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LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada
reply to elwoodblues

Re: Futureshop/Bestbuy abruptly shut down a dozen stores

There may be no margin on the devices, but the accessories and cases are HIGH margin items... And I wanted the full deal.

Plus wasn't even able to talk to either salesperson to tell them what I was looking for...


sm5w2
Premium
join:2004-10-13
St Thomas, ON
reply to urbanriot
> > But shopping at a Best Buy, or one of the company's Future Shop locations,
> > is most often an exercise in annoyance rather than respect. Customers complain
> > that sales staff were difficult to find and unknowledgeable or pushy when they did
> > materialize. Sears suffered similar problems; in some locations, you are more likely
> > to spot a Yeti than a sales associate. Both Best Buy and Sears trailed far
> > behind competitors like Costco and Sam's Club in pleasing their patrons,
> > according to the American Customer Satisfaction Index (ACSI), an annual survey of
> > 70,000 shoppers.

Again, this aspect of customer service is exactly what you get when you staff a big-box electronics store with 75 - 100 part-time, high turnover employees, instead of say 20 full-time employees.

I don't buy the fact that the fear of unionization is why the retailers go with part-time staff. By now, everyone in Ontario is aware that if you go on strike in a private-sector business, that business isin't going to mess around with you - they will close and kick your ass out on the road. Ask the people that used to work at the Caterpillar plant (formerly GM Diesel) in London if their union experience worked out for them.

Places like Costco make it a point of selling stuff that doesn't require customer assistance. A TV is a TV these days, and you don't need customer assistance to answer questions about 5-gallon pails of salad dressing.


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable
reply to LazMan
said by LazMan:

There may be no margin on the devices, but the accessories and cases are HIGH margin items... And I wanted the full deal.

Sure, like this 10' no-name 'Dynex' USB cable for $29.99
»www.futureshop.ca/en-CA/product/···4a51en02

vs. 10' StarTech USB cable for $3.41
»www.ncix.com/products/?sku=48045···0DT%20SB

This isn't the cause of their demise though, as places like Staples do exactly the same thing... and people buy this stuff, without knowing better. Heck, sometimes people buy the extra cables for the new printers since they're trashing the old cables with their old printer.


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Reviews:
·VMedia
You are taking things out of context.

When you sell a commodity good like a TV, PC etc, there is almost no margin in it. If they sell you a $30 USB or HDMI cable , that's where the profit is.

That said, 30 bucks for a USB cable is outrageous, I've bought a ton of things from Monoprice, simply because it's so much cheaper.
--
No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake.......


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Reviews:
·VMedia
reply to sm5w2
said by sm5w2:

and you don't need customer assistance to answer questions about 5-gallon pails of salad dressing.

EWW that's alot of Salad dressing


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable
reply to elwoodblues
said by elwoodblues:

You are taking things out of context.

... You should probably re-read my post because I responded to him with direct context.

said by elwoodblues:

When you sell a commodity good like a TV, PC etc, there is almost no margin in it. If they sell you a $30 USB or HDMI cable , that's where the profit is.

Yet despite that, our area has two stores that focus on selling home theatre electronics, both of which have been around in some capacity or another since I moved to Niagara Falls and shopped for my first VCR back in the 80's.


rickardsred

join:2004-08-20
St Catharines, ON
reply to Guspaz
The crappy customer service and accessories upsell at these stores is nothing new. I remember back in the late 90's when I was shopping for a printer at the Futureshop in St. Catharines, back when it was on Ontario Street, across from the old K-Mart plaza.

Anyhow, I picked up an HP Deskjet printer that was on sale and the the sales guy says to me "Sir, you'll need a good USB printer cable to go with that?" and proceeds to grab a $60 "Belkin Deluxe-Premium, 24 Karat Gold-Plated, Oxygen-deprived, made from Unobtainum encrusted Saskatchewan Seal-Skin bindings" cable off the shelf.

Since the printer had both USB and Parallel connections, I quickly declined it with a "Heh Heh...uhm...no. I'll just use the parallel cable I already have, thank you". He proceeded to tell me that in order to get the best colour print quality that I needed to use the USB connection. Using a parallel cable would reduce the printing quality because it was only designed for black and white printing.

I laughed in his face, put the printer down and said, "On second thought, perhaps I will shop around a bit more then." And walked out the door.

