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Firefoxer

join:2007-09-27
Quebec, QC
reply to Davesnothere

Re: Start payments

While your at it for the bmo travel prepaid;
There is a free BMO account that can do the Interac Online. Its either called Club Sobeys or IGA BMO (for Quebec) chequing accounts depending on where you are.
Basically no fees besides the teller fees (you can do any deposit for free) and stuff like non-sufficient funds bounces.

»www.bmosobeys.com/en/home.aspx
its not a referral, I've tried to shorten it:
»www.bmo.com/home/promo/sobeys/qu···=6117052



Davesnothere
No-BHELL-ity DOES have its Advantages
Premium
join:2009-06-15
START Today!
kudos:7

2 edits

said by Firefoxer:

While your at it for the bmo travel prepaid;
There is a free BMO account that can do the Interac Online....

 
Interesting - sounds like the Loblaws arrangement with CIBC.

The OP did not state at which bank they bank, but START's Interac support includes BMO and the OP seems to bank elsewhere than at one of the 'Big 4'.

Or possibly START only does PAPs at the Big 4, but accepts Interac Online from more sources - not sure.

I have START set up for a PAP from a credit card, but pay them in advance each month from various sources, including the BMO card which I mentioned, as well as from Interac Online from either of 2 banks.

The suggestion for START (and other IISPs) to add PayPal sounds like a good one - just one more flexibility which the incumbents would not have.

I know of several VoIP providers who accept PayPal (CallCentric, Anveo, VOIP.MS, Skype, etc), and I generally use it for the ones to which I currently subscribe.
Expand your moderator at work


TypeS

join:2012-12-17
London, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
reply to Davesnothere

Re: Start payments

said by Davesnothere:

The OP did not state at which bank they bank, but START's Interac support includes BMO and the OP seems to bank elsewhere than at one of the 'Big 4'.

Not to nitpick here but technically it's the Big 5 Canadian banks , not sure why they wouldn't accept from CIBC.

Not sure about why they don't let you print off invoices and take them to any bank/credit union. My hunch is that TD, RBC, BMO and Scotia gave them a decent break on the transfer fees that they can offer the debit, and no one else did. It seems seemless to the customer, go to the bank, pay the bill, but the company your paying the bill too pays the transfer fees (banks do nothing for free). Not trying to excuse Start here, they're probably just playing a balancing game of costs and price increases, some things ma.ke the cut, others don't.


rocca
Start.ca
Premium
join:2008-11-16
London, ON
kudos:23

We support pre-authorized payments from any bank or credit union in Canada.

The initial payment page supports Interac online debit for real-time payment and the 4 banks are the only ones supported - I don't know why CIBC isn't part of the program, but that's something between Interac and CIBC and we're a little too small to influence them to settle whatever their spat is about.

Our policy is to require automatic payments for residential accounts and it means that I can have people helping customers with support instead of having to have them chase customers down every month for $40. We tried the "bill and hope people pay" method for years and our collections efforts, bad debt and losses were through the roof.

I understand that automatic payments aren't for everyone and that some people have reasons for not doing it, but unfortunately we aren't able to support those customers at this time.

There is more details from a previous thread on this at »Re: Start Communications - new TPIA Rogers/Cogeco ... I seem to recall a much longer one too but can't seem to find it currently as DSLR really doesn't give the ability to search adhoc forums very well (or I'm doing it wrong)


MichelR

join:2011-07-03
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..
·voip.ms
·Rogers Hi-Speed
reply to geokilla

said by geokilla:

Exactly what my parents and I do, though we don't pay it as soon as we get the bill. We check our receipts with the transactions first.

Oh man, I do that on a daily basis - I like that better than going through the bill at the end of the month (well, middle of the month). I even check my electricity consumption daily.
--
Start Communications Forum
Expand your moderator at work


Last Parade

join:2002-10-07
Port Colborne, ON
reply to WiMax

Re: Start payments

So just pay with a credit card. They've been taking the same amount out for a year now.



df909

@bell.ca
reply to WiMax

said by WiMax:

The other option is to go get a prepaid credit card but the fees are HUGE and you can't load with the amount I want.

Sorry but prepaid credit cards won't let you sign-up for recurring services like a cellphone plan or internet. Some businesses (car rentals & hotels) just outright reject them altogether.


agtle

@teksavvy.com

said by df909 :

said by WiMax:

The other option is to go get a prepaid credit card but the fees are HUGE and you can't load with the amount I want.

Sorry but prepaid credit cards won't let you sign-up for recurring services like a cellphone plan or internet. Some businesses (car rentals & hotels) just outright reject them altogether.

