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Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI

Nightfall to Metatron2008

MVM

to Metatron2008

Re: Simcity preview

said by Metatron2008:

said by Nightfall:

said by Metatron2008:

Most of the current drm examples are not that bad. In fact, Origin and Steam are highly convenient. You download games, and then you load them, far easier then inserting countless cds and such.

We aren't talking decent drm however, we are talking stuff like this always on crap, that treats everyone like a criminal, and gives no compelling reason to buy.

You mean stuff like MMOs where you have no single player options unless you pay the monthly fee? You want to talk about a situation where you have to buy a full game but you can't enjoy it in offline mode, it would be the MMO.

We are talking a single player city simulator, having no offline mode, and you think a MMO is on topic? I'm done speaking to your obtuse ass.

Hey, I get where you are coming from. I just don't think the solution is to run around with your hair on fire and claim you know what is coming when you don't. You don't have a crystal ball. You don't know what the future holds. Yet, you seem to claim you do. Yet you want to throw around insults to try to prove your point, and it doesn't work.

Let me know when you choose to not throw insults around. That really is the childish way to have a discussion.

Metatron2008
You're it
Premium Member
join:2008-09-02
united state

Metatron2008

Premium Member

Neither is asking loaded questions, comparing things that are completely irrelevant to the discussion (Such as a multiplayer only game to a single player only game), and all of your other 'talking points'.

If this is your idea of a debate then you must've dropped out of high school.

If two people have a discussion about say the weather, and you start talking about how your back itches, thats not a discussion or an argument, it's a bunch of random thoughts coming from all directions.

If you want to even PRETEND to be part of this grown up discussion, you need to stay on topic at least one second of your life.
Metatron2008

Metatron2008

Premium Member

And just so you know, what ifs (Simcity could be patched, etc), are also not a real discussion platform.

What if I won a million dollars tomorrow?

What if I died tomorrow?

What if a black hole killed us tomorrow?

On a conversion that has a solid foundation (Such as a game that has always on drm), making what if comments, and then treating these what if comments in such a way they nobody should even discuss the issue because EA might fix them at some time in the future, is about as childlike as believing in santa claus or the easter bunny.

Lets say you were discussing financials with somebody. They wanted specifics, and you say 'I could win a million dollars tommorow, so there's no need to discuss'. Is this what you would call a real discussion?

Jobbie
Keep It Simple
Premium Member
join:2010-08-24
Mexico

Jobbie

Premium Member

SO SANTA IS NOT REAL?????

WTF DUDE!!

Metatron2008
You're it
Premium Member
join:2008-09-02
united state

Metatron2008

Premium Member

Sorry, should've put that in spoilers

ekster
Hi there
Premium Member
join:2010-07-16
Sainte-Anne-De-Bellevue, QC

ekster to Jobbie

Premium Member

to Jobbie
It's okay Jobbie, he has no idea what he is saying.

Just go make an awesome sandwich and forget about today!

Jobbie
Keep It Simple
Premium Member
join:2010-08-24
Mexico

Jobbie

Premium Member

What is the purpose of life without santa.
Jobbie

Jobbie

Premium Member

Back on topic I think EA with Simcity and Blizzard with Diablo have received some serious PR backlashes on the always online crap, people is talking about boycotting the next EA game and I bet that it will happen to the next Diablo expansion.

We have to stop buying on hype and actually research/test our stuff before voting with our wallet.

Ghastlyone
Premium Member
join:2009-01-07
Nashville, TN

Ghastlyone to Jobbie

Premium Member

to Jobbie
said by Jobbie:

SO SANTA IS NOT REAL?????

WTF DUDE!!

Santa Clause exists dude. It's just that he moved his whole operation from the North Pole to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave instead.

Jobbie
Keep It Simple
Premium Member
join:2010-08-24
Mexico

Jobbie

Premium Member

said by Ghastlyone:

said by Jobbie:

SO SANTA IS NOT REAL?????

WTF DUDE!!

Santa Clause exists dude. It's just that he moved his whole operation from the North Pole to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave instead.

Ok... that makes it better... **goes back to normal breathing**

Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI

Nightfall to Metatron2008

MVM

to Metatron2008
said by Metatron2008:

Neither is asking loaded questions, comparing things that are completely irrelevant to the discussion (Such as a multiplayer only game to a single player only game), and all of your other 'talking points'.

If this is your idea of a debate then you must've dropped out of high school.

If two people have a discussion about say the weather, and you start talking about how your back itches, thats not a discussion or an argument, it's a bunch of random thoughts coming from all directions.

If you want to even PRETEND to be part of this grown up discussion, you need to stay on topic at least one second of your life.

The point is simply this....

