| The roots of the problem So I finally got around to digging up the damaged section of my my sewer main where the roots were getting in. Looks like roots found a hole right in the middle-top of the tile, and grew in and pried it open, cracking it all the way around, and down the length of it.
A look at root invasion seen from the outside...
Now the obvious thing to do here is to remove the broken tile and extend the PVC from the washout T to the next clay tile, which appears to be flawless.
But I'm weighing different potential methods to actually do that, and leave the good tile as unstressed as possible, I certainly don't need to go starting a crack in that one that will run down it under the slab.
Options I'm considering are A) cut it with a carbide grid blade on a reciprocating saw, B) finish the job the roots started on the bad tile, breaking it up and then trying to caaarefully break the "bell" away from the good tile, and C) heating the bell with a torch or heat gun to soften the tar and work the damaged tile off the good one. Or possibly D) rent a snap cutter, though that risks introducing a crack into the tile that will run, or E) call the plumber and say "well, I did the grunt work for you (the digging), can you replace this tile for me?".
The heating idea seems particularly intriguing, since there would be no cutting or banging, it might be least stressful on the good tile of any method, but then again, the heat might cause it to crack due to thermal stress, like a piece of glass, before the tar gave way.
What do you guys think/suggest? |
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Zach 58Premium
join:2006-11-26
NW Minnesota | I use a diamond blade on my demo saw for clay flue liners and tile. It looks like the original installer laid the tile backwards; usually the bell end is on the upstream side.
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Zach |
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| House is to the left, flow is going right. So the bell is on the upstream side of the tile. |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | reply to Zach 58
I think the diamond blade is the best idea. Just looked and Lowes has an 8" one for a reciprocating saw for about $13. I'm going to pick one up just to have in my tool box. |
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| Cutting just upstream of the bell with a diamond blade is beginning to sound like a winner. I'll source one out tomorrow, and hopefully get this fixed very soon, since I now have a very big, deep hole in my backyard. haha |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | Dig it out deep enough that the blade is not in the soil. You don't want to take any chances on hitting something and the saw bouncing. That could be enough to break a tile. |
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| Yeh, I will dig it out more, I didn't just yet, because I didn't want to unbed the pipe just yet, since being cracked through, it might completely give way, then I would be out two bathrooms and one kitchen till this is finished. |
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 mattmagPremium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-04-09
NW Illinois
kudos:3 | reply to Raphion
A warm climate I presume?  |
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| said by mattmag:A warm climate I presume?
Obviously. No ice to dig through. =p |
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 jjoshuaPremium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ
kudos:3 | reply to Raphion
Get a rubber coupling, place it over the hole in the pipe, and secure it. |
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| said by jjoshua:Get a rubber coupling, place it over the hole in the pipe, and secure it.
I'd rather replace that whole section rather than try to patch it, because it's not simply a small hole there, but a crack that spirals around the pipe for about 2 feet. I'm not confident that it's structurally sound, and could soon collapse if I only patched over the hole. |
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 MsradellP.E.Premium
join:2008-12-25
Louisville, KY
 ·AT&T U-Verse
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said by Raphion:House is to the left, flow is going right. So the bell is on the upstream side of the tile.
Then you have a bigger problem because S__t doesn't flow uphill! |
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| said by Msradell:said by Raphion:House is to the left, flow is going right. So the bell is on the upstream side of the tile.
Then you have a bigger problem because S__t doesn't flow uphill! Must just be a trick of how you're seeing the picture, because it's definitely down-sloped. In the pic, it is running diagonally away from me, from the lower left, to the upper right. The high PVC you see is the washout, coming vertically to the surface. |
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jjoshuaPremium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ
kudos:3 | reply to Raphion
As long as the pipe is exposed and you're doing work, you might as well put a camera down the pipe to see if there are any other problems. |
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| said by jjoshua:As long as the pipe is exposed and you're doing work, you might as well put a camera down the pipe to see if there are any other problems.
I have looked down it as far as I can see, and don't see anything other than very light curtains of roots at some joins. The kind of thing that rootx should take care of. Water certainly flows like there's nothing in it's way. I don't own a camera that I could actually send down the pipe, I'd have to rent one or hire someone with one. The washout is full size though, so sending a camera down it should be no issue if it's needed in the future, so I don't think I'll worry about it right now. |
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| reply to Raphion
There's been a new development; I ended up trying a twist on the heat idea, but using no heat. I had a couple cans of carb cleaner, and on a whim decided to see what it did to tar, and whether scrap clay was damaged by it. The tar liquifies, the clay is unaffected.
So, with industrial grade solvent resistant gloves on, I got a chisel and a long thin metal implement, and started removing the tar, first where it was bulged out from the joint, and then stabbing into it between the bell and the next tile, and spraying a little carb cleaner in every little bit. The carb cleaner penetrated right down between the clay and the tar, and let me pull ALL of the tar right out of the joint. So now there's nothing holding it, I'll be fitting in the PVC as soon as this little rain lets up. |
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 HawkPremium
join:2003-08-25
La Quinta, CA | reply to Raphion
Perhaps installing a two way "Clean Out" in this area and bring it to grade might prove beneficial since you've gone this far. |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | That's what you see at the upper right of the hole in the photo. |
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HawkPremium
join:2003-08-25
La Quinta, CA | ahh, my bad. |
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| reply to Hawk
said by Hawk:Perhaps installing a "Clean Out" in this area and bring it to grade might prove beneficial since you've gone this far.
The cleanout is right there, but it's useless in fixing a broken pipe. It's just good for punching a 1 inch round hole through the root ball every 4 months. The pipe would probably completely collapse in a couple years anyways. It's literally broken into two sections that were only held together by the surrounding dirt and pipes on either end.
The grade is fine, idk how you guys are gauging the grade by looking at a picture of one tile and a clean-out T.... |
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