 jester121Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL | reply to kontos
Re: Replacement Window Costs hehe... that's just the most obvious of the skewed information in this thread. 
We have a contractor consulting saying you really should spend the extra money on the install for a complete tearout with nailing fin -- which stands to reason, since the contractor gets paid for the installation and doesn't care about anything else! While I agree that nailing fin is fine for an addition or if they're already tearing off siding to replace it, there's really no other benefit. No, your windows will not be "glued" in place  -- they get screwed on the left and right side, and have aluminum capping wrapped around the outside to make it blend in with the wall (varies for brick or stone exterior). That capping gets caulked to the window frame for a good weatherproof seal -- exactly the same caulking as you'd need with nailing fin. |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | reply to TA63
said by TA63:I wouldn't dream of leaving the old frames in.
That really depends on the type of old window and how the installation was done. I have a couple of 50's era houses which I will need to do the windows on at some point. These were quality wood windows for the time and they were installed correctly. This means that they are properly flashed from under the siding to over the top of the outside trim. It would be not only extremely expensive to remove the old frames to totally replace but would also be very destructive to the structure requiring much siding work as well as an entire repainting of the exterior, not to mention the destruction to the interior and a similar total repainting of the interior. The trim in the house is now only available custom made and basically it would be a nightmare both inside and out. |
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| reply to jester121
said by jester121:No, your windows will not be "glued" in place -- they get screwed on the left and right side, and have aluminum capping wrapped around the outside to make it blend in with the wall (varies for brick or stone exterior). That capping gets caulked to the window frame for a good weatherproof seal -- exactly the same caulking as you'd need with nailing fin. Good to know; I've been wondering about this and your explanation has helped me, thanks. |
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 FreedomBuildWell done is better than well saidPremium
join:2004-10-08
Rockford, IL
 ·Comcast
| reply to pende_tim
Not Egress compliant window size |
"Dear fellow Realtors, sadly your seller client converted a three bedroom home into a one bedroom home by failing to honor egress code with these replacement windows."
Just thought I would share this tidbit of information
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»www.rockfordremodeling.biz
»www.rockfordremodeling.biz/blog/ |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | I would wager that the homeowner replaced old windows with same size and style. |
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FreedomBuildWell done is better than well saidPremium
join:2004-10-08
Rockford, IL Reviews:
·Comcast
| Getting a replacement window to fit inside an existing framed opening does not equal the same size as original, however there are some manufacturers that don't have thick jambs (They are built with thin frame profiles to allow maximum window and glass size) These weren't. The Realtor took a close overall shot to illustrate. I know this realtor and her family
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»www.rockfordremodeling.biz
»www.rockfordremodeling.biz/blog/ |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | You are missing my point. The old windows did not have to meet code as being egress. Once replaced, they had to be brought up to code even if that means modifications to the structure. It is not enough to replace old windows with new of the same style and size. The new ones must meet code on egress. |
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Beezel
join:2008-12-15
Las Vegas, NV | I can't tell if it has tilt in removable sashes. If so then it wouldn't matter on the size I wouldn't think. Since you can remove the sashes to get the full opening. Plus that looks like a standard size window. A normal person should be able to go through it. But the picture isn't clear enough to show actual size. |
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | From what I have read, tilt in sashes don't count for egress according to code. |
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 35245635
join:2013-03-04
North Reading, MA
3 edits | reply to pende_tim
It doesn't have to be that big to meet code.
"An egress window must satisfy all four International Residential Code (IRC) criteria:
Minimum width of opening: 20 in.
Minimum height of opening: 24 in.
Minimum net clear opening: 5.7 sq. ft. (5.0 sq. ft. for ground floor).
Maximum sill height above floor: 44 in."
From the picture posted it sure looks like it passed the IRC code. A large coffee cup is what 6" high? It clearly meets the height and net opening requirements. It might be very very close on the width but we're talking maybe 19" instead of 20" but again that's impossible to see from the picture. It appears to be around 22" wide IMHO. The window height above the floor is the only thing in question and that wouldn't have changed.
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robbinPremium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1 | I don't think it opens high enough. It appears to be a double hung window and is fully open in the pics. If you look at the top of it you see that it has hit the stops as there is no more track above it. |
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FreedomBuildWell done is