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clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink

1994 Toyota Corolla stalling out, help...

I have (new to me) a 94 Corolla LE 1.8 7AFE that has been running perfectly.

No miss, no rough idle, nothing. I was out driving it around and all the sudden is started to sputter and ended up dieing in the middle of an intersection. We got it pushed into a parking lot and I find that one of the plug wires had essentially fallen apart new the plug.

Ran to the parts store and got a new set of plug wires. Installed them on the road. It started fine, but continued to sputter. At an idle in Park it would idle run then miss and then die out....

I finally got it home. Removed the cap/rotor, they look good. Remove the plugs, cleaned up the one that was fouled from the dead spark plug wire and gapped all the plugs to 0.032.

Now it idles in park just fine, but starts cold ok. But when you put it into drive, it will start to miss(sputter) and die. If you try to give it gas it acts like it's starving for air/gas and will just up and die on you completely.

I reset the computer (removed the ground from the battery) and besides it idling a tad high now (1k RPMS) this didn't help either. (How do you reset the idle?)

I cleaned the TPS and throttle body of carbon .. This seemed to help for a bit, the car ran great in park/drive. I took it for a 2 mile drive to the mini mart and put some gas in it. It started hard .. and went back to missing/hesitating/dieing when you give it gas (or when its idling...)

Help! I am not complete familiar with this car and could use some experienced help.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??



Gordo74
Premium
join:2003-10-28
Monroeville, PA

I would guess coil pack (where the wires plugin on the opposite end of the spark plug).



shdesigns
Powered By Infinite Improbabilty Drive
Premium
join:2000-12-01
Stone Mountain, GA
reply to clevere1

It could be the mass airflow sensor. I had a Toyota of a similar vintage that has the same problem.



Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
there
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL

said by shdesigns:

It could be the mass airflow sensor. I had a Toyota of a similar vintage that has the same problem.

His Corolla uses a MAP sensor.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.


Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
there
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Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to clevere1

As Gordo mentions, checking the coil for evidence of burn marks is a worthwhile task.

Do you have any DTCs?

Note that a visual inspection of cap/rotor isn't always conclusive. Can you rule out a rotor that is burned through to the distributor shaft?

Also, if you have a compression gauge, why not do a compression test. It would be free...

What wires did you put on?
I have seen very few aftermarket ignition parts that work well on this car. Most of these cars are EOL before the wires are replaced.

If you start the engine with the hood open, can you hear the snapping of leaking ignition wires? Lightly mist the engine while running in a dark-ish area and look/listen for the sound of HV spark leakage.

That said, why not just throw 4 new plugs in? This application uses conventional plugs, those are probably going to cost about 4$ each at the max.

I am currently commuting 100 miles/day on a 1996 Corolla 1.6. I'd love to have a 1.8...
--
The talented hawk speaks French.


rody_44
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join:2004-02-20
Quakertown, PA
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 edit
reply to clevere1

Take a compression reading on that cylinder. How long did you leave the plug out? Are you sure you didnt break the wire when removing it? The car shouldnt completely shut down because of one cylinder. Run like shit yes shut down no. Any chance its fuel related? I dont think the car has a serviceable fuel filter.



cdru
Go Colts
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join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7
reply to clevere1

said by clevere1:

I finally got it home. Removed the cap/rotor, they look good. Remove the plugs, cleaned up the one that was fouled from the dead spark plug wire and gapped all the plugs to 0.032.

How old are the plugs? And are they the correct type for the vehicle?

I had a 1500 Sierra pick up truck that I replaced the cylinder heads due to coolant leaks I also replaced the spark plugs. On a budget and not wanting to spend $8 a plug, I got Denso Platinum TT plugs...name brand, well reviewed, couldn't hurt. Truck performed exactly as you described it. Idle or very slight acceleration was fine. Try to give it gas and it would just sputter and hiccup. Bit the bullet and put in the OEM iridium plugs and had zero problems after.

Not saying that is your problem. But just tossing it out there.


clevere1
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join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to Gordo74

said by Gordo74:

I would guess coil pack (where the wires plugin on the opposite end of the spark plug).

All the cylinders are firing... Not sure how to test the coil pack.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??


clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to Cho Baka

said by Cho Baka:

said by shdesigns:

It could be the mass airflow sensor. I had a Toyota of a similar vintage that has the same problem.

His Corolla uses a MAP sensor.
[/BQUOTE

I swapped out the MAP sensor (and even cleaned the old and the new one), no change.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??


clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to Cho Baka

said by Cho Baka:

As Gordo mentions, checking the coil for evidence of burn marks is a worthwhile task.

Do you have any DTCs?

Note that a visual inspection of cap/rotor isn't always conclusive. Can you rule out a rotor that is burned through to the distributor shaft?

