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cypherstream
MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
·PenTeleData
ARRIS SB8200

1 edit

cypherstream to SpHeRe31459

MVM

to SpHeRe31459

Re: [X1] The New X2 - The "Evolution" of the X1

Another performance hog in the Tivo is the use of the Adobe Flash Lite for TV and integrated SoC's. (Early 2009 press release : »www.adobe.com/aboutadobe ··· com.html )

Its been criticized time and time again that some of the UI slowness in the Tivo Premiere's HD graphics has to do with Adobe Flash. Also I'm not sure if it ever was optimized for multi-core or multi-threaded SoC's.

Perhaps the X1 (and upcoming X2) are not flash or adobe air based? If so then comparing it to the performance a BCM7413 provides running the Tivo HD UI is not a direct comparison.

I still think that an SoC designed around ARM cores could of provided better performance. However the ties between Broadcom and MIPS and the long term development of that platform does not make it seem like this will change anytime soon.

What's interesting to note is that these STB's have around a 400 MHz dual core MIPS based CPU. But then the average smart phone you buy today for $100 - $200 on contract has more than twice that power, plus more efficiency with ARM. A cell phone like an iPhone 5 for example is a dual core clocked at 1.3 GHz paired with a PowerVR SGX543MP3 graphics processor. Yet it is designed to run in the palm of your hand on a small battery pack. There have been millions of iPhones sold, billions of smartphones in general.... sort of like billions of set top boxes. Something just doesn't add up there. I mean I know Broadcom creates some slow, low powered chips due to cost and mass productions... but again billions of smartphones worldwide is one hell of a mass production as well.

I have an iPad 2 which is considered old now by todays standards. It runs on a CPU based on an 800MHz power optimised dual core Cortex A9. It reaches 4000 Dhrystone MIPS while sipping 500mW and occupying 4.6 mm2 die size. In comparison, a single core 1GHz Cortex A8 processor - used in the iPhone A4 - in comparison consumes 590mW, reaches 2000 Dhrystone MIPS, with an area with L1 cache of less than 4mm2.

There you have it. A device that fits in the palm of your hand, iPhone 4 which is FREE at Best Buy with 2 year contract - is TWICE as fast as some of these poorly performing set top boxes.

Interesting read on the rise of mobile processors (which I think STB's should use for efficiency, processing and power): »www.pcpro.co.uk/features ··· ocessors

mikedz4
join:2003-04-14
Weirton, WV

mikedz4

Member

I did see somewhere on the comcast.net user forums they mentioned that comcast wants to have a "cloud dvr" available nationwide by the end of 2013.
SpHeRe31459
Premium Member
join:2002-10-09
Sacramento, CA

4 edits

1 recommendation

SpHeRe31459 to cypherstream

Premium Member

to cypherstream
said by cypherstream:

Perhaps the X1 (and upcoming X2) are not flash or adobe air based? If so then comparing it to the performance a BCM7413 provides running the Tivo HD UI is not a direct comparison.

The X1 is not Flash based. I don't think anyone is making that mistake again. What Comcast says is that it is HTML5 based, which is pretty vague, but we know it isn't Flash based
said by cypherstream:

I still think that an SoC designed around ARM cores could of provided better performance. However the ties between Broadcom and MIPS and the long term development of that platform does not make it seem like this will change anytime soon.

Yep ARM should absolutely be the next generation platform for sure. However, as I've found, nearly all the cable boxes around use a MIPS architecture. So to make a huge change like that would be to break all legacy compatibility.

Perhaps in a few product cycles after the initial X1 guide roll out, when the guide codebase isn't so closely tied to the platform its running on, we'll see set-top box vendors move on to other CPU architectures.

The other issue is that Broadcom makes a perfect SoC for digital video boxes (IPTV, Cable, Satellite, media streaming), because it has every input and output possible for a set-top box integrated into it and dedicated decoding blocks for MPEG2 and MPEG4-AVC.

Looks like Marvell might be the "go-to" vendor for an ARM SoC for a cable/satellite set-top box.
If you look at the guts of the Vizio Co-Star GoogleTV unit it uses a Marvell Armada 1500 1.2Ghz dual-core ARM CPU which is ready to be used in an number of set-top box configurations including a cable box. The Armada has a graphics unit in it that is certainly better than the Broadcom solutions, since it is made to run Andriod. And it integrates some level of Marvell's excellent QDEO video scaling/processing.

Just need the software to be liberated from being so closely tied to the metal. That was the whole goal behind Tru2Way. Which for Comcast is the X1 Guide.

cypherstream
MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
·PenTeleData
ARRIS SB8200

cypherstream

MVM

The BCM7445 is quad core ARM based, exactly what were looking for. 21,000 DMIPS and can decode 4K UHDTV.

»www.broadcom.com/product ··· /BCM7445

The writing is on the wall. ARM is the way to go and eventually there should be a migration to it in the embedded SoC space.
SpHeRe31459
Premium Member
join:2002-10-09
Sacramento, CA

SpHeRe31459

Premium Member

said by cypherstream:

The BCM7445 is quad core ARM based, exactly what were looking for. 21,000 DMIPS and can decode 4K UHDTV.

»www.broadcom.com/product ··· /BCM7445

The writing is on the wall. ARM is the way to go and eventually there should be a migration to it in the embedded SoC space.

Mmm that's some good stuff right there! I'd like to see that powering a 6-tuner whole home DVR.

ARM is certainly the most viable low power, yet powerful, architecture currently (and for the foreseeable future).