Not true at all - did you read earlier in the thread? »Re: Start payments

The BMO card that Davesnothere See Profile talks about is specifically marketed for travel and I can testify that it allows recurring charges, hotels, car rentals, etc. Never had any problem at all.


rednekcowboy

join:2012-03-21
kudos:1
reply to WiMax

I still don't get people who don't do this through automatic debit. Whatever they take out of your bank, they would also charge to your credit card and you would still have to pay it. Makes no difference where it's charged.....


BrianON

join:2011-09-30
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable

said by rednekcowboy:

I still don't get people who don't do this through automatic debit. Whatever they take out of your bank, they would also charge to your credit card and you would still have to pay it. Makes no difference where it's charged.....

A no-fee credit card on which the balance is paid off each month in effect gives you a float up to the credit limit so you don't have to keep account balances to cover all transactions and any problems like double billing or unexpected charges. Just pay off the CC before the due date with money transferred from a high interest savings account for example. For larger bills use online banking where you initiate the payment. This makes it easy to manage account balances.

A basic setup would be a no-fee credit card, a checking account where a balance over x$ means no fees with a set number of transactions and a savings account that at least pays some interest. An current example would be:

- Scotiabank No-fee value Visa, balance paid off each month
- Scotiabank Basic Banking Plan checking account, $2000+ balance is no fees for up to 25 debit transactions
- Scotiabank Scotia Power savings account, earns 1.2% if balance is over $5000

The $2000 checking balance seems high but saves $8.95/month in fees for around an equivalent of 5% yearly return on investment. Each $100 of balance kept in the savings account vs the checking account earns $1.20/year.


rednekcowboy

join:2012-03-21
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Acanac

Yes, but you can also get bank accounts that don't carry fees (my wife and I have a scotia account with such a setup) and the interest that you have to pay on a credit card that doesn't get paid off every month is substantial. Many people cannot handle credit cards at all and wind up getting themselves in more trouble more often than not.

You can also add that everyone who has a credit card also have a bank account which nullifies your argument about keeping an eye on balances. A credit card and a bank account doubles your effort because you have to watch both whereas a bank account, you just need to make sure that you have enough money to cover the expenses. I don't know how start operates, but I get an invoice from Ebox via email like 10 days prior to them taking any money.


LanAdmin

join:2010-11-07
Montreal, QC
reply to WiMax

Just get a credit card.
It's free, easy and you are protected in case of fraud.


Sukunai
Premium
join:2008-05-07
kudos:1
Reviews:
·ELECTRONICBOX
reply to WiMax

Progress what's it good for?

Well for every positive, I can list a landslide of negatives.

I have a credit card, I don't like them. They are like Steam, they work, but stop pretending you will ever make me LIKE the services.

I am with Peterboro, I prefer to go to a bank, IN PERSON, and have them stamp the bill PAID, because in that way, I am not stuck printing out THEIR paperwork myself. Sending me an email, it doesn't really thrill me.

And nothing resolves a dispute about having paid for something like a major bank's stamp on a bill saying YES I did indeed pay you.

I am paying for my current internet via my credit card, and I don't like it. But I consider it an evil I can live with.

Telling me about all the wonderful things a credit card service will do to protect me, yeah right. I see too many stories on the news about yet again someone has screwed up and spewed valuable personal details all over the web. And the credit cards are not going to always be your pal.

I'd much rather my ISP add 1 dollar to my bill, send my a paper bill so I can pay it at the bank. Teksavvy does this, so it is not impossible. Granted, they find ways to get my bill lost enroute more than a couple of times. But over all, I had no beef with the process. I wish my current provider was as capable.

But they are not and I decided I wanted that provider, and I decided I had to suck it up and use the credit card. It comes down to, how badly do you want that ISP eh.



Last Parade

join:2002-10-07
Port Colborne, ON

said by Sukunai:

Progress what's it good for?

Well for every positive, I can list a landslide of negatives.

I have a credit card, I don't like them. They are like Steam, they work, but stop pretending you will ever make me LIKE the services.

I am with Peterboro, I prefer to go to a bank, IN PERSON, and have them stamp the bill PAID, because in that way, I am not stuck printing out THEIR paperwork myself. Sending me an email, it doesn't really thrill me.

And nothing resolves a dispute about having paid for something like a major bank's stamp on a bill saying YES I did indeed pay you.

I am paying for my current internet via my credit card, and I don't like it. But I consider it an evil I can live with.