Also, if you have a compression gauge, why not do a compression test. It would be free...

What wires did you put on?
I have seen very few aftermarket ignition parts that work well on this car. Most of these cars are EOL before the wires are replaced.

If you start the engine with the hood open, can you hear the snapping of leaking ignition wires? Lightly mist the engine while running in a dark-ish area and look/listen for the sound of HV spark leakage.

That said, why not just throw 4 new plugs in? This application uses conventional plugs, those are probably going to cost about 4$ each at the max.

I am currently commuting 100 miles/day on a 1996 Corolla 1.6. I'd love to have a 1.8...

DTC?

No check engine light.

I'll check that out as soon as my stomach flu goes away..
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??


clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to rody_44

said by rody_44:

Take a compression reading on that cylinder. How long did you leave the plug out? Are you sure you didnt break the wire when removing it? The car shouldnt completely shut down because of one cylinder. Run like shit yes shut down no. Any chance its fuel related? I dont think the car has a serviceable fuel filter.

I was gently pulling on the wires to find the source of the miss when a gentle tug resulted in a plug wire coming out of the head. The plastic insulation was literally falls apart.

How long did I leave the plug out? Just long enough to clean and gap it.

Folks have mentioned fuel filter. It is replaceable (a pain in the ass, but replaceable), I will be looking at replacing it at the end of the week.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??


clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to cdru

said by cdru:

said by clevere1:

I finally got it home. Removed the cap/rotor, they look good. Remove the plugs, cleaned up the one that was fouled from the dead spark plug wire and gapped all the plugs to 0.032.

How old are the plugs? And are they the correct type for the vehicle?

I had a 1500 Sierra pick up truck that I replaced the cylinder heads due to coolant leaks I also replaced the spark plugs. On a budget and not wanting to spend $8 a plug, I got Denso Platinum TT plugs...name brand, well reviewed, couldn't hurt. Truck performed exactly as you described it. Idle or very slight acceleration was fine. Try to give it gas and it would just sputter and hiccup. Bit the bullet and put in the OEM iridium plugs and had zero problems after.

Not saying that is your problem. But just tossing it out there.

I'm not sure how old the plugs are ... They looked in good condition.

Isn't there a way to test plugs themselves?
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??


cdru
Go Colts
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join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7
reply to clevere1

said by clevere1:

DTC?

No check engine light.

Diagnostic Trouble Code. Not all DTC will illuminate the MIL (check engine light). Some are just stored for future reference, others require two or more "events" before the MIL is tripped.

Your car is old enough however that it may have limited trouble shooting ability. OBD-II wasn't required until 1996 IIRC.


cdru
Go Colts
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Fort Wayne, IN
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reply to clevere1

said by clevere1:

I'm not sure how old the plugs are ... They looked in good condition.

Isn't there a way to test plugs themselves?

You can pull them out and hold them next to a grounded piece of metal. They should spark when you turn the engine over. Even then though it doesn't confirm that it isn't the plugs. In my case, all the plugs were operational, they just weren't a good plug for the application for whatever reason.


aurgathor

join:2002-12-01
Lynnwood, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
reply to clevere1

If the symptoms are really bad and started suddenly, that could be the sign of a coil going south. A more gradual and less severe problem may be indicative a cap/rotor issue, even if they look OK.
--
Wacky Races 2012!



Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
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reply to rody_44

said by rody_44:

I dont think the car has a serviceable fuel filter.

His vehicle has a servicable fuel filter. It is near the brake booster.

The OP's description doesn't seem to match a fuel issue.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.


Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
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reply to clevere1

Coils are NOT common on that vehicle, crap aftermarket ignition components are.

I recommend testing them as I previously described before digging deeper.

Unless you like throwing money at it.

BTW, I have never heard of anyone cleaning a MAP sensor before. They should never need cleaning. I hope it wasn't damaged by the cleaning.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.



clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
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Reviews:
·CenturyLink

said by Cho Baka:

Coils are NOT common on that vehicle, crap aftermarket ignition components are.

I recommend testing them as I previously described before digging deeper.

Unless you like throwing money at it.

BTW, I have never heard of anyone cleaning a MAP sensor before. They should never need cleaning. I hope it wasn't damaged by the cleaning.

I've cleaned a few map sensors in my time. I have a spare just in case

I'll post an update as soon as my stomach issues goes away, might be a day or two. I'll see if I can't dig up the specs for the coil pack and test it as well. I put cheap (If you call 37.00 wires cheap) wires into it to get it home. (It didn't help, stalled most of the way).
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??

rody_44
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Quakertown, PA
reply to Cho Baka

Im guessing fuel related because my son had a geo prism which is also the toyota driveline and had that exact symptom. Turned out to be a bad fuel pump. His did trip a code tho but it was emission related codes.



