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BigReds42
Premium
join:2004-07-14
Bellaire, OH
kudos:1
reply to Phantasee

Re: SWTOR

said by Phantasee:

I still enjoy Anarchy Online. So enjoying SWTOR is okay if you like COMPLETE EA TAKEOVER RUBBISH CAKES. Other than that it's an ok game in my book.

And that is something the "cool kids" just can't admit... it becomes cool to bash it so we just go sheepishly along and follow the herd.


TigerLord
Resident pentaxian
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8
Reviews:
·ELECTRONICBOX
reply to BigReds42

said by BigReds42:

1. Ignored.

2. That is legitimate.

3. Opinion.... it's fucking Star Wars... Padawans become Jedi... Bad guys become Sith... you can't rewrite canon. You clearly didn't play through the Agent Story.

4. Legit.

5. Opinion... what do you want photorealism?

6. Going F2P doesn't make it the worst game of all time. It was just a bad decision to start off as P2P... after GW and other successful F2P models they shouldn't have made people pay.

3. KOTOR's storytelling was eons ahead in terms of quality. You have low standards.

5. Yes.

6. It makes it the biggest financial flop in the history of video game making, which is significant in and on itself especially when you consider this is Bioware.


gaforces
United We Stand, Divided We Fall

join:2002-04-07
Santa Cruz, CA
reply to TigerLord

A few innovative and different things.

Companions with story who fight and do your chores like selling junk out of inv and crafting.
Huttball! Was only fun for me with ranged characters.
Legacy wide benefits. Makes it easy to level alts quicker.
--
Let them eat FIBER!



BigReds42
Premium
join:2004-07-14
Bellaire, OH
kudos:1
reply to TigerLord

said by TigerLord:

3. KOTOR's storytelling was eons ahead in terms of quality. You have low standards.

5. Yes.

6. It makes it the biggest financial flop in the history of video game making, which is significant in and on itself especially when you consider this is Bioware.

3. Yes because they had the luxury of being a single player RPG on a console... this (despite how I play it) is still an MMO. And what is the "story" of GW2? WoW? etc? I'd give a week's paycheck to any casual peson who plays GW2 or WoW to come on here and actually explain any story they remember.

5. And then only people who can afford 2 $500 video cards would be able to play it.

6. "biggest financial flop in the history of video game"? They still have some subscribers.. and they'll make more money from microtransactions.... they'll recoup... it will just take time. Even if they make $14.... it's no longer the "biggest financial flop in the history of video game" You realize how much money Sony lost on the Playstations? Are they a big flop? Gotta look at the endgame my friend.


Savious
Ill-advised
Premium
join:2012-03-05
Belgrade, MT
kudos:4
reply to gaforces

SWTOR was the highest budget game of Hutt Ball I've ever played 10 times in a row.
--
Jobbie told me to keep my signature the same. This is me rebelling.



Zupe
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-29
New York, NY
reply to TigerLord

said by TigerLord:

-The end game was non existent at launch

I thought the story-telling aspects of leveling were innovative, and enjoyed the leveling experience quite a bit. The issue was, they never figured out how to carry that over at max level. Once the story ended, you were left with a standard MMO dungeon/raid setup, and they shot themselves in the foot with that by making what little there was of that content too easy.

You should not be able to go into the hardest raid in the game at the time with a group that's never seen the content before and be fully clearing it the first or second time you run it in this type of game. The ease of completing the raids and therefore, ease of gearing up through them, made the heroic/hardmode/whatever they were called dungeons obsolete, as you could get gear more easily from the raids. That knocked out that entire portion of content beyond seeing them once or twice for the experience, which in turn left almost nothing to do.
--
Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?
Pinky: I think so, Brain, but "Snowball for Windows"?


Savious
Ill-advised
Premium
join:2012-03-05
Belgrade, MT
kudos:4
reply to jofos

To be fair, SWTOR was a great game that came out 7 years too late.

The story, companions, environments were all fantastic, but they borrowed too much from WoW in mechanics but nothing regarding game play.

LFD would have been nice, for example. Running around in the fleet was irritating.
--
Jobbie told me to keep my signature the same. This is me rebelling.



Phantasee

join:2009-08-27
Hammond, LA
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to jofos

SWTOR was one of the only MMO's that I came away from playing and I could not explain what the turn-off was for me. I think it was a combination of the travel between quests. Lack of teamwork because everyone was trying to zerg rush through class quests. It tried way too hard to copy like Rift did. And I still think to this day Rift did a better job than SWTOR, regardless of numbers.

And that isn't saying much @ all for either game. Overall they are both quality MMO's compared to some of the rubbish that saturates the MMO market currently. MMo's these days lack adventure. The reason is today's target market does not have time for adventure. We all have time restrictions. The days of Everquest are behind us and most MMO's will be pay-to-win or feel like an E-Sport more than an adventure experience.



Ghastlyone
Premium
join:2009-01-07
Las Vegas, NV
kudos:5

1 edit
reply to BigReds42

said by BigReds42:

And then only people who can afford 2 $500 video cards would be able to play it.