If you don't like the way the game was built, then don't invest in it. This is why I didn't buy Simcity.

At the same time though, you are claiming that Simcity will get shutdown in 3-4 years, and basing your claims off of servers that have been shut down due to players not playing the game. Yet, these same games have single player capabilities.

You say I am way off base here, but when I ask you to point out a single game that EA has shut the servers off for and not had a single player only option, you have nothing.

I get your point. You hate to be online and playing the game as a requirement. I don't like it either. Just don't try to pawn off your "opinions" as facts, because they are far from it. You don't know what the future holds for this game.
said by Metatron2008:

And just so you know, what ifs (Simcity could be patched, etc), are also not a real discussion platform.

What if I won a million dollars tomorrow?

What if I died tomorrow?

What if a black hole killed us tomorrow?

On a conversion that has a solid foundation (Such as a game that has always on drm), making what if comments, and then treating these what if comments in such a way they nobody should even discuss the issue because EA might fix them at some time in the future, is about as childlike as believing in santa claus or the easter bunny.

Lets say you were discussing financials with somebody. They wanted specifics, and you say 'I could win a million dollars tommorow, so there's no need to discuss'. Is this what you would call a real discussion?

You are right, there is no real discussion here. You present your findings by pulling up data on games that are no longer played. I pull up my findings on what has really happened in the past. You choose to just look at your findings and say that what I point out is irrelevant. This is because EA isn't shutting the servers down on actual products that are being used today.

So I suppose I could do one of two things. Either stick my head up my ass like you have and say I know what the future holds, or just mention that you have your head in your ass. I choose to do the later.
Nightfall

Nightfall to Jobbie

MVM

to Jobbie
said by Jobbie:

Back on topic I think EA with Simcity and Blizzard with Diablo have received some serious PR backlashes on the always online crap, people is talking about boycotting the next EA game and I bet that it will happen to the next Diablo expansion.

We have to stop buying on hype and actually research/test our stuff before voting with our wallet.

This is what it all comes down to Jobbie.

This is why I didn't invest in Simcity. This is also why I regret investing in Diablo 3. We as consumers are going to have to be more informed when it comes to games like these and to not invest in them. We have to speak with our wallets. Its a shame it has gotten to this point, but just like when DRM had the capability to damage our computers, we had to look into the games that employed these dangerous DRM packages and not buy them. We have to be more informed consumers and not buy these kinds of games if they work in a way that we don't agree with.

ekster
Hi there
Premium Member
join:2010-07-16
Sainte-Anne-De-Bellevue, QC

ekster to Jobbie

Premium Member

to Jobbie
said by Jobbie:

We have to stop buying on hype and actually research/test our stuff before voting with our wallet.

Unless it's from CD Projekt Red or Runic. They can just take my bank account number and install a rootkit on my PC to just upload their games directly the second they are done!

Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI

Nightfall

MVM

said by ekster:

said by Jobbie:

We have to stop buying on hype and actually research/test our stuff before voting with our wallet.

Unless it's from CD Projekt Red or Runic. They can just take my bank account number and install a rootkit on my PC to just upload their games directly the second they are done!

I would also say most Valve games are in that category as well.
Zaltex
join:2006-07-03

Zaltex

Member

I might be a little mistaken, but what games does Valve actually make other then Half-Life series and Team Fortress? They're nothing more then a medium for most games out there...right?

Ghastlyone
Premium Member
join:2009-01-07
Nashville, TN

Ghastlyone

Premium Member

said by Zaltex:

I might be a little mistaken, but what games does Valve actually make other then Half-Life series and Team Fortress? They're nothing more then a medium for most games out there...right?

Portal, Left 4 Dead series are a couple others.

Adalicia
Om Nom Nom
join:2009-10-13
Lincoln, NE

Adalicia

Member

Technically both Portal and Left 4 Dead (and Team Fortress) started outside of Valve, were procured by Valve and redeveloped under their care.

DarkLogix
Texan and Proud
Premium Member
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX

DarkLogix

Premium Member

said by Adalicia:

Technically both Portal and Left 4 Dead (and Team Fortress) started outside of Valve, were procured by Valve and redeveloped under their care.

Hay now don't let little facts get in the way of Ghastlyone See Profile 's claims

Adalicia
Om Nom Nom
join:2009-10-13
Lincoln, NE

Adalicia

Member

No, not trying to ruffle any feathers, just pointing that out. That said, I put Valve on the same tier I put CDPR. They always put out a quality product with no anti consumer bullshit attached. Blizzard used to be a part of that list until their always Online Diablo III garbage.
90115534 (banned)
Someone is sabotaging me.Finding out who
join:2001-06-03
Kenner, LA

90115534 (banned) to Jobbie

Member

to Jobbie
said by Jobbie:

SO SANTA IS NOT REAL?????

