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Rifleman
Premium
join:2004-02-09
p1a

1 edit

Tax Heads Up for Child Support Payers

I did my tax tonight and found a deduction for child support paid? Line 230 on the T1 form. I thought I owed 300 or so and this deduction got me a refund of 1300. It drops your taxable income by your paid amount.
I thought CS payments were not deductable?
If valid you can send in a form to adjust earlier returns.
Can anyone verify this deduction?
It's weird if this pans out and I get some extra back for earlier years because I just looked at a nice 95 Winnebago Class A for a steal. I was racking my mind trying to figure out how to scrape enough up to buy it.
»www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/tpcs···eng.html


Rifleman
Premium
join:2004-02-09
p1a
Scratch that-----sorry-----looks like it's just spousal support.


ekster
Hi there
Premium
join:2010-07-16
Lachine, QC
kudos:3
It's for both child and spousal support. But the court order or written agreement must be registered with the CRA for it to be accepted.


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
reply to Rifleman
deducting child support from your taxable income changed in the late 90s...if your support agreement was untouched from that time, it is still valid...if it was ever changed at any point after the changes, you can no longer declare it as a deduction...i still think the change was stupid as it should be deductible from your income.


J E F F
Whatta Ya Think About Dat?
Premium
join:2004-04-01
Kitchener, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Rogers Portable ..

1 edit
said by dirtyjeffer:

.i still think the change was stupid as it should be deductible from your income.

Agreed. This is especially true when you have (well, you don't "HAVE" to, but you know what I'm getting at) to buy your kids clothing anyway because their mother and step-dad are idiots when it comes to money.

I hate when she tells the kids to come to me to buy them clothing...it's not, and shouldn't be, my job. That's why I pay support. I provide the food when they are with me (about 39.9% of the time, gotta keep it under 40% at per support rules) as well a roof, but I shouldn't have to buy clothing as well. I paid $90 for a decent pair of winter boots for my daughter (mom said she'd pay back, never did) and now my daughter tells me that mom is wearing the boot that I bought her. Good grief!
--
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. - Albert Einstein


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
said by J E F F:

it's not, and shouldn't be, my job. That's why I pay support.

Um, are you that dense?

It's a shared responsibility. Support is to ensure that your children receive the same quality of life despite the separation. As a father who actually gives two shits about your kids, you should be just as much one to purchase them gifts and clothing as the one who receives support does. It's not just her responsibility. After all, you aren't the one paying to feed and clothe and heat the house and all that wonderful stuff except during the times when you're a weekend father.

I really don't get you guys. Really. It's attitudes like these that cause men to have to fight tooth and nail to get any sort of custody of their kids, as you obviously hate your ex-wives more than you love your kids. You aren't the only one here. You guys also clearly don't have a clue of what this kind of attitude and mentality is doing to your kids, either. Ever been told by your father that you don't get a birthday gift because he pays your mom support and he doesn't owe you as his child anything else? Yeah. Don't be surprised if they might want nothing to do with you as an adult.


J E F F
Whatta Ya Think About Dat?
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join:2004-04-01
Kitchener, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Rogers Portable ..
I buy gifts, I shouldn't buy 100% of the clothing. And child support goes for "clothing, food and 'a roof'" It doesn't go for "gifts".

As I said, I have them more than "the weekend", it closer to 40% which is the cutoff.

I take serious issue, though, when I buy clothing for the kids, and the mom ends up wearing it, or if it's my son, she gives it to her other son. I'm not there to cloth her or her other kids.

I don't hate her. I just don't like my kids coming to my house every time with destroyed clothing that is 2 sizes too small.

And where did I say that I shouldn't buy the kids gift? Sorry that that happened to you. My kids mom doesn't buy them any gifts at all and tells them "it's my job". I'm okay with that.

It's very likely in the near future that they both will be more than 60% of the time, which changes everything, I'm not expecting the mom to buy them any clothing, as that's what child support is for.
--
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. - Albert Einstein

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
Premium
join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
said by J E F F:

I buy gifts, I shouldn't buy 100% of the clothing. And child support goes for "clothing, food and 'a roof'" It doesn't go for "gifts".

Why don't you worry about doing what's right for your kids and less about what you are legally obligated to do.

If your ex is a piece of shit and won't get them the clothing they deserve you should still step up and do so.

The gesture will come back in spades later on when they get older and you won't end up like DJ.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to J E F F
If you are concerned about their care, you should be the one trying to obtain primary custody. If you're proceeding down this road, you seem to care enough in that regard.

