GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
 ·CableOne
2 edits | [WIN8] Did windows 8 adversely affect XP hard drive? I am having a problem with a Seagate 160GB IDE hard drive while trying to install XP on an older Intel computer with an Abit AG8 i915 motherboard.
Took the drive out and installed it on a Windows 8 system to run diagnostics and to repartition and wipe the drive.
Then tried reinstalling XP onto the drive in the old computer. XP seemed to install fine, but booted up only once after the OS was installed. Then it would refuse to boot again. Tried every jumper setting and different IDE cables as Master, Slave, and Cable select. Finally got XP to boot as far as the Windows welcome window where it either freezes or locks up depending on whether the jumper is set to Master or Slave or Cable Select. The IDE drive is recognized in the bios.
Bios IDE settings are set to "combined" mode which is supposed to allow two IDE devices and two Sata devices with the IDE devices being Primary. There are no Sata devices installed.
The bios boot settings are set correctly. The Hard Drive is set as the first boot device. There is only one hard drive in the computer and it is set in the bios as the first (only) hard drive to boot.
I use USB thumb drives, but have them removed in trying to solved the problem of the drive not completing the XP boot process. The problem still persists.
There are no Sata devices in the old computer. The problem occurs when the Optical drive is present and also occurs when the Optical drive is removed leaving only the IDE hard drive as the only device in the computer.
In other words, the problem occurs no matter what.
Tried installing XP Pro from different install CDs. Again the problem repeats itself with both XP Pro install CDs that we have here. Have not yet tried it with XP Home ed or with W7 or Vista.
Ran Seagate Drive Tools for DOS. The drive passes the Seagate Drive Tools tests.
I don't think the drive size is a problem. A 250GB IDE hard drive was pulled from another system to test in the old computer. It worked and booted Windows and ran Windows XP.
I'm near the point of tossing the 160GB hard drive, but wonder if partitioning and formatting the drive in Windows 8 prior to trying it again in XP might have done something to the drive that prevents it from working properly when attempting to reinstall XP. BTW, when reinstalling XP the W8 partition was deleted and a new XP OS partition was created on the hard drive from the XP install disc.
Any thoughts as to whats happened to this drive to prevent it from booting into windows more than just once after XP's install process is completed? |
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 plencnerbPremium
join:2000-09-25
Elgin, IL
kudos:2 | Re: [WIN8] Does windows 8 adversely affect XP hard drives? Thanks to google, I was able to find the screen where you can perform the actions on your hard drive (Create partitions, remove existing partitions, etc), as well as the format options.
The first screen is of course where you partition and configure the drive. After you removed any existing partitions, did you create one and then install, or did you just hit the enter key to "install to unpartitioned space"?
I'm also what kind of option did you select for format? That screen is the 2nd picture. Did you do a quick format, or a full format? With it being a 160 GB Drive, a full format may take some time.
--Brian
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--Brian Plencner
E-Mail: CoasterBrian72Cancer@gmail.com
Note: Kill Cancer to Reply via e-mail |
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| reply to Gem
Not sure what you did in Windows 8, but Win8 can create GPT partitions that can confuse the hell out of older Windows OSs.
I know of 2 easy way to deal with that:
a) use some program that wipes the HD and run that -- that should get rid of all partitions
b) use a good partition editor such as GParted that can get rid of all types of partitions, and remove them
As an aside, you probably want to run a surface analysis on that HD, too.
I normally use Hiren's bootcd, but there are many other ways to get the needed tools.
PS: I just went through the above exercise and some more (  ) not very long ago.
--
Wacky Races 2012! |
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 KilroyPremium,MVM
join:2002-11-21
Ann Arbor, MI | reply to Gem
Just a thought. You may be lookin in the wrong place. I'd run Darik's Boot and Nuke on the drive to eliminate the issues that aurgathor  pointed out. If it continues after that I'd suspect the power supply.
