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kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8
reply to HiVolt

Re: Sagemcom defective bridge mode and port forwarding...

said by HiVolt:

Yep sagemcom cant do more than 37-38mbps in pppoe passthru. I have also tested this...

I wonder if Bell is aware of this.

Sucky thing the old Cellpipe also can't do more than 42-43 in both routed or bridged mode either.

Wow... even the Cellpipe... this is horrible.

sunnyd71

join:2004-05-22
l7z2t4

Same issue here. I also noticed before I upgraded to 50 that my 25 line would only get 23/8.5 with passthrough but 25/10 with DHCP. With the 50/10 plan I get 33/9 with passthrough.

Not being able to route internally is very annoying for me as my phone switched between cell network and home wifi and I used to use a single DDNS address to connect but now that address will not work on my own wifi.


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8
reply to kovy

Well I'm using a Huawei HG610 VDSL2... getting full speed in bridge mode. So Sagemcom is really horrible...


yym7890

join:2007-10-01
Montreal, QC

can you use it on 25/10 plan in QC?


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by yym7890:

can you use it on 25/10 plan in QC?

Well it works on those 7330 slam, not sure on the stinger one.


HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21

If its broadcom chipset it likely wont work on a stinger... those require an Ikanos based modem, either the cellpipe or sagemcom.
--
F**K THE NHL. Go Blue Jays 2013!!!


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by HiVolt:

If its broadcom chipset it likely wont work on a stinger... those require an Ikanos based modem, either the cellpipe or sagemcom.

eurfff... poor them.

urbang33k

join:2010-02-13
Canada
kudos:1
reply to HiVolt

said by HiVolt:

If its broadcom chipset it likely wont work on a stinger... those require an Ikanos based modem, either the cellpipe or sagemcom.

So what chipset does the sagemcom have in it? The sagemcom works on both lucent and alcatel vdsl slams. If your third party modem has teh same chipset as the sagemcom, wouldn't it stand to reason, that it would work on both of Bells slam vendors?
--
Opinions and ideas expressed in my post are my own and in no way represent those of Bell Canada Enterprises, Bell Canada, Bell TV, Bell Internet, Bell Mobility, Bell Technical Solutions, Expertech, or any other partners under the BCE umbrella.


HiVolt
Premium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:21
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
·TekSavvy Cable

Sagemcom has an Ikanos chipset in it. The exact name was mentioned on the forums by someone that took one apart. The Cellpipe also has a Ikanos chipset in it, however it's older and does not support ADSL/ADSL2, while the Sagemcom does have that fallback capability.

Believe there have been lots of searches by people to find a modem that would work on the Stingers... By my account, only one person found a very expensive, now discontinued modem. And that modem required a router that could set a VLAN ID on its own router, as that modem was a basic bridge.
--
F**K THE NHL. Go Blue Jays 2013!!!



BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile

4 edits
reply to kovy

The only non-Bell supplied modem I know that works on Stingers is the ZyXEL P-870M-I1 v2. The modem itself supports upto 30a, but the Stinger line module is limited to 12a. It may still be possible to get one of these modems, but you need a serial interface and lot of patience to get it working. It's a straight-through ethernet bridge device and runs 50/10M at full speed: »speedtest.net/result/2515723493.png

Unfortunately this is about the best speed Bell can do with Stingers. Gigabit DSL is only theoretical. And besides Broadcom all xDSL vendors went bankrupt. It doesn't really make sense to upgrade to more disposable VDSL2 junk in a high density area when for around the same cost per customer you can do FTTH. The latest VDSL chips only go upto 200/100 with vectoring at 150 meters. And bonding is not practical because the ports are expensive, using two pairs cuts your DSLAM density in half! There is not much money in copper since GPON became standard. Just pray it comes soon.

said by urbang33k:

So what chipset does the sagemcom have in it? The sagemcom works on both lucent and alcatel vdsl slams. If your third party modem has teh same chipset as the sagemcom, wouldn't it stand to reason, that it would work on both of Bells slam vendors?

It's FXS60IF1 to be specific, paired with a IKF6850 CPU: »www.ikanos.com/wp-content/upload···v112.pdf. The Sagemcom chip does both ADSL2+ and VDSL2 up to 17a. The Zyxel chip does VDSL2 only up to 30a.

s_tux_g

join:2012-03-03

Hi Guys,

My question is a little bit off-topic but since you mentioned Bell's DSLAM I'm wandering if anybody knows the full name, or much better a link to the spec of those non-interoperable and problematic remotes called Stingers?



xsbell

join:2008-12-22
Canada
kudos:8
Reviews:
·Primus Telecommu..

1 edit

said by s_tux_g:

Hi Guys,

My question is a little bit off-topic but since you mentioned Bell's DSLAM I'm wandering if anybody knows the full name, or much better a link to the spec of those non-interoperable and problematic remotes called Stingers?