Peterboro is right, though. This isn't about the money, it's about what's right. My dad was king of this kind of shit that you mentioned earlier. Because of that (among *many* other things) we didn't talk for close to 15 years. We are only just starting to again now. Lots of time lost over petty bullshit we can never get back. Even though you may not be overt and obvious about this kind of stuff to your kids, they'll figure it out on their own. Your children aren't kids forever, but the resentments can last a lifetime.


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON

1 recommendation

reply to peterboro
said by peterboro:

The gesture will come back in spades later on when they get older and you won't end up like DJ.

what do you mean "end up like me"?

my point about the tax issue is we don't get to claim ANY deductions for the child, the mother does (this of course assumes the mother has custody, which is often the case)...if the mother gets all the deductions for having the child, the father should at least get the deduction for support payments.
--
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

- George Orwell


Bender2000
Bite My Shiny Metal Ass
Premium
join:2002-05-06
Dollard-Des-Ormeaux, QC

1 recommendation

reply to Gone
the rules are getting better but they are still not up to speed on real life situations. If you are sharing custody 50/50 exactly, you and your ex can alternate years in which you claim your child as a dependant.

However, if you are required to pay any support, then you are not allowed to claim your child as a dependant, even if your ex does not claim it.

As far as I am concerned, that's not right. Both parents are ensuring the child's needs are met, but only one parent is allowed to get some relief of tax burden. That's what I find is total BS.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
said by Bender2000:

As far as I am concerned, that's not right. Both parents are ensuring the child's needs are met, but only one parent is allowed to get some relief of tax burden. That's what I find is total BS.

I completely agree. The tax benefit should be available to both relative to the amount of time each parent has custody.

The reason why you used to be able to write-off support payments is because the parent who received them paid the tax on it. Now the person who pays support also pays the taxes on that income.

peterboro
Avatars are for posers
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join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

said by peterboro:

The gesture will come back in spades later on when they get older and you won't end up like DJ.

what do you mean "end up like me"?

Your memory is failing you. Remember this thread.

»Child Support Payments - neverending


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
yes, i remember...this thread is about taxes relating to support payments so i'm not sure why that was relevant...unless of course you just love to dig stuff up to throw in people's faces...be thankful you never had to endure it.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
The resentments you built with your child are relevant in the context of someone who may be going down the road of doing the same with theirs do to their perception of everything support related being unfair.

peterboro
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join:2006-11-03
Peterborough, ON
I was going to point out that the sentiments of the father in this case and the DJ case were germane but you beat me to it.


dirtyjeffer
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Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON
reply to Gone
i don't have resentment for my son...i don't have any relationship with him (other than as an ATM for most of his life)...she left shortly after he was born and moved away, close enough to keep things "legit" but far enough to make it challenging to maintain any regular contact, especially considering the financial circumstances i was left with...i don't have any "ill" feelings towards him at all...he didn't ask to be in this situation.
--
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

- George Orwell


Gone
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join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to peterboro
Sometimes the truth hurts. When jeffer is in his 60s and 70s counting down his days remaining on this earth, he'll come to the realization that having a son who wants nothing to do with him and wants no part of carrying on his father's legacy after he's gone simply wasn't worth any of the anger he had for his ex.

I truly hope he comes to that realization sooner, because even the mere thought of this happening to me should the relationship I am in now fall apart scares the living bejesus out of me. I suppose he must feel even a shred of something similar. If he doesn't, I would have no choice but to question the very core of his humanity.


Gone
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Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

i don't have resentment for my son

said by dirtyjeffer:

(other than as an ATM for most of his life)

*sigh*


dirtyjeffer
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i'm not sure what the "sigh" is for...i didn't have a relationship...and as i mentioned before, i'm not even sure if i am the biological father, as i found out after she left she had been cheating on me as well.


