,Win7]
Router[2xP3@1G,2G RAM,18G HDD,Allied Telesyn AT2560FX,2xDigital DE504,Sun X1034A,2xSun X4444A,SMC 8432BTA,Gentoo]


Bootes
Premium
join:2005-01-28
New York, NY
reply to Simba7
Well you obviously couldn't tell that that part was kind of half kidding. That's why I winked. However, it's still based on the truth. Android was created to keep mobile users using Google services, so they could advertise to you and have better access to information about you. I'm not someone that cares all that much about this, but many people do. If you can't see that Google's goal is to know as much about you as possible in order to target advertisements to you, you're in denial.

Obviously there are benefits to Android and benefits to iOS. I did install Android on my iPhone 3G, so I'm pretty sure that counts as third party firmware on an iPhone. In my opinion, the ubiquity of third party roms is a failure of the original product. I'm all for the ability to use them, but something is very wrong when they're as popular as they are.

As far as Apple vs Samsung, here's a major reason why I prefer Apple. There are of course others.

Customer support - If something goes wrong with my iPhone, I make an appointment online, show it to a genius who is friendly, speaks English well, and is fairly the knowledgeable. They do a few checks and hand me a new one. When something goes wrong with my laptop and I'm not near an Apple Store, they mail me a box with next day shipping and a next day shipping label to mail it back to them, they repair it and send it back out again the day they receive it, with next day shipping once again.

If my Galaxy Nexus arrives out of the box without working GPS, I call the Google Nexus support number and speak to a friendly, fairly knowledgeable american who does a few checks and then forwards me to Samsung. Where I speak to someone who does not speak English all that well, follows a simple script that does not show that they actually know anything about technology, and then forwards me to another Samsung person to setup the repair. Then I speak to another person over a terrible international phone connection who finally sets up the repair after having me do all the basic checks again. They then tell me to stay on the line for a recording of instructions on how to return my device and hang up. I wait a few minutes, no recording plays and I hang up. Luckily, I'm not an idiot and can handle the email instructions perfectly fine. So I return the phone with the ground shipping provided, which takes about a week, they then take about a week to fix the phone, and then ship it back with another week of ground shipping. In the end spending many hours on the phone and 3 weeks without my phone, luckily I have backups, but I don't expect most people to and I shouldn't need to use one in this case.


sivran
Seamonkey's back
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Irving, TX
kudos:1
reply to skeechan
said by skeechan:

Simply put, Apple CREATES the market for goods

Wait, stop right there.

That's right.

Apple is a marketing company.

And even their marketing strategy isn't innovative.
--
Think Outside the Fox.


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit
reply to Simba7
It depends on the handset. The Galaxy Player/WiFi (mine was the import) has been troublesome from the beginning. Early on NOTHING worked with CM9. They just recently got BT working and last I checked lots of stuff like the camera still didn't work.

I got WAY better support from Motorola...even out of market factory ROMs where all right there on their support site for download. They also offered all the utils and even 'for dummies' instructions on how to use them them. I ran the au/KDDI ROM on my Xoom because the NA Xooms only shipped with English, French and Spanish support.

But I shouldn't have to run custom ROMs or hack on the device to get new features. The handset maker shouldn't abandon the platform on day one.


Rambo76098

join:2003-02-21
Columbus, OH
reply to skeechan
Dude, you're talking out of your butt. I don't even like Samsung, but who was the first to mass produce phones that utilize NFC? And which other phone can you splitscreen?


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

4 edits
Who gives a shit about NFC? Seriously? There is nothing revolutionary about a solution looking for a problem and it's already been done...it's called Bluetooth. People surrendering their wallets since they can buy EVERYTHING via NFC? Great, you get to unlock the phone, open the app, choose a payment method when you can much more quickly swipe a card you are already carrying in your wallet and never forget. Making a task LESS convenient isn't innovation.

NFC is one of those things that looks good on paper but in real life is completely impractical. For filesharing between phones, there are no shortage of 3rd party apps on either Android or iOS running on WiFi/3G/4G or via BT and a lot of them are cross platform so they'll work iPhone to iPhone, iPhone to Android, Android to Android or mobile to desktop. Again, it's already been done. And I would guess there are more Bump users than Samsung NFC users (meaning people who actually use NFC for file/information transfers).

Split screen? There were 3rd party apps on the platform doing split screen before Samsung implemented it in devices like the Galaxy Note. Again, Samsung sees what others were doing and implements the idea...even if they polish it up, it is still someone else's innovation. Samsung does evolution, not revolution and they don't create markets.

The only thing "revolutionary" that I have seen on the platform was the Transformer dock's pointing device; the Transformer dock actually made a the tablet good enough for productivity, a 1080P netbook with 14 hour battery life, laptop like productivity. Unfortunately the platform's productivity apps suck ass rendering the innovative idea of brining mousing to Android largely useless.


Rambo76098

join:2003-02-21
Columbus, OH
Reviews:
·WOW Internet and..
It's just funny - what you're saying about Samsung is precisely what Apple has always been known for. Taking ideas that belong to others, putting a little Apple spin on it, and then calling it their own. That's not innovation, that's copying.