You don't need a $1,000 in GPUs. This isn't a console port we're talking here. Is it too much to ask for a game that doesn't have graphics that look 8 years old right out the gate?

An MMO that releases in the year 2012 better have some damn good graphics or something at least current, not something emulating a cartoon style along the lines of WoW from 2004.


Phantasee

join:2009-08-27
Hammond, LA

Even if it looks like WoW, if it plays well and has a responsive UI, I'll be all over it.



TigerLord
Resident pentaxian
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8
Reviews:
·ELECTRONICBOX
reply to BigReds42

said by BigReds42:

3. Yes because they had the luxury of being a single player RPG on a console... this (despite how I play it) is still an MMO. And what is the "story" of GW2? WoW? etc? I'd give a week's paycheck to any casual peson who plays GW2 or WoW to come on here and actually explain any story they remember.

5. And then only people who can afford 2 $500 video cards would be able to play it.

6. "biggest financial flop in the history of video game"? They still have some subscribers.. and they'll make more money from microtransactions.... they'll recoup... it will just take time. Even if they make $14.... it's no longer the "biggest financial flop in the history of video game" You realize how much money Sony lost on the Playstations? Are they a big flop? Gotta look at the endgame my friend.

3. The story was better than WoW or GW2, but for Star Wars cannon it was poor.

5. Just lower the frickin' graphics if you can't afford a fancy SLI setup. Nobody is forcing us to run things on ultra with forced AA and Ambient Occlusion. Some of us would just like to have the option.

6. You don't realize the millions that was invested in the PR campaign alone will never justify the money spent when looking at the success. My guess is Riot Games will have made more money in the past 2 years from a simple game like LoL than Bioware EVER will from SWTOR even if it would still be here in 50 years. Apparently it cost 200 millions to develop SWTOR.

I'd be interested to know how much it cost to make Skyrim, a game of comparable if not bigger scope and size, even if they're very different.


Ghastlyone
Premium
join:2009-01-07
Las Vegas, NV
kudos:5
reply to Phantasee

said by Phantasee:

Even if it looks like WoW, if it plays well and has a responsive UI, I'll be all over it.

I can deal with something that looks like WoW and runs good. What I can't accept is something that looks like WoW and runs like shit also.

jofos

join:2008-02-14
Irvington, AL
reply to BigReds42

said by BigReds42:

said by Phantasee:

I still enjoy Anarchy Online. So enjoying SWTOR is okay if you like COMPLETE EA TAKEOVER RUBBISH CAKES. Other than that it's an ok game in my book.

And that is something the "cool kids" just can't admit... it becomes cool to bash it so we just go sheepishly along and follow the herd.

Not really worried about being cool as I don't know any of you so why would I care if you think I'm cool. But the game has been out for over a year. I paid two sunscriptions, one for me one for my son, for 8 months and I just paid for another month a few days ago. How can anyone not say there is a problem when you can't even use your characters?
To be fair to BW and SWTOR I can now log into all my characters and for my inconvenience they are giving me some cartel coins.


footballdude
Premium
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO
reply to BigReds42

said by BigReds42:

Therein lies the problem... people buying into over-hype.

You missed the point. The amount of resources EA put into development of SWTOR meant that it's success or failure was going to make significant waves in the industry. The amount of sales and long term subscriptions it received wasn't enough to justify it's cost. It is now highly unlikely that anyone else will sink massive amounts of resources into a subscription MMO.
--
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty - Ronald Reagan


puppy

join:2010-01-28

I think you are mostly on the mark football but I remember when 100M for Waterworld (the stinker movie) was such a calamity back then, but now it's no biggie to hit the 100M for a normal movie. People have short memories and tons of cheap cash sloshing around in the world!



drew
Automatic
Premium
join:2002-07-10
Port Orchard, WA
kudos:6
reply to jofos

It's been a while since I saw some good old fashioned BRage™!

SWTOR had a pretty fresh look at questing... until you realized that the throw-away character that wants fifteen spacerat skulls is now not only throw-away text, but it's dialog driven and slows the pace down considerably.

Combine that and the pre-40 vanilla WoW travel speeds, even with mounts, between quests... I felt like I was spending far too much time doing everything BUT playing my character in combat.

I still have a major gripe with the UI - there is absolutely no reason to make me press as many buttons as I had to to heal somebody. Either Clique-style or mouseover macros, please.

As for the art style... it was not bad, but certainly not my cup-of-tea in a lot of areas. I remember SWG (and I haven't played that in YEARS) worlds having more detail than SWTOR's did. Lack of LFD at the beginning was also a huge deal. I like grouping, I like instances. That's fun! Making me sit somewhere and spam a chat channel instead of playing is crappy. Even FFXI had a better system, IMO.
--
flickr | 'Cause I've been waiting, all my life just waiting
For you to shine, shine your light on me



footballdude
Premium
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO

said by drew:

Lack of LFD at the beginning was also a huge deal. I like grouping, I like instances. That's fun! Making me sit somewhere and spam a chat channel instead of playing is crappy. Even FFXI had a better system, IMO.