I still bought a printer that day. I can't recall where....but I think I took my business to a small computer shop in town where they sold me the same printer, matched the Futureshop price, and even threw in a free USB cable. Of course, of the two stores, guess which one is still in business....


milnoc

join:2001-03-05
H3B
kudos:2
The only downside of regularly going to a small shop is that they quickly learn how to "poke" your geek factor, making you buy even more stuff! But at least it's the kind of stuff you can actually use -- most of the time.

"A water cooled system?"

"You don't really need it. Cooling fans will work just as well. But watch what happens when I add some fluorescent dye to the water and turn on the black light."

"Ooooooooo!!!"


--
Watch my future television channel's public test broadcast!
»thecanadianpublic.com/live


Hydraglass
Premium
join:2002-05-08
Kingston, ON
reply to Guspaz
What's even worse, is at least for me, Best Buy has turned into a "showroom" where I go look at the merchandise, play with it, get my hands on it, decide if it's the one I want - model, type, etc - and then I go home and buy it online from wherever I get the best price and deal. If the BestBuy price was the best, I just end up buying it online from their site anyway - same price and home delivery so I don't have to go back and stand in line or answer questions about extended warranty.

The ONLY things I've bought in store at Best Buy the last 2-3 years are 4 flat panel TV's - shipping and delivery isn't reasonable on 36-55 inch tv's.


sm5w2
Premium
join:2004-10-13
St Thomas, ON
> What's even worse, is at least for me, Best Buy has turned into a "showroom" where I go look
> at the merchandise, play with it, get my hands on it, decide if it's the one I want - model, type,
> etc - and then I go home and buy it online from wherever I get the best price and deal.

You do realize that they've coined a term for exactly that behavior - don't you?

It's called "show-rooming".

So the next time you're at a big-box store, and (by some miracle) a salesperson walks up to you and asks if he can help you, I dare you to say "No - I'm just show-rooming..."

See if slaps you upside the head.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
said by sm5w2:

See if slaps you upside the head.

... and if you worked there and did that, you obviously wouldn't work there for very long because you don't have a clue of what you'd be doing.

Someone worth anything would provide you with the best service possible and point out that they price match online prices. Doing so would have the potential to turn that show-rooming into a sale, even if it may not be at posted price.


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to Guspaz
Futureshop/Bestbuy have nobody to blame for "showrooming" but themselves. The entire phenomenon only exists because Futureshop/Bestbuy prices are too high.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org


TOPDAWG
Premium
join:2005-04-27
Calgary, AB
kudos:3
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to sm5w2
well to have all part time workers is a smart business move. that way if one leaves it has no effect on your business as the person is not doing a key job you don't need a skilled person to replace them.

I do know best buys do have a shit-ton of mangers the one I was at in Barrie had at least 7 of them. Sucked as one would tell me one thing and the other would say something else. Sucked working there I even got in shit cause I was doing to much work. Forking teens were pretty damn lazy.


zacron
Premium
join:2008-11-26
canada
said by TOPDAWG:

well to have all part time workers is a smart business move. that way if one leaves it has no effect on your business as the person is not doing a key job you don't need a skilled person to replace them.

I do know best buys do have a shit-ton of mangers the one I was at in Barrie had at least 7 of them. Sucked as one would tell me one thing and the other would say something else. Sucked working there I even got in shit cause I was doing to much work. Forking teens were pretty damn lazy.

Work for yourself, it's much better!
--
"Recognize, Realize, and Repent"


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Reviews:
·VMedia
reply to urbanriot
said by urbanriot:

said by elwoodblues:

You are taking things out of context.

... You should probably re-read my post because I responded to him with direct context.

said by elwoodblues:

When you sell a commodity good like a TV, PC etc, there is almost no margin in it. If they sell you a $30 USB or HDMI cable , that's where the profit is.

Yet despite that, our area has two stores that focus on selling home theatre electronics, both of which have been around in some capacity or another since I moved to Niagara Falls and shopped for my first VCR back in the 80's.

Uhm it's called VOLUME, the item exampled above a commodity items, especially on the low end.

Those $30 USB/hdmi cables keep them afloat
--
No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake.......


TLS2000
Crazy Canuck
Premium
join:2004-02-24
Mississauga, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed
reply to Guspaz
said by Guspaz:

Futureshop/Bestbuy have nobody to blame for "showrooming" but themselves. The entire phenomenon only exists because Futureshop/Bestbuy prices are too high.

Ya, we'll exclude the fact that they actually have expensive stores to build, operate and maintain.
--
Tom


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
When one considers all the additional back-end infrastructure and freight/courier costs involved to run an operation like Amazon, and that the actual stores are capital costs that are eventually paid off, I would expect that the costs wouldn't be as different as everyone automatically assumes.