Cho Baka
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-23
there
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reply to clevere1

If you have a chance, post a youtube video of it acting up.

That will go a ways toward allowing us a sense of how it is behaving.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.



clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to clevere1

Ok, I had a chance to look at the car tonight.

I took a second look at the cap and rotor, they look ok. I am unsure how to test the coil pack ... so I didn't.

I did the spray bottle on the wires trick = No spark leaking that I can hear. No zap-zap-zap.

I then took a cheap-o spark tester (you ground it to the battery, then put the other end on the plug wire). All seem to be firing normally (Dunno how strong).

It was dunno quite well, then it just up and died. I can hear the fuel pump clicking on - I have a fuel pressure tester, I need to find it and check fuel pressure?

Youtube videos to follow soon.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??



clevere1
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join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
reply to clevere1

Here's the youtube video.

»youtu.be/j1STpUbquGo


Sorry about all the clicking .. my phone was hitting the steering wheel.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??

rody_44
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Quakertown, PA
Reviews:
·Comcast

2 edits

I dont have speakers at this time so i cant here it but it would probably help if you let someone know. Was the spark at the plug yellow or blue. If its got a blue tint your probably ok if its yellow maybe maybe no. When you say the fuel pump is clicking on. Do you mean you here it running or you just here it clicking. Still think a compression test and fuel pressure test will tell you the next step. Every time you cycle the ignition the fuel pump should run, not just click. Even if you here it run tho as it must be at least running some doesnt mean its pumping enough.



clevere1
Premium
join:2002-01-06
Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink

Not sure what you mean by let someone know?

I'll check tonight on the spark color. All my helpers were sleeping when I looked at the car.

I don't actually hear the pump humming... I've had some cars where you could hear it and where you couldn't. It sounds like a relay is clicking on, I am not sure I will check again.

Fuel pressure test is next. Regretfully, I don't have a compression tester.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??



Gordo74
Premium
join:2003-10-28
Monroeville, PA
reply to clevere1

Does this paragraph sound familiar? It sure does with me...

»www.ebay.com/motors/carsandtruck···-Modules



clevere1
Premium
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Vancouver, WA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink

said by Gordo74:

Does this paragraph sound familiar? It sure does with me...

»www.ebay.com/motors/carsandtruck···-Modules

Point taken. This coil is built into the distributor I think. I'll look tonight and see if I can't test the coil with my VOM.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??


Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
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reply to Gordo74

That paragraph is a load of inaccurate rubbish.

It states that a 1994 Corolla has coil on plug. It doesn't.
It caters to the inexperienced that want to try and fix a problem by shotgunning parts at the car.
--
The talented hawk speaks French.



Cho Baka
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join:2000-11-23
there
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reply to clevere1

Thanks for the video. What surprised me is how abruptly it stalled. I was hoping for better sound though (Hearing will help me to judge if it is an ign miss).

Do you know any service history on the vehicle? Leaking front windscreen? Flood damage? Aftermarket Igniter or other parts?

Have you checked for DTCs yet? Just look at the sticker on the hood for checking ignition timing. These are the same 2 terminals you jump to check DTCs on this year Corolla. Observe the MIL to count the flashes.

If you check the coil (resistance, etc), look for burn marks or evidence of pitting, much as you would with the distributor rotor. (look in the inside of the rotor, where it fits over the distributor shaft)

Yes, check fuel pressure. If it is suspect, then I want you to check the voltage at the fuel pump.

Do note that once the engine speed drops below a certain threshold, the fuel pump will be shut off.

Also, check the wire harness at areas where it bends due to engine movement (back of engine near transaxle/firewall, upper rad hose where it goes to the o2 sensor, etc.). With the engine idling, push and pull on the harness to see if there is any effect. You may have to disengage a clip to get enough movement to matter. Watch your fingers on the belts/moving parts.

--
The talented hawk speaks French.



clevere1
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Vancouver, WA
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Reviews:
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This is my buddies car. It was put in my hands to repair the speedo. The odometer wasn't working. I got this resolved without a problem. It's had no window leaks, serviced .. well, service, I am not about about a regular basis. Most of the parts were OEM.

I got all the specs for checking sensors, fuel pressure, etc. I am going to try and do some of them tonight.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??



clevere1
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Vancouver, WA
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Reviews:
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1 edit
reply to clevere1

I got the coil tested, but the results are not conclusive yet...

Primary coil I get 1.8 - 1.7 ohms .. I'm not sure if it's my volt meter of not. The specs say 1.1-1.7ohms

I removed the coil from the car and put it on a bench .. now I get 1.9-1.8ohms. I'm going to take it to work with me and use a fancier VOM on it and see what I get.

Secondary coil is 11k ohms, which is within spec which is 9k - 15k ohms.
--
Where's th' DAFFY DUCK EXHIBIT??