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Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

3 edits

ATT Uverse DSL - Good Speed, poor performance help?

I have been a long time cable user but recently switched to ATT DSL saving $40 a month for virtually the same package but upgraded internet speeds.

I'm subscribed to 18mbs and multiple online speed tests show that I'm receiving approximately 12-17mbs and ping in the 40's which seems reasonable (not ideal).

The kicker is that the performance of programs like Skype, Youtube, online games are all quite poor. Youtube videos buffer for extended periods of time, while they work instantly on a cellular network. Skype call quality is poor and often causes the call to drop, and games have higher latencies/ping despite technically having a faster network.

I have a tech coming out this evening, what should I ask of him? For example, is there a benchmark "signal strength" I should be able to see? Skype/Youtube perform terribly even with nothing else on the network, I feel like I have zero bandwidth and poor signal strength despite speed tests showing reasonable speeds.

Last night the network quit all together, the supplied gateway may be bad (they've already replaced it once). The gateway they keep supplying is the 3801HGV. Should I ask for a specific modem as I have my own router? Does anyone have a suggested Modem/Gateway model number to request instead of ATT providing the same one again?

Any help greatly appreciated.


nephipower

join:2012-02-20
San Antonio, TX

The 3801 RG is the best one that they got now. It is a newer model than the previous humongous 3800 RG.

Install the UVrealtime app from www.uvrealtime.com. Post screenshots from the 1,2, and 4th tabs. It will help give us a lot of stats on your current VDSL connection.

Also which package are you signed up for exactly? I ask because there is no 20 mbit package. There is an 18 mbit one and a 24 mbit one.



Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

You are correct, I edited my post probably while you were typing. I'm subscribed to the 18mbit package.

I will install UVrealtime and provide the screenshots. However currently I have no service at all so that will have to wait until after the tech arrives.



Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4
reply to nephipower

Can anyone provide potential ideas as to what may cause poor performance despite reasonable speed tests?

This way I can hopefully direct the tech because otherwise he's going to walk in replace the RG to restablish service, and walk out.

But I don't believe the RG is what's causing the poor service, only the outtage.

Again, I will provide UVrealtime shots when service is restored.



David
I start new work on
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:101
reply to Snuffbox

youtube is a problem for multiple ISP's currently, it seems the only way to fix youtube is to block certain IP ranges.

front page news has info.
»Why Is Everyone Having YouTube Streaming Issues?



Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

Yeah, thanks. I've successfully done that with TimeWarner but it made no change with AT&T and other services being slow too I'm pretty sure it's caused by something in common.



David
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Granite City, IL
kudos:101
reply to Snuffbox

might check and see if the range changed for you. Typically if you pull up a video that is having problems and run wireshark it will tell you what IP you are getting the video from. Then just block that IP.



Snuffbox
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Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

I didn't use the same range. There's a guide somewhere on this forum for ATT users that I used.

Because there was no improvement, I believe whatever is causing skype/games/streaming to be slow is also affecting Youtube and it's a larger issue than blocking IPs.



Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4
reply to Snuffbox

Still no service, so I can't yet take UVrealtime screenshots.

Multiple techs, no fix... About to cancel the service that we're not receiving anyways.



David
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join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:101
reply to Snuffbox

can you send me an email (click on my name on the left) or send me an IM with the BAN and contact info?

Thanks
david



Snuffbox
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Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

Click for full size
Click for full size
Click for full size
Click for full size
Here are my UVRealtime SS's.


rolande
Certifiable
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join:2002-05-24
Dallas, TX
kudos:5
Reviews:
·ViaTalk
reply to Snuffbox

The YouTube issue is a peer saturation problem. YouTube uses content distribution platforms to distribute their load with the larger ISPs. The problem is they aren't doing satisfactory capacity management on those CDN uplinks. So, when they are busy, the performance sucks and it has nothing to do with your ISP. If you block the CDN ranges of IPs, then YouTube falls back to delivering the video directly or from an alternate source that is not contending with upstream saturation.

I am not aware of any commonality between Skype and games and YouTube. It is possible these services are all using a common CDN carrier. No way to know without more data. Hopefully David See Profile was able to step in and save the day.
--
Scott, CCIE #14618 Routing & Switching
»rolande.wordpress.com/



Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

1 edit

Understood - I have blocked the appriopriate ranges in my firewall for the youtube fix. I had also done it previously with TimeWarner cable and sucessfully fixed the slow performance by being redirected to their overflow servers. However with my current ISP the problem appears to be unrelated.

New RG arrived yesterday. I replaced it immediately fixing the Wifi issue and have experienced no disconnects so far. I only have about 2 hours of use with the new RG however so I'll continue watching.

To be clear, screen shots above are of the new RG.



freakout9903
Premium
join:2001-04-19
Gastonia, NC
Reviews:
·NetTalk
reply to Snuffbox

First off I would HIGHLY recommend you get wireless router to put behind the 3801 Gateway. I use a Linksys router with a Tomato-Toastman based firmware. This basically let's you bypass a lot of the traffic shaping the 3801 gateway attempts to do but fails severely in many ways.