Costs would be higher for a B&M and a slight increase in price can be justified by someone who wants something right away, but those costs are certainly not so high as to justify some of the obscene price differences between the two. It is for this reason why people showroom. If they were smart, they'd turn that into an opportunity rather than something to rant about.


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:23
reply to TLS2000
said by TLS2000:

Ya, we'll exclude the fact that they actually have expensive stores to build, operate and maintain.

And what does that have to do with anything? If you have an item with a $100 profit margin, and you sell 10 units, or you have an item with a $20 profit margin, and you sell 100 units, which is making you more money?

NCIX also has stores, and they don't seem to have issues with profitability.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org


TOPDAWG
Premium
join:2005-04-27
Calgary, AB
kudos:3
reply to zacron
working on that now.

Warez_Zealot

join:2006-04-19
Vancouver
reply to Guspaz
said by Guspaz:

said by TLS2000:

Ya, we'll exclude the fact that they actually have expensive stores to build, operate and maintain.

And what does that have to do with anything? If you have an item with a $100 profit margin, and you sell 10 units, or you have an item with a $20 profit margin, and you sell 100 units, which is making you more money?

NCIX also has stores, and they don't seem to have issues with profitability.

I knew Best Buy was doomed to failure when they started giving their employees their stupid store credit cards and encouraging them to get indebted to them. Anyhow, I'll be happy when Best Buy finally folds up completely.
--
"You're not supposed to be so blind with patriotism that you can't face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who says it."-Malcolm X



corster
Premium
join:2002-02-23
Gatineau, QC
said by Warez_Zealot:

said by Guspaz:

said by TLS2000:

Ya, we'll exclude the fact that they actually have expensive stores to build, operate and maintain.

And what does that have to do with anything? If you have an item with a $100 profit margin, and you sell 10 units, or you have an item with a $20 profit margin, and you sell 100 units, which is making you more money?

NCIX also has stores, and they don't seem to have issues with profitability.

I knew Best Buy was doomed to failure when they started giving their employees their stupid store credit cards and encouraging them to get indebted to them. Anyhow, I'll be happy when Best Buy finally folds up completely.

The only reason every Best Buy/Future Shop employee has their credit card is because Best Buy passes on the processing fee when an employee uses their employee discount and pay with a credit card. The BB/FS credit cards didn't have to pay the upcharge.

telco_mtl

join:2012-01-06
reply to elwoodblues
said by elwoodblues:

said by milnoc:

Do remember that Radio Shack in the US and Canada were originally two entirely different companies that shared both business models and brands until Circuit City bought out the Canadian company and changed the name to "The Source by Circuit City".

Later, Bell bought out the chain, and renamed it simply "The Source".

As for the fall of the electronic components department, that's not surprising. Today's consumer electronics are made with tiny SMT components that are close to impossible to service without highly specialized equipment. These aren't your granddad's resistors, capacitors and transistors we're talking about here. Heck, I rarely ever saw anyone browse through those sections before they were pulled.

They were and they weren't. Tandy, who owns the Radio Shack name, spun off all their international holdings into a company called Intertan, which they took public.

Slowly but surely all international holdings, except for Canada were shut down or liquidated (always liked getting Foreign catalogues). When Circuit City bought Intertan, Tandy pulled the license to use the Radio Shack Name, after all, you don't want your biggest rival in the US using your corporate name in a different country, thus the name change.

interesting note, in the early 90s i used to always get the american and canadian catalogs, i was always amazed at how products with the same cat no. could be labeled with different brands. A re-branded pioneer 6 disk player in the states was labeled "optimus" and in canada was "genexxa" same box, same cat. no.

telco_mtl

join:2012-01-06
reply to LazMan
said by LazMan:

Circuit City ran it pretty much into the ground; and Bell took it over for pennies on the dollar, mostly to:

a) take away a big part of Rogers distribution chain (at the time, InterTan was in bed with Rogers)

and

b) increase Bell's retail presence almost instantaneously...

in quebec they were also probably the second biggest videotron distributor outside of videotron stores, videotron recently lost Brault and Martineau as well as a distributor


corster
Premium
join:2002-02-23
Gatineau, QC
said by telco_mtl:

said by LazMan:

Circuit City ran it pretty much into the ground; and Bell took it over for pennies on the dollar, mostly to:

a) take away a big part of Rogers distribution chain (at the time, InterTan was in bed with Rogers)

and

b) increase Bell's retail presence almost instantaneously...

in quebec they were also probably the second biggest videotron distributor outside of videotron stores, videotron recently lost Brault and Martineau as well as a distributor