Telling me about all the wonderful things a credit card service will do to protect me, yeah right. I see too many stories on the news about yet again someone has screwed up and spewed valuable personal details all over the web. And the credit cards are not going to always be your pal.

I'd much rather my ISP add 1 dollar to my bill, send my a paper bill so I can pay it at the bank. Teksavvy does this, so it is not impossible. Granted, they find ways to get my bill lost enroute more than a couple of times. But over all, I had no beef with the process. I wish my current provider was as capable.

But they are not and I decided I wanted that provider, and I decided I had to suck it up and use the credit card. It comes down to, how badly do you want that ISP eh.

You sound impossible to deal with as a customer


df909

@bell.ca
reply to agtle

said by agtle :

The BMO card that Davesnothere See Profile talks about is specifically marketed for travel and I can testify that it allows recurring charges, hotels, car rentals, etc. Never had any problem at all.

I'm not sure why it would work seeing they (BMO) explicitly say it won't.

»www.bmo.com/pdf/BMO_Prepaid_Trav···t_EN.pdf

Section 3, Page 2 of the agreement for this card states the following:

"You must not use your card to make pre-authorized recurring payments."

Then if you keep reading into Section 4, it details how you shouldn't use this card in places like hotels and car rentals, etc.

Sukunai
Premium
join:2008-05-07
kudos:1
Reviews:
·ELECTRONICBOX
reply to Last Parade

said by Last Parade:

said by Sukunai:

Progress what's it good for?

Well for every positive, I can list a landslide of negatives.

I have a credit card, I don't like them. They are like Steam, they work, but stop pretending you will ever make me LIKE the services.

I am with Peterboro, I prefer to go to a bank, IN PERSON, and have them stamp the bill PAID, because in that way, I am not stuck printing out THEIR paperwork myself. Sending me an email, it doesn't really thrill me.

And nothing resolves a dispute about having paid for something like a major bank's stamp on a bill saying YES I did indeed pay you.

I am paying for my current internet via my credit card, and I don't like it. But I consider it an evil I can live with.

Telling me about all the wonderful things a credit card service will do to protect me, yeah right. I see too many stories on the news about yet again someone has screwed up and spewed valuable personal details all over the web. And the credit cards are not going to always be your pal.

I'd much rather my ISP add 1 dollar to my bill, send my a paper bill so I can pay it at the bank. Teksavvy does this, so it is not impossible. Granted, they find ways to get my bill lost enroute more than a couple of times. But over all, I had no beef with the process. I wish my current provider was as capable.

But they are not and I decided I wanted that provider, and I decided I had to suck it up and use the credit card. It comes down to, how badly do you want that ISP eh.

You sound impossible to deal with as a customer

Nope, merely 50 and not overly in love with the digital world as if it is always better. It isn't (always that is).

Firefoxer

join:2007-09-27
Quebec, QC
reply to rocca

You should rename "Debit card" under "Payment method" to "Interac Online" same goes with "Debit card payment" when you choose that option.
»www.start.ca/services/payment
Otherwise It creates confusion and frustrations to potential customers.

Oh and I understand why no IISP's wants to have paypal, its very seller unfriendly and has been abused by scammers too many times.



WiMax

join:2003-07-12
Canada
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable
reply to rocca

said by rocca:

We support pre-authorized payments from any bank or credit union in Canada.

The initial payment page supports Interac online debit for real-time payment and the 4 banks are the only ones supporte...

Thanks for the reply, Rocca. I appreciate you answering MY question directly unlike the 90% of the useless comments in this thread. People don't seem to know how to READ questions, comprehend and answer them accordingly.

I was able to "wake up" an old bank account that was dormant from one of the four acceptable financial institutions and submitted the order today.

My issue is about "entry logistics", not PAP itself. I have no issue with PAP. Fact remains that I don't have a credit card and although your staff told me on the phone (two different times in past month) that you accept debit, in fact, you only accept debit from four different major institutions. I deal with the credit unions of Ontario which you do not accept.

What is totally confusing is that you won't take a debit payment from a credit union but you will accept PAP from them?

This was very much a difficult and time consuming excercise for me and I almost cancelled the entire thing because of the time it was taking to do something that should not be that difficult in the 21st Century and with computer banking.

Might I suggest that as an option for those of us that deal with CASH, allow the agent to open a new customer account, give them a cus# and then they can go to their online bank and do a "bill payment". I could have done that last week in 2 minutes. The alternative would be PayPal. This method is not the same as an Interac payment and it would also save your company the Interac transaction fee.