1. For my VoIP/Skype/gaming I put the router into DMZplus mode which gives it the public IP, open up all traffic to the router/disable the 3801 firewall for the device, and then I go an extra step and go into the firewall settings of the 3801 gateway

and UNCHECK(to disable the 3801 from touching anything):
Stealth Mode
Block Ping
Strict UDP Session Control
Excessive Session Detection
TCP/UDP Port Scan
Invalid Source/Destination IP address
Packet Flood (SYN/UDP/ICMP/Other)
Invalid TCP Flag Attacks (NULL/XMAS/Other)
Invalid ICMP Detection
Miscellaneous

and CHECK(to allow all inbound):
HTTP
HTTPS
FTP
Telnet
SMTP
DNS
NetBIOS
POP3
IMAP
NNTP
IRC
H323
All Other Protocols

I know this is kind of not needed since I disabled the firewall for the gateway but it seems to speed things up a bit in my opinion since it's not actively looking for attacks or not allowing certain traffic through.

2. Then in my Tomato firmware I changed my dns servers and un-checked the option in the firmware for : "Use received DNS with user-entered DNS"

This let's you bypass the 3801's dns which is slow and unresponsive at times I have found. So this dramatically speeds up everything.

3. Specifically for Youtube I block these IP ranges from the post I made here: previous post

All this let's me have a smooth experience with U-verse, and I should mention I am on the 12mbit/1.5mbit internet tier. No tech is going to be able to recommend you do any of this, and it may not be for everyone if you have devices other than your STB's/Wireless Router connected directly to your 3801 gateway(as this would open up those devices to attacks). With that said everything except your STB's should be connected behind your router...not directly to your 3801 gateway if you go this route.
--
Join The Fight against Media Censorship www.blackthisout.com


Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

Thank you Freakout, I will give this a go.

I have an unused Netgear router that I'll put through and bypass the gateway's wifi.

I understand the implications of essentially removing the firewall. Machines connected directly to the gateway don't have any sensitive information so I'm not concerned.



rolande
Certifiable
Premium,Mod
join:2002-05-24
Dallas, TX
kudos:5
Reviews:
·ViaTalk
reply to freakout9903

Thanks freakout9903 See Profile. I've been meaning to get my own access points back online and fire up my Cisco 3725 as my internal gateway. Maybe I can get my IPv6 tunnel back online at the same time. Just haven't had the time to focus on any of that, since we moved in last September. I appreciate you posting your recommendations on what has worked for you.
--
Scott, CCIE #14618 Routing & Switching
»rolande.wordpress.com/



freakout9903
Premium
join:2001-04-19
Gastonia, NC
Reviews:
·NetTalk

said by rolande:

Thanks freakout9903 See Profile. I've been meaning to get my own access points back online and fire up my Cisco 3725 as my internal gateway. Maybe I can get my IPv6 tunnel back online at the same time. Just haven't had the time to focus on any of that, since we moved in last September. I appreciate you posting your recommendations on what has worked for you.

I have a tomato-toastman ipv6 tunnel config as well somewhere if you guys would like.


freakout9903
Premium
join:2001-04-19
Gastonia, NC
Reviews:
·NetTalk
reply to Snuffbox

said by Snuffbox:

Thank you Freakout, I will give this a go.

I have an unused Netgear router that I'll put through and bypass the gateway's wifi.

I understand the implications of essentially removing the firewall. Machines connected directly to the gateway don't have any sensitive information so I'm not concerned.

If you need any help getting it setup just PM me, and I do the same thing, kill the wifi on the gateway and use my own.


David
I start new work on
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join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:101
Reviews:
·DIRECTV
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reply to freakout9903

said by freakout9903:

First off I would HIGHLY recommend you get wireless router to put behind the 3801 Gateway. I use a Linksys router with a Tomato-Toastman based firmware. This basically let's you bypass a lot of the traffic shaping the 3801 gateway attempts to do but fails severely in many ways.

1. For my VoIP/Skype/gaming I put the router into DMZplus mode which gives it the public IP, open up all traffic to the router/disable the 3801 firewall for the device, and then I go an extra step and go into the firewall settings of the 3801 gateway

and UNCHECK(to disable the 3801 from touching anything):
Stealth Mode
Block Ping
Strict UDP Session Control
Excessive Session Detection
TCP/UDP Port Scan
Invalid Source/Destination IP address
Packet Flood (SYN/UDP/ICMP/Other)
Invalid TCP Flag Attacks (NULL/XMAS/Other)
Invalid ICMP Detection
Miscellaneous

and CHECK(to allow all inbound):
HTTP
HTTPS
FTP
Telnet
SMTP
DNS
NetBIOS
POP3
IMAP
NNTP
IRC
H323
All Other Protocols

I know this is kind of not needed since I disabled the firewall for the gateway but it seems to speed things up a bit in my opinion since it's not actively looking for attacks or not allowing certain traffic through.