Back in 2005 when Bell bought them, RadioShack/The Source was Rogers Wireless' single largest source of activations.

telco_mtl

join:2012-01-06
said by corster:

said by telco_mtl:

said by LazMan:

Circuit City ran it pretty much into the ground; and Bell took it over for pennies on the dollar, mostly to:

a) take away a big part of Rogers distribution chain (at the time, InterTan was in bed with Rogers)

and

b) increase Bell's retail presence almost instantaneously...

in quebec they were also probably the second biggest videotron distributor outside of videotron stores, videotron recently lost Brault and Martineau as well as a distributor

Back in 2005 when Bell bought them, RadioShack/The Source was Rogers Wireless' single largest source of activations.

yup if the compettition cant sell their product because you own the store...

zod5000

join:2003-10-21
Victoria, BC
Reviews:
·Shaw
reply to Gone
said by Gone:

When one considers all the additional back-end infrastructure and freight/courier costs involved to run an operation like Amazon, and that the actual stores are capital costs that are eventually paid off, I would expect that the costs wouldn't be as different as everyone automatically assumes.

Costs would be higher for a B&M and a slight increase in price can be justified by someone who wants something right away, but those costs are certainly not so high as to justify some of the obscene price differences between the two. It is for this reason why people showroom. If they were smart, they'd turn that into an opportunity rather than something to rant about.

To be fair the price differences between future shop/best buy and Amazon.ca (or any other Canadian online retailers) is minimal.

It's when you compare any Canadian retailer to a US retailer that that price difference is obscene.

I do think that B&M's have higher overhead. More staff, more expensive physical location, higher property taxes, more infrastructure, etc...


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Reviews:
·VMedia
reply to telco_mtl
said by telco_mtl:

interesting note, in the early 90s i used to always get the american and canadian catalogs, i was always amazed at how products with the same cat no. could be labeled with different brands. A re-branded pioneer 6 disk player in the states was labeled "optimus" and in canada was "genexxa" same box, same cat. no.

They were moving way from the Tandy owned brands, if it had taken off, Radio Shack would have become genexxa here in Canada, they had 2 stores, one in the Eaton centre, and one in Square one.

Never went anywhere.
--
No, I didn't. Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake.......

telco_mtl

join:2012-01-06
said by elwoodblues:

said by telco_mtl:

interesting note, in the early 90s i used to always get the american and canadian catalogs, i was always amazed at how products with the same cat no. could be labeled with different brands. A re-branded pioneer 6 disk player in the states was labeled "optimus" and in canada was "genexxa" same box, same cat. no.

They were moving way from the Tandy owned brands, if it had taken off, Radio Shack would have become genexxa here in Canada, they had 2 stores, one in the Eaton centre, and one in Square one.

Never went anywhere.

there were some good deals to be had if you knew who made the products, The RCA branded stuff at RS in the states is all pioneer these days

i miss realistic, archer and tandy lol i even have a TRS-80 coco still in its box


corster
Premium
join:2002-02-23
Gatineau, QC

2 edits
reply to elwoodblues
said by elwoodblues:

said by telco_mtl:

interesting note, in the early 90s i used to always get the american and canadian catalogs, i was always amazed at how products with the same cat no. could be labeled with different brands. A re-branded pioneer 6 disk player in the states was labeled "optimus" and in canada was "genexxa" same box, same cat. no.

They were moving way from the Tandy owned brands, if it had taken off, Radio Shack would have become genexxa here in Canada, they had 2 stores, one in the Eaton centre, and one in Square one.

Back around 2005 they had a concept store at Vaughan Mills and Eaton Centre called "THS Studio" focused on Televisions, MP3 Players, and Mobile Phones. It would not have surprised me if they were testing it for when their RadioShack trademark license expired in 2010 (became a moot point when they lost it in 2005 and rebranded as The Source).


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to elwoodblues
said by elwoodblues:

said by telco_mtl:

interesting note, in the early 90s i used to always get the american and canadian catalogs, i was always amazed at how products with the same cat no. could be labeled with different brands. A re-branded pioneer 6 disk player in the states was labeled "optimus" and in canada was "genexxa" same box, same cat. no.

They were moving way from the Tandy owned brands, if it had taken off, Radio Shack would have become genexxa here in Canada, they had 2 stores, one in the Eaton centre, and one in Square one.

Never went anywhere.

4, Georgian Mall and Fairview in Kitchener as well. That was a Keto thing. It got him ousted as President by the board of directors.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.