That brings up one last question. If you do not pay transaction fees to receive "bill payment" via electronic banking, can Start offer me a monthly discount equivalent to the credit/debit transaction fees it would save? I always ask for cash discounts because prices are inflated to cover these fees. Customers that pay cash should receive a cash discount because it saves the vendor that fee that would then be pure profit for the vendor.

Thanks again for your time AND for being here to answer questions. That is a level of customer service unheard of in the rest of the business. The day the incumbents offer this level of service or come anywhere CLOSE will be a very COLD day at the equator

Phorkster
Premium
join:2004-06-27
Windsor, ON
kudos:1

Errr initially I was paying through my online bill payments, not sure why you couldn't? I switched to PAP because Start has earned my trust and respect.



TLS2000
Crazy Canuck
Premium
join:2004-02-24
Mississauga, ON
reply to WiMax

Is the debit thing Start's problem, or is it your financial institutions problem? As far as I know only the big banks offer Interac Online payments. I could be wrong though.
--
Tom



rocca
Start.ca
Premium
join:2008-11-16
London, ON
kudos:23
reply to WiMax

said by WiMax:

Might I suggest that as an option for those of us that deal with CASH, allow the agent to open a new customer account, give them a cus# and then they can go to their online bank and do a "bill payment".

The only problem with that is it takes 2-3 days for that money to be received, and believe it or not, most of the banks and credit unions still use FAX to send these payments so it has to be reconciled, etc, and can't be built into an automated process. Our system isn't perfect and I realize there is some portion of people that deal with cash but we work with what we have.

We have lots of people that call, signup, say they'll make an online payment through their bank and it never comes, several unanswered calls to the customer later and we close things off.

said by WiMax:

That brings up one last question. If you do not pay transaction fees to receive "bill payment" via electronic banking, can Start offer me a monthly discount equivalent to the credit/debit transaction fees it would save? I always ask for cash discounts because prices are inflated to cover these fees. Customers that pay cash should receive a cash discount because it saves the vendor that fee that would then be pure profit for the vendor.

Unfortunately all transactions have fees these days, they get us one way or another. Really though, even cash has an expense because it is considerably more manual.


rocca
Start.ca
Premium
join:2008-11-16
London, ON
kudos:23
reply to TLS2000

said by TLS2000:

Is the debit thing Start's problem, or is it your financial institutions problem? As far as I know only the big banks offer Interac Online payments. I could be wrong though.

It's between Interac and the banks, who's to blame between them I'm not sure. AFAIK, Interac is the only processor that allows debit card payments at all. We added it maybe a year ago to help enable a way for a larger percentage of people to get setup in real-time that didn't have credit cards.


TLS2000
Crazy Canuck
Premium
join:2004-02-24
Mississauga, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed

That's the point I'm trying to make though. The OP shouldn't be upset that Start isn't offering options when it's the banks that restrict it. It's great that Start is even offering that option when most places don't bother.
--
Tom


Guru

join:2008-10-01
kudos:2
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to rocca

said by rocca:

Unfortunately all transactions have fees these days, they get us one way or another. Really though, even cash has an expense because it is considerably more manual.

+1 Well explained. That's what people don't understand.


nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON
reply to peterboro

said by peterboro:

said by elitefx:

Pay everything by cash, always have done.

I go to the bank every month with my paper bill and pay cash.

If a company won't send me a bill I can pay at the bank I give my business to someone else even if they cost more.

I think I saw you at my local BMO last week with I think a Bell telephone bill and some cash.

For me its a convenience factor...I am not a huge fan of pre-authorized payments, but I'd never be able to get to a bank before it closes.

I'll live with it though. Some people don't, and that's the indirect price Start and others pay for not having those options available. Which again its completely up to them.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

If a Bell bill ever touches my skin again shoot me.

With usage based billing on the internet or cell or any other thing I have never paid a cent more than I've used.

If they balk I cancel and move to another provider.



nitzguy
Premium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON

said by peterboro:

If a Bell bill ever touches my skin again shoot me.

With usage based billing on the internet or cell or any other thing I have never paid a cent more than I've used.

If they balk I cancel and move to another provider.

LOL, maybe it was the hydro bill? ...Can't escape the hydro company...unless you put up your own solar panels...or have a large enough waterfall to power your house in your backyard amongst the cars...or....enough land to put up some wind turbines to really tick the neighbours off

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON

said by nitzguy:

Can't escape the hydro company...or have a large enough waterfall to power your house in your backyard amongst the cars...

The 15 cars are supposedly in the front yard and if they have diesel engines I'll hook generators to them and power the whole neighbourhood.