That's why I eventually gave up on the game. Once I hit max level on my sorcerer, I would have been happy running an instance or two every day and doing occassional leveling on my alts. I went an entire week not being able to find any groups at all for anything, then decided I wasn't going to pay for that crap anymore. Lack of LFD is the main reason I haven't logged into Guild Wars 2 for a few weeks. I just started fooling around with a character in Tera. I don't know yet if that has a LFD, but if it doesn't it won't last for me, either.
--
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty - Ronald Reagan


Koil
Premium
join:2002-09-10
Irmo, SC
kudos:2

1 recommendation

Come.

Join us...

We all float down here...

»Path of Exile



footballdude
Premium
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO

said by Koil:

Come.

Join us...

We all float down here...

»Path of Exile

I don't beta. I'd rather let someone else squash all the bugs. I'll likely check it out when it goes live, though.
--
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty - Ronald Reagan


Savious
Ill-advised
Premium
join:2012-03-05
Belgrade, MT
kudos:4

Its not really beta anymore, as the game is not doing anymore char wipes.
--
Jobbie told me to keep my signature the same. This is me rebelling.



Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·ooma
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com
reply to Koil

said by Koil:

Come.

Join us...

We all float down here...

»Path of Exile

Already with you.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·ooma
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com
reply to footballdude

said by footballdude:

said by BigReds42:

Therein lies the problem... people buying into over-hype.

You missed the point. The amount of resources EA put into development of SWTOR meant that it's success or failure was going to make significant waves in the industry. The amount of sales and long term subscriptions it received wasn't enough to justify it's cost. It is now highly unlikely that anyone else will sink massive amounts of resources into a subscription MMO.

In the end, who gives a shit.

BigReds42 likes playing the game. He brings up some very valid points. Was it over-hyped? Oh yes. Did it have no end game? Oh yes. He is merely saying that the game is fun for him, and while others here may disagree, it doesn't matter because this is America and the game is free to play. No skin off your ass or anyone else here who thinks the game is weak or is shit.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


TigerLord
Resident pentaxian
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8
Reviews:
·ELECTRONICBOX

said by Nightfall:

In the end, who gives a shit.

He obviously does since he asked us for actual arguments, which we gave him. Can't blame us for that.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·ooma
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com

said by TigerLord:

said by Nightfall:

In the end, who gives a shit.

He obviously does since he asked us for actual arguments, which we gave him. Can't blame us for that.

True that. I am just saying in the end, it doesn't matter.

This is playing out like a tastes great, less filling commercial.

Time to move on.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


bionicRod
Funkier than a mohair disco ball.
Premium
join:2009-07-06
united state
kudos:2

Tastes Great > Less Filling

And you're old for using that reference. And I'm old for getting it. Fuck it let's go get a beer.



TigerLord
Resident pentaxian
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

1 recommendation

reply to jofos

I could go for an icecold Guiness right now.



bionicRod
Funkier than a mohair disco ball.
Premium
join:2009-07-06
united state
kudos:2

Somebody left a 12 pack of Boulevard Wheat in my beer fridge from the Superbowl party. I normally like something darker but damn if it's not tasting good.



Koil
Premium
join:2002-09-10
Irmo, SC
kudos:2
reply to footballdude

Sav's right, it's not very beta. There are a few things here and there, but nothing game breaking...more polish, I'd say...very playable, very well done, no more char wipes...No reason not to jump in.

...less'n yer yella!



footballdude
Premium
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO

1 recommendation

said by Koil:

Sav's right, it's not very beta. There are a few things here and there, but nothing game breaking...more polish, I'd say...very playable, very well done, no more char wipes...No reason not to jump in.

...less'n yer yella!

I ain't skeered!
--
Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty - Ronald Reagan

malem83

join:2006-08-25
Quebec, QC
reply to jofos

I've had a blast leveling my toons. Then the high end blasted me away from the game

High end don't interest you so i'm not gonna make a big focus on this as to why this game failed to deliver.

I look at planets, and they are not planets, they are war zones where people stand in place, doing nothing. This makes the game look bland. I would have prefered a BIG campaign on the same planet where you actually explore the planet.

Space mission were too easy back then and the concept of a rail shooting while the rest of the game is open world seems a bit whacky to me. But still, the concept of having our own space ship is great. I would have loved to be able to use it in a more "direct way" in the game. How about making a space operation ?? Say you start a RAID by attack a big enemy ship and make it crash on a planet then continue that raid on the lands ??? That alone would have made the game up the what people were expecting. Something unique and BIG.

I still play the game. W-hell, I came back a week ago and found myself enjoying to level some new toons and upgrade my current ones too. But, my sources tell me that they still add 2 bugs for every one they fix. That makes me think of something else they failed with : Bugs, and the time they take to fix them.

This is a good game. I've been having a lot of fun, but still, there is also a lot of disappointement. I don't care what they take from the other games. I just wish they make it mature more and develop what will make this game a must.
--
La vie continue ... / Life goes on ...