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“Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something.” ¯ Robert A. Heinlein |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
| reply to plencnerb
I tried the XP install many many times, Brian, on that 160GB drive.
First two times were with the XP install disc, deleting all existing partitions on the drive, then doing a quick NFTS format the first time, and a Full NTFS format the second time.
Both times Windows XP installed on the drive and did the first boot into windows from the XP CD if you know what I mean, but thereafter it won't reboot into XP on the 160GB hard drive no matter what.
Then did some testing and reformatting in W8 and tried the XP installs again with the same no boot into windows result.
Then Seagate drive tests that show nothing wrong followed by a couple more XP installs that won't boot on their own into Windows after the install.
Then zeroed the drive with Seagate tools and tried more installs of XP onto the 160GB hard drive - still it won't boot on into windows after the first boot following the OS install.
Then tried installing windows on a different 250GB drive and windows boots normally.
Just stubborn, I guess. Trying to figure out what's wrong and how to fix it... |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
| reply to aurgathor
Okay, based on Aurgathor's comments and based on reading up on GPT partitions on Wiki, it sounds like they "might" be the problem.
The problem is how to deal with the GPT issue. I've zeroed the hard drive with Seagate's own drive tools, but the problem still persists.
Will try Hiren's tools next and will report back. Thanks for the help, guys.  |
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| Since you supposedly zerod said HD, that should've deleted GPT partitions, but since that's only an implicit operation, one cannot be 100% sure without verifying it in some way.
Start with the obvious.
Did you remove the CD/DVD from the optical drive after install?
What are the relevant settings in the BIOS?
Did you explicitly mark the partition active? Do you have other partitions on that drive?
Next time turn off all other boot devices, and see if the problem still repeats.
If yes, put that HD into another machine and get a smartctl log of it (i.e. "smartctl -x /dev/sdb" ) to see if there's anything wrong with the drive.
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Wacky Races 2012! |
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KilroyPremium,MVM
join:2002-11-21
Ann Arbor, MI | reply to plencnerb
If there are questions about the drive a full format is recommeneded as it will possibly resolve issues where sectors need to be relocated due to errors on the disk. 160GB shouldn't take more than a couple hours to format. I've done full 3TB drives in less than 12.
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“Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something.” ¯ Robert A. Heinlein |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
| reply to aurgathor
said by aurgathor:Start with the obvious. See Answers to Questions asked:
Did you remove the CD/DVD from the optical drive after install? - Yes
What are the relevant settings in the BIOS? All set to boot HD first and this is the only HD. Set to boot IDE first over Sata. There are no other devices other than the DVD/CD and the 160GB Seagate HD attached. Even tried booting into Windows without the Optical drive attached, there it will get to the Windows "Welcome" screen but either just keeps running there or it locks up depending on how the drive jumper is set.
Drive Jumper was set to CS, Master, and Slave to see if any would make a difference - result was no difference.
Did you explicitly mark the partition active? - Yes and that is confirmed viewing the drive in Computer Management tool in a different computer.
Do you have other partitions on that drive? - No.
Next time turn off all other boot devices, and see if the problem still repeats. That's already been done. See answer to question 2 above.
If yes, put that HD into another machine and get a smartctl log of it (i.e. "smartctl -x /dev/sdb" ) to see if there's anything wrong with the drive. - Not sure how to do that, don't know Linus or Linux, but I have viewed the drive in other Windows machines. It is marked as a Basic Active Partition.
Add'l info. - Erased the drive with Seagate's version of True Image with no problems doing so. But the drive would not erase with Seagate Drive Tools for DOS. Short Erase worked, but Long Erase failed.
Sometimes an error message shows error reading something like "00, 0" when running the seagate diagnostics. Seagate has a "short drive test" that the drive passes. Running Seagate's long drive test now.
Also burning Hiren's Boot CD now.
More later. Interim comments/suggestions/thoughts in mean time are still welcome and desired. It's a mystery.