Rifleman
Premium
join:2004-02-09
p1a
reply to Rifleman
Sorry I started this but I agree fully with the dads on this issue. Support is based on before tax income.
My son only sees the money.
I just got into a scrap with the ex over this. I politely asked when the kid was done his college course this year. I thought he was taking the electrical apprentice course but it turns out it was a prep course called electrical fundamentals. Regardless the course ends in August.
I asked if she would call or write the FRO and stop payments in August. She expects me to pay for 2 more years while he goes to Ottawa for the apprenticeship course. I'm done at the end of his first post secondary diploma. I'll have to go to court.
Another big issue going on ATM is a car.
He wrote off the Focus ST a few months ago. I don't think it was his fault but don't get the straight story. He got 7 grand from insurance and the ex took half to pay the loan off I guess.
So I get a message from the kid "Dad I need help--I only have 3 grand to buy a car and don't know what to do" I told him he'd have to save a few grand more and I'd start looking down here for a rust free car. I don't have the money or the credit to do anything more.
So the Ex's father had a rusty beaten old Kia Sportage that the ex talked him into buying. The FIL assured him if anything was needed to safety it, the FIL would pay for it. So the kid plunks down 2 grand and drives it home. I found out that night about it and warned him to go get his money back but was ignored. He takes it to a garage who stopped looking after a page of defects and rust. I get another message he needs help. I feel like complete shit when I have to say I can't.
So the Ex--after a war with FIL gives lends him 2 grand and cosigns another loan for a 07 Saturn.
He's 20 years old. As far as I know he's 10 grand in debt for 1 year of school, has a racked CC at 7500 bucks and now the car loan and loan from mom.
I had ZERO input in any of this. The kid only cares that he gets the money.
The Ex doesn't care if I die on the streets. She has a good govt job and the guy she moved in with makes good money as well. If she can afford all this stuff------fine. But no way in hell am I going to keep paying after August.
The kid has a newer car than I have, top of the line everything and I scrape by on whats left of my disability.
I invested her pension money in a RIF and the monthly income pays the child support. Without her paying herself----I'd be in dire straits.
I love my son and there is nothing I'd like better than to buy him a car or something extra. He's in for a rude awakening when he's done school.


Steve
I know your IP address
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join:2001-03-10
Foothill Ranch, CA
kudos:5
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

i still think the change was stupid as it should be deductible from your income.

You couldn't deduct most ordinary living expenses of your kids when they were with you; why should being divorced change that?


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
join:2002-02-21
London, ON

1 recommendation

when you have a child, there are plenty of deductions you can claim on your taxes, as well as plenty of extra things you get (Child Tax credit, etc) depending on the age...the mother gets to claim all of these (again, assuming the mother has primary custody) as well as collect the monies associated with all the beneficial credits, while the support paying father gets none of it.


Rifleman
Premium
join:2004-02-09
p1a
reply to Steve
Because his disposable income dropped by the support amount. If he wants to visit or bring him over-----DJ has to pay for it. He has 0 input on what the money is spent on and gets 0 credit for it from the Ex. SHE paid for it----not the father. He probably gets no input on raising the child either.


Gone
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join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

and as i mentioned before, i'm not even sure if i am the biological father, as i found out after she left she had been cheating on me as well.

Welp, if this is the first thing that comes to your mind when someone mentions your son, perhaps it is best for him and everyone else involved that you aren't a part of his life, and - indeed, with the attitude demonstrated here - probably never will be, either.


dirtyjeffer
Anons on ignore, but not due to fear.
Premium
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London, ON
as i said before, rather than criticize me, be thankful you haven't had to go through it yourself.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to Rifleman
said by Rifleman:

He probably gets no input on raising the child either.

And, as I said earlier, if it was *that* big of a concern to anyone here they would be doing everything they could to ensure that they have an impact on their child's life rather than seeing them every other weekend and bitching about the support payments the rest of the time.

Sorry, no sympathy from me for any of you, and I say this as someone who is not naive and who is very well aware of the statistics when it comes to relationship failures later in life and may (god forbid) have to deal with a support order at some point, too.

My son is the apple of my eye and the best thing to ever happen to me. His happiness and well-being is worth far more to me than any of this petty bullshit.


Gone
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Fort Erie, ON
kudos:4
reply to dirtyjeffer
said by dirtyjeffer:

as i said before, rather than criticize me, be thankful you haven't had to go through it yourself.

Even if I do, I won't be like you.

For all my father's faults and all the stupid things he did, at lease he never even once questioned whether I was actually his son.


J E F F
Whatta Ya Think About Dat?
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Kitchener, ON
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Reviews:
·Rogers Portable ..
reply to peterboro
said by peterboro:

said by J E F F:

I buy gifts, I shouldn't buy 100% of the clothing. And child support goes for "clothing, food and 'a roof'" It doesn't go for "gifts".

Why don't you worry about doing what's right for your kids and less about what you are legally obligated to do.

If your ex is a piece of shit and won't get them the clothing they deserve you should still step up and do so.

That's what I do. I buy my kids clothing for school, boots for winter, coats and jackets for the season. I can get pissed off if this clothing is worn by my kids mother or giving to other kids in the house or neighbourhood, and I can also remind people that child support is for clothing, among other things, for my kids, not other things.
--
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. - Albert Einstein


Rifleman
Premium
join:2004-02-09
p1a
reply to Gone
If you have a son----be thankful you aren't in this position. If your feelings for your son are that strong----picture yourself divorced and 100s of miles away.
I've gone from raising him 24/7 to being ignored all of the time unless he needs cash. Helpless, Depressed, hurt, anger and now complacence are a few of the emotions involved.
Don't think the ex will ever say anything positive or encourage a relationship.
Anyways---I'm out. Sorry I started this topic.