It's a Lucent Stinger CR (compact remote).

It's not the remote that's the problem though, it's the CO-4 chipset on the line card. The CO-5 doesn't have the same problems, but it's limited to 17a and only does ADSL/VDSL2.

s_tux_g

join:2012-03-03

said by s_tux_g:

Hi Guys,

My question is a little bit off-topic but since you mentioned Bell's DSLAM I'm wandering if anybody knows the full name, or much better a link to the spec of those non-interoperable and problematic remotes called Stingers?

It's a Lucent Stinger CR (compact remote).

It's not the remote that's the problem though, it's the CO-4 chipset on the line card. The CO-5 doesn't have the same problems, but it's limited to 17a and only does ADSL/VDSL2.

Thank you so much! It's exactly what I was looking for.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to BliZZardX

said by BliZZardX:

Unfortunately this is about the best speed Bell can do with Stingers. Gigabit DSL is only theoretical. And besides Broadcom all xDSL vendors went bankrupt. It doesn't really make sense to upgrade to more disposable VDSL2 junk in a high density area when for around the same cost per customer you can do FTTH. The latest VDSL chips only go upto 200/100 with vectoring at 150 meters. And bonding is not practical because the ports are expensive, using two pairs cuts your DSLAM density in half! There is not much money in copper since GPON became standard. Just pray it comes soon.

Yeah, the areas that are served by Stingers now are SOL as far as ever getting upgraded to something beyond that's still copper.

Bell will continue to deploy VDSL2 to new areas with 7330s though, since those same SLAMs are used for FTTH now and can be (relatively) easily converted to FTTH if they ever decide to rip out the copper and replace it with GPON instead. There's still lots of areas they want to get Fibe TV into over the copper network, and the rollout won't be "finished" until 2015.

You can also say what you want about bonding, but they're already doing it in the US and Bell is planning on doing the same thing here.

kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by Gone:

said by BliZZardX:

Unfortunately this is about the best speed Bell can do with Stingers. Gigabit DSL is only theoretical. And besides Broadcom all xDSL vendors went bankrupt. It doesn't really make sense to upgrade to more disposable VDSL2 junk in a high density area when for around the same cost per customer you can do FTTH. The latest VDSL chips only go upto 200/100 with vectoring at 150 meters. And bonding is not practical because the ports are expensive, using two pairs cuts your DSLAM density in half! There is not much money in copper since GPON became standard. Just pray it comes soon.

Yeah, the areas that are served by Stingers now are SOL as far as ever getting upgraded to something beyond that's still copper.

Bell will continue to deploy VDSL2 to new areas with 7330s though, since those same SLAMs are used for FTTH now and can be (relatively) easily converted to FTTH if they ever decide to rip out the copper and replace it with GPON instead. There's still lots of areas they want to get Fibe TV into over the copper network, and the rollout won't be "finished" until 2015.

You can also say what you want about bonding, but they're already doing it in the US and Bell is planning on doing the same thing here.

What do you mean those slam are used for FTTH?


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

Well, it's not an actual SLAM but it's the same idea. You need to swap the copper cards for fibre cards or something like that, but the underlying equipment is all still there.


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by Gone:

Well, it's not an actual SLAM but it's the same idea. You need to swap the copper cards for fibre cards or something like that, but the underlying equipment is all still there.

Hmmm... I'm not sure it's that easy...


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

Compared to building an underlying neighbourhood fibre infrastructure and deploying it to existing houses, swapping out the line cards on an access module would most likely be the easiest part of the endeavour.


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by Gone:

Compared to building an underlying neighbourhood fibre infrastructure and deploying it to existing houses, swapping out the line cards on an access module would most likely be the easiest part of the endeavour.

It's not a simple of swapping out line cards...


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

Fair enough. If it's not a matter of swapping out shelves and then laying the fibre infrastructure to the home, what else is involved?


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by Gone:

Fair enough. If it's not a matter of swapping out shelves and then laying the fibre infrastructure to the home, what else is involved?

At the CO ? The actual equipment is all at the CO... these things are a different monster all together. Just for telephone service... it's no longer the same equipment giving the dial tone.

And there's a fiber splitter somewhere outside.

Also, there's a few equipment needed to install at the customer.


BliZZardX
Premium
join:2002-08-18
Toronto, ON
Reviews:
·WIND Mobile
reply to Gone

Rogers buries cables all the time, the permits are very inexpensive. Since the ground is warming up again there's actually a line burial job ad up for one of their contractors now »toronto.kijiji.ca/c-jobs-constru···67932442

IMO the cost of doing FTTH now with borrowing costs as low as they are is almost always less than doing DSL then scrapping it in 5 years to convert to GPON. There was also a Bell tech here awhile ago saying they have started replacing old copper lines that failed with fiber.



Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to kovy

I would expect the dialtone side would be something IP based with the ONU handling the conversion for distribution to internal copper wiring. As I understand it the data/television side should be the same Alcatel headend equipment at the CO regardless of whether the final segment to the customer is being delivered by copper or by fibre. The only thing that changes is what's outside the plant. If it's copper it should be a 7330, if it's fibre it should be a 7340. I suppose without the distance limitations you could put the 7340s right into the CO, though.


kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by Gone:

I would expect the dialtone side would be something IP based with the ONU handling the conversion for distribution to internal copper wiring. As I understand it the data/television side should be the same Alcatel headend equipment at the CO regardless of whether the final segment to the customer is being delivered by copper or by fibre. The only thing that changes is what's outside the plant. If it's copper it should be a 7330, if it's fibre it should be a 7340. I suppose without the distance limitations you could put the 7340s right into the CO, though.

I'm pretty sure the equipement at the CO needs to be changed in order to handle 175/175mbps profiles and probably more into the future.

Also I'm pretty sure puting multiple 7342 into JWI would be more costing the puting it straight at the CO.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to BliZZardX

said by BliZZardX:

IMO the cost of doing FTTH now with borrowing costs as low as they are is almost always less than doing DSL then scrapping it in 5 years to convert to GPON. There was also a Bell tech here awhile ago saying they have started replacing old copper lines that failed with fiber.

You're probably right, but as a simple matter of economics they'll stretch copper as far as they can before they give it up. If they can save a few bucks by only having to pay for the permits to get fibre from the CO to the OPI and then using what they already have from there to the subscriber, they will.

We've got all sorts of FTTH down here in Niagara at various new developments, though. There's even a serviced area without any houses built on it here in Fort Erie that has the Bell fibre coiled up waiting for something to be built. More amusingly, there's a part of Niagara Falls on St. Michael Avenue where one part of the street is FTTH, a little further south one side of the street is VDSL2 with Fibe TV, and then the other side is only get 6/0.8k ADSL.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to kovy

said by kovy:

I'm pretty sure the equipement at the CO needs to be changed in order to handle 175/175mbps profiles and probably more into the future.

Shouldn't need to. It's the same equipment headend equipment regardless of whether the subscriber is receiving VDSL2 or FTTH (I think it's a 7450?). What changes is the subscriber modules, be it a 7330 or a 7340. But, seeing as how fibre isn't limited by distance, they could put the 7340s right into the CO and run the fibre out from there rather than putting them in a box at the side of the road like they do for DSL.

kovy

join:2009-03-26
kudos:8

said by Gone:

said by kovy:

I'm pretty sure the equipement at the CO needs to be changed in order to handle 175/175mbps profiles and probably more into the future.

Shouldn't need to. It's the same equipment headend equipment regardless of whether the subscriber is receiving VDSL2 or FTTH (I think it's a 7450?). What changes is the subscriber modules, be it a 7330 or a 7340. But, seeing as how fibre isn't limited by distance, they could put the 7340s right into the CO and run the fibre out from there rather than putting them in a box at the side of the road like they do for DSL.

It's a 7750 for FTTH.

Well right now all the FTTH is at the CO except for the fiber splitter.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

Right, the 7450 is the Ethernet switch and the 7750 is the router. You'd still use those even with just 7330s for copper deployments.

But yeah, if distance isn't an issue you can locate all of the subscriber-end fibre equipment in the CO and then just split it once it gets into the neighbourhoods. But, as I was alluding to, you could bring that equipment out of the CO if you wanted to, but I suppose upon reflection you wouldn't really need to.


urbang33k

join:2010-02-13
Canada
kudos:1
reply to kovy

Something makes me think, that some ftth in my neck of the woods is on a 7342 OLTS in the co - on my next fiber job I will confirm it. Which is also what the 7330's feed back to.

I wonder if, the CO side being the same, they could theoretically unplug the fiber at the 7330 and plug in a GPON splitter if they wanted to convert to ftth?
--
Opinions and ideas expressed in my post are my own and in no way represent those of Bell Canada Enterprises, Bell Canada, Bell TV, Bell Internet, Bell Mobility, Bell Technical Solutions, Expertech, or any other partners under the BCE umbrella.



Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4

said by urbang33k:

I wonder if, the CO side being the same, they could theoretically unplug the fiber at the 7330 and plug in a GPON splitter if they wanted to convert to ftth?

That's what I was trying to get at. The back-end infrastructure is already there and there's also neighbourhood side infrastructure already in place that can be converted from copper to fibre. It's just a matter of laying the physical cabling.

I have to wonder how it works in a place like Fort Erie that has no Bell FTTN infrastructure at all but has areas that are wired up for FTTH once houses are built.