One more thing. Seagate Drive Tools for DOS report that the drive supports security features and that SMART is presently enabled. I don't know how to turn either of those off. |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
| reply to Kilroy
said by Kilroy:If there are questions about the drive a full format is recommeneded as it will possibly resolve issues where sectors need to be relocated due to errors on the disk. 160GB shouldn't take more than a couple hours to format. I've done full 3TB drives in less than 12.
You'd think so, but it didn't solve the problems in this case.
Also, here's an update for everyone who has replied so far:
The 160GB Seagate IDE hard drive just passed the Seagate Drive Tools for DOS "long test" without errors, but it still fails the Seagate attempt to erase the drive - possibly due to the GPT issue or possibly due to whatever security feature the drive may have that I don't know how to disable.
Does anyone know what those security features might be and how they can be disabled? |
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Reviews:
 ·WestNet Broadband
| For Win8:
Have you tried or can you have it as a second drive and use CCleaner's wipe function or a tool like HDD Tune Pro's wipe function?
For the computer it wil be installed in:
Dban should work off a boot disk as mentioned.
Also have you used any partition tool that boots off a CD, USB to view the partition tables?
Hiren's Boot CD is one, but there are specific one's like GParted etc.
Strange that Seagate's tool for it's own drive does not work.
Might be worth moving short term to the hardware forum until you get a clean wipe before moving on to the install.
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The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
1 edit | You guys are doing fine and we've already started here in the MS forum so lets stay here unless the mods force it to be moved.
Besides, other folks might have the same problem with W8 if they try moving a hard from a W8 install to an XP build.
Here's and UPDATE and answers to your questions:
1) No, I didn't try wiping the drive from CCleaner or HDD Tune, but I have wiped the drive totally with two DOS tools that did work:
-- Seagate's version of True Image has a wipe command. That one wiped the whole drive yesterday.
-- Hiren's GParted program has a DOS tool or Linux tool or whatever that just this afternoon wiped the whole drive, but...
After finishing wiping with the Hiren's disc, I booted again into Seagate's Drive Tools for DOS. That utility shows the same error message when it views the drive as before "Can't read from Partition Tables at 00, Sector 0". Actually it said "error when reading from..."
That could be the big problem with this drive and perhaps that is the reason that Seagate's Drive Tools for Dos couldn't wipe the drive, just don't know.
Caution to anyone who has a mind to try Hiren's. Using the GParted program on it to wipe my drive took several hours. Upon completion it looks like either my monitor or video card was damaged in the process. So user beware on that one.
As to using any partition tool that boots off a CD. Yes, I tried viewing the partitions with GParted, but after wiping the drive it couldn't find the drive to mount it again. Don't know if that is normal or not as I know very little about Linux. Just followed what few instructions there are on the Hiren's CD. I'm wondering if that CD is legit or not. Some of those programs may be copyrighted. Unless they are all licensed under a free Software GPL we likely should not be using it. If it infringes copyrights I'm going to toss it and don't recommend it.
I can partition the drive in Windows XP or in Windows 8 or by using the partition tools in the XP install CD. The drive appears to be fine after it is partitioned using any of those methods, but it won't boot windows after a clean install no matter which method is used to partition the drive. That's the issue we need to fix, if it can be fixed.
Part of Seagate's tools do work on the drive, just not all of them and perhaps that is due to whatever is causing the Partition Tables to be unreadable.
Still don't know anything about the potential effect of the Security features that are on the drive. Does anyone know how to disable those? or even what they are?
Any more help or advice or does anyone know what's wrong here? |
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 sivranOpera convertPremium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
kudos:1 | Can any other OS boot when installed on that drive? Quickest way to test that I think is to grab damn small linux, boot it, and install it. It's tiny so it can't possibly take very long to install.
FWIW I currently have a poor man's dual boot going with 8 and XP--all I gotta do is swap the drives in my bios. XP continues to boot fine and dandy.