2. Then in my Tomato firmware I changed my dns servers and un-checked the option in the firmware for : "Use received DNS with user-entered DNS"

This let's you bypass the 3801's dns which is slow and unresponsive at times I have found. So this dramatically speeds up everything.

3. Specifically for Youtube I block these IP ranges from the post I made here: previous post

All this let's me have a smooth experience with U-verse, and I should mention I am on the 12mbit/1.5mbit internet tier. No tech is going to be able to recommend you do any of this, and it may not be for everyone if you have devices other than your STB's/Wireless Router connected directly to your 3801 gateway(as this would open up those devices to attacks). With that said everything except your STB's should be connected behind your router...not directly to your 3801 gateway if you go this route.

I am kind of surprised more people don't set them up this way. This is how I set up the 2wire 2701HG-B at home with the DSL. Everything just passes right through.
--
If you have a topic in the direct forum please reply to it or a post of mine, I get a notification when you do this.
Koetting Ford, Granite City, illinois... YOU'RE FIRED!!


Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4
reply to Snuffbox

Click for full size
Click for full size
Click for full size
This is before any firewall changes have been done. Mostly default RG settings.

I will attach screen shots of after the firewall changes to check for any noticeable changes.


Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4

Is anyone able to decipher if any of that information is normal/abnormal?



Mangix

join:2012-02-16
united state
reply to freakout9903

said by freakout9903:

and UNCHECK(to disable the 3801 from touching anything):
Stealth Mode
Block Ping

Why?

Unchecking two options make you visible on the internet. And no your little linksys router will not solve that.

Keep in mind that even in DMZPlus mode, it's still the 2Wire which connects to the internet. It just shares that connection with your linksys.


David
I start new work on
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join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:101
Reviews:
·DIRECTV
·AT&T Midwest
·magicjack.com
·Google Voice
reply to Snuffbox

said by Snuffbox:

Is anyone able to decipher if any of that information is normal/abnormal?

Seems normal to me. Don't see any errors or not many at all.

nephipower

join:2012-02-20
San Antonio, TX

said by David:

said by Snuffbox:

Is anyone able to decipher if any of that information is normal/abnormal?

Seems normal to me. Don't see any errors or not many at all.

The screenshot of the errors page is misleading because there is only 42 minutes worth of data.

Snuffbox can you post an updated screenshot of the error page from UVRealtime that has at least 24 hours worth of day since the last time the RG was restarted. This will give us a much better idea if you are having a lot of errors over a period of time.


David
I start new work on
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:101
reply to Snuffbox

I was comparing the 3/15 and 3/19 images. Pretty much looked the same.



Snuffbox
nice irl
Premium
join:2011-04-15
Milwaukee, WI
kudos:4
reply to Snuffbox

Click for full size
Sorry, I double attached one of my pictures and missed this one. (This one was taken at the exact same time as all of the others.)

It had been going for almost 5 days in this screen shot.


freakout9903
Premium
join:2001-04-19
Gastonia, NC
Reviews:
·NetTalk
reply to Mangix

said by Mangix:

said by freakout9903:

and UNCHECK(to disable the 3801 from touching anything):
Stealth Mode
Block Ping

Why?

Unchecking two options make you visible on the internet. And no your little linksys router will not solve that.

Keep in mind that even in DMZPlus mode, it's still the 2Wire which connects to the internet. It just shares that connection with your linksys.

If you have used a third party firmware you would know its pretty much like having linux firewall between the gateway and the rest of your devices. I can be very specific with iptables, so yes essentially it opens me up to the Internet but unwanted traffic is still filtered out just by my tomato based router instead of the gateway. As long as all my devices are connected behind my dmz device and not directly to the gateway, nothing is "wide open" to the Internet .


Mangix

join:2012-02-16
united state
reply to Snuffbox

Wrong.

Go to »grc.com and run the ShieldsUp! scan. Without the Block Ping option, you are pingable through the internet. Without the Stealth mode option set, there were two ports that were listed as blocked instead of stealthed when that option is unchecked.

These options do not really impact the fact that you have a router behind the 2wire. They're just basic stuff that most if not all routers have enabled by default.



freakout9903
Premium
join:2001-04-19
Gastonia, NC
Reviews:
·NetTalk

These options do not really impact the fact that you have a router behind the 2wire. They're just basic stuff that most if not all routers have enabled by default.

Exactly....and your gateway is essentially a modem with a built in router/bridge, by disabling these features your basically turning the gateway into a modem and then putting a router behind it. Ping and ports and everything still gets blocked as it would if the gateway was the acting router, ill give you my public ip if you want to see. You won't get a response from any computer on my network I guarantee it.


Mangix

join:2012-02-16
united state

There seems to be a misunderstanding here. The 2Wire is a computer. When I ping your public IP address, I am pinging the 2Wire. There is currently no way to bridge the 2Wire.