WTF DUDE!!

Actually Santa is real.

Pollux7777
join:2010-02-16
Saint Paul, MN

2 recommendations

Pollux7777 to jester121

Member

to jester121
Not sure if this has been added yet (and not going to sift through 21 pages of thread to find out)

but apparently, this story keeps getting worse.

Taken from Fox News:

"
Electronic Arts has finally created something that has captivated the world with an intoxicating melange of drama, tragedy and sick humor. Too bad all of these elements emerge from EA’s project management, not the game itself.

The first stage of the SimCity fiasco stemmed from how EA’s servers spectacularly failed to cope with the entirely predictable launch week traffic. But the next stage is potentially even more damaging. On EA’s Answer HQ website, one of the most heated discussion threads is now about whether the entire pathfinding and traffic management systems of the game are badly broken.

Several players have noted that the characters in the game don’t actually have any permanent jobs or homes. They simply walk to the nearest available open job or a suitable home at certain times, a simplification that creates major headaches in city planning. Sims that start walking don’t switch to mass transit if they don’t find a job nearby; kids don’t get to schools easily; all cops go to a single crime scene even if police stations are carefully spread in different parts of the city.

School buses, fire trucks and tourist hordes all seem to have trouble finding obvious routes to their goals. As a result, designing a functional city may mean planning a street grid and placement of different facilities in a deeply counterintuitive way. Players have to design their cities to suit bad algorithms, not realistic goals.

One popular emerging strategy is to construct a city with one long, single street winding back and forth like a snake. This enables players to reduce the problems of having school buses that cannot find students and fire trucks that refuse to go where they are supposed to. One way to avoid suffocating traffic jams is to fill the city with wide avenues, resulting in weird maps where normal streets are used as sparsely as possible.

The lame pathfinding algorithms may explain one of the biggest mysteries surrounding this new SimCity iteration; why is the city size limited so drastically? Many early reviews cited claustrophobia as the number one complaint even before the server problems surfaced, including the exhaustive Ars Technica piece. It now seems likely that the strict size limitation may have been necessary to avoid complete gridlock.

The ambitious goal of having SimCity populated by “real people” may thus be backfiring quite spectacularly — partly because the Sims don’t act rationally, but also because of the complications of trying to find the shortest route to nearest job, home or school in the most rudimentary way. This can translate to inability to deal with a traffic jam by opting for a parallel street. It’s also backfiring because populating the cities with foolish agents with no memory or permanent roles has capped the city size to a level that deeply annoys most franchise fans.

The SimCity saga is evolving into a mesmerizing example of mismanaging a highly ambitious project in several ways. Forcing consumers to opt for an always-on Internet connection; underestimating server loads; insisting on the unnecessary and destructive goal of having “real people” populating the simulation; capping the size of the cities at a level that obviously alienates long-time fans; and deciding to go ahead with the game launch even with clearly inadequate pathfinding algorithms.

There is little doubt that many an MBA program will mine this episode for course material in coming years."
Expand your moderator at work

TigerLord

join:2002-06-09
Canada

2 recommendations

TigerLord to Pollux7777

to Pollux7777

Re: Simcity preview

said by Pollux7777:

Taken from Fox News:

Fox News are for losers, but any EA bashing is OK in my book.
90115534 (banned)
Someone is sabotaging me.Finding out who
join:2001-06-03
Kenner, LA

90115534 (banned)

Member

said by TigerLord:

said by Pollux7777:

Taken from Fox News:

Fox News are for losers, but any EA bashing is OK in my book.


jmn1207
Premium Member
join:2000-07-19
Sterling, VA

jmn1207 to Pollux7777

Premium Member

to Pollux7777
Thanks for this reference. This is the type of information that helps some of us to decide if this game is worth suffering through the draconian, always-online DRM. This strengthens my resolve, and I can't see myself purchasing this game, ever.
90115534 (banned)
Someone is sabotaging me.Finding out who
join:2001-06-03
Kenner, LA

90115534 (banned)

Member

said by jmn1207:

Thanks for this reference. This is the type of information that helps some of us to decide if this game is worth suffering through the draconian, always-online DRM. This strengthens my resolve, and I can't see myself purchasing this game, ever.

Yes but simcity 5 has already been a success because plenty of people preordered it.

Now to await the DLCs!

madmike
join:2012-03-19
Waterfall, PA

madmike to jester121

Member

to jester121
Not sure if its true or not but i read that EA paid people to write good reviews for simcity.
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO
·Google Fiber

me1212 to jester121

Member

to jester121
not sure if real, but found this last night.