--
Think Outside the Fox. |
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OZOPremium
join:2003-01-17
kudos:2 | reply to Gem
Re: [WIN8] windows 8 adversely affects XP hard drives Create two partitions. 1st for OS and allocate to it less then 120 GiB (I'd make it 30GiB) and second for data.
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Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself... |
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| reply to Gem
Re: [WIN8] Does windows 8 adversely affect XP hard drives? said by Gem: That utility shows the same error message when it views the drive as before "Can't read from Partition Tables at 00, Sector 0". Actually it said "error when reading from..."
That is very bad, and you may want to find out what's going on there -- the disk could be damaged. MHDD has a command that reads all sectors and displays how long it took to read them, but there should be several other suitable tools there.
Caution to anyone who has a mind to try Hiren's. Using the GParted program on it to wipe my drive took several hours. Upon completion it looks like either my monitor or video card was damaged in the process. So user beware on that one.
--
Wacky Races 2012! |
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| reply to Gem
Re: [WIN8] windows 8 adversely affects XP hard drives Diskpart
List disk
Select disk x
Clean
Make sure you select the correct disk or you will be very sad. |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
| reply to OZO
said by OZO:Create two partitions. 1st for OS and allocate to it less then 120 GiB (I'd make it 30GiB) and second for data.
That's the way I normally install an OS. The first small partition is what I created already during the Windows XP install routine. The larger data partition would have been created from within XP later, but alas, the Windows XP install would not boot...
That's the still the problem.
Going to test it with a small Linux install in a moment to see if it will boot with that.
Be back in a bit with more information soon. |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
2 edits | reply to aurgathor
Re: [WIN8] Does windows 8 adversely affect XP hard drives? said by aurgathor:said by Gem: That utility shows the same error message when it views the drive as before "Can't read from Partition Tables at 00, Sector 0". Actually it said "error when reading from..."
That is very bad, and you may want to find out what's going on there -- the disk could be damaged. MHDD has a command that reads all sectors and displays how long it took to read them, but there should be several other suitable tools there.
Caution to anyone who has a mind to try Hiren's. Using the GParted program on it to wipe my drive took several hours. Upon completion it looks like either my monitor or video card was damaged in the process. So user beware on that one.
Can you elaborate? As to MHDD, what is the full name of that program or is that it?
Do you have a link from which to download it?
As to Hiren's and the monitor or video card that might have been damaged, what happened is that after several hours of running the disk wiping routine, I came back to a black screen with yellow dots scattered through out the display and some text that was just barely readable.
When I rebooted into the bios, I could read the bios test, but some characters were in different small blocks of color and many of the yellow dots remained. It was as if looking at a display of a target that had been shot by a shotgun with very small lead pellets and as if the target was backlighted by a yellow light.
Very gradually the display problems seem to have gotten less as the monitor and video card cooled down - that's my theory. It's now almost back to normal. Best guess is whatever the default display settings were in gparted on that disk may have been too high for my monitor or the video card. Still hoping that both will fully recover.
I'll check soon and get back on that. Obviously, I'm not on that computer to login and post here as that computer isn't working yet.
UPDATE: Partial good news on the monitor and video card.
After cooling down overnight both seem to be running more normally now. All the small yellow pin prick dots are gone from the black post screens, but some letters still appear in blocks of blue colors instead of pure white. Take a look at a normal bios post screen, you'll see only white on black, but mine now shows some letters in colored blocks. |
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GemPremium
join:2005-09-10
kudos:2 Reviews:
·CableOne
| reply to lorennerol
Re: [WIN8] windows 8 adversely affects XP hard drives said by lorennerol:Diskpart
List disk
Select disk x
Clean
Make sure you select the correct disk or you will be very sad.
Okay, but where is Diskpart? is that part of XP, W7, or W8?
If not how do I run it?
Remember, I'm not a Linux user so don't know even the most obvious things about that OS. |
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Reviews:
·WestNet Broadband
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