I'll just leave this here:
»www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl···C25BM9E0


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

2 edits

I'll just leave this here
Again, Apple CREATES MARKETS for products, even if a similar product already exists. 2nd run companies wait for a concept to be proven as marketable, and then copy it (making small changes along the way). Samsung mobility, being the 2nd run they are, merely serves these newly proven markets after others show them how to do it (make a marketable product). Because Samsung mobile NEVER innovates, NEVER puts out anything revolutionary, they don't create new markets. Samsung has never released a product 180 degrees away from where the market is like Apple did with the iPhone or Microsoft did with Metro.

Badonkadonk
Premium
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
kudos:5
Yes, Apple is a marketer, not a technology innovator. I don't think anyone disagrees.
--
"You lie!" Talk about an understatement, Joe.


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
reply to skeechan
said by skeechan:

Samsung has never released a product 180 degrees away from where the market is like Apple did with the iPhone or Microsoft did with Metro.

..and how many people hate Metro?

In that sense, Apple could've copied several devices.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compaq_TC1000
»www.engadget.com/2006/03/09/sams···s-music/

..and before the iPhone..
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung_SGH-F700
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LG_Prada

I did find this interesting..
»www.scriptol.com/mobile/iphone.php
--
Bresnan 30M/5M | CenturyLink 5M/896K
MyWS[PnmIIX3@3.2G,8G RAM,500G+1.5T+2T HDDs,Win7]
WifeWS[A64@2G,2G RAM,120G HDD,Win7]
Router[2xP3@1G,2G RAM,18G HDD,Allied Telesyn AT2560FX,2xDigital DE504,Sun X1034A,2xSun X4444A,SMC 8432BTA,Gentoo]


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit
Oh I'm sure they have...but LG couldn't create a market for their product...they were doing it wrong, primarily with the OS.

What made the iPhone unique wasn't touch as much as it was touch plus the operating system. The iPhone with a horribly convoluted OS like that of the Treo, with its horrible hard to use apps would have bombed Newton style. It would have been an epic failure...and edge phone with a Treo type OS? I shiver at the thought.

Hell, Microsoft was trying to do tablets for 10 years and they sold like crap but I already mentioned that. Bill Gates KNEW tablets were the future but was simply doing it all wrong.

Meanwhile it isn't about whether or not people hate metro...it is that Microsoft took a risk trying to build a new market doing something 180 degrees from what the rest of the market is doing. You can have have a revolutionary product that is a total bomb in the market. And I guarantee if Metro was a massive hit, OS X would start looking a lot like iOS in the next version or two.

Samsung doesn't take chances doing anything. They are a very conservative company and it serves them well; just look at their balance sheet.

The iPhone predates the SGH-F700 in both announcement and delivery but more importantly the F700 was still a physical keyboard equipped phone with an OS typically horrid for that era. They weren't going to take the chance dumping the keyboard and they didn't have the talent to write decent software. The LG predates the iPhone by about a month in both announcement and delivery and also had a horrible OS typical of that time. They either didn't understand the importance of software or like Samsung simply lacked the talent to do it.

There was nothing revolutionary in the F700...it was the same old crappy OS and slider keyboard with some touch. The old Simon had a touch screen as did the Ericsson R380 while sliders had been around for what, 5 or 6 years already. Taking a keyboard phone and adding touch was nothing new. Abandoning keyboards and buttons completely and bringing a desktop quality OS and apps to a handset was revolutionary as evidenced by the products titanic success. Finally the masses could get a USABLE smartphone and usable as evidenced by the web traffic it generated compared to other browser equipped smartphones of the time.

Not one really "invents" anything from scratch. Again as I mentioned previously, lots of people make seats and steering wheels, but very few design them and more importantly combine them to make something really special. A Ferrari F430 and a Kia Rio have a LOT in common...internal combustion engines, 4 wheels and tires, bumpers, gage cluster, perhaps even cup holders but the user experience is 180 degrees apart.

Samsung makes nothing special. In a world of Kia Rios they would never build a Ferrari. They would build the Yaris or Fiesta. Their business model is the 2nd run model. They wait for others to take the risks, find just that right combination that wows people and then they duplicate it with some very minor changes.

It happens in lots of industries. Look at Toyota and the Prius or Honda with the first Insight. Toyota was selling the Prius and Honda the first Insight when gas was close to $1 a gallon, in a time of cheap gas and giant SUVs, they tried something 180 degrees in the other direction. That is a risk, that is revolutionary. Now everyone and their dog makes and sells hybrids and Toyota is well ahead of the curve. Toyota and Honda were the first runs...everyone else 2nd runs. That doesn't mean that the Ford Fusion Hybrid is a total piece of shit, it just means Ford isn't the innovator, Ford isn't revolutionary when it comes to hybrids. Someone else took the risk, proved the market and they said, "Woe, there is money to be made doing that so let's do it."

Badonkadonk
Premium
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Dish Network
It's a matter of timeline. Apple just jumped on the mobile phone bandwagon. The risks were already taken when the first cell phones were developed. Apple just took what was there and added their own little pieces and had a hit. Many companies can do that. The Japanese were masters at it. Apple just out Japanesed the Japanese. The key is to keep doing it constantly.

As a fashion/marketing organization and not an innovator, Apple is bound to the changing preferences of fashion. Can they keep it up? Not with how fickle the fashion conscious are. Heck, it's happening already as Apple continues to lose worldwide market-share. And Cook ain't no Jobs.
--
"You lie!" Talk about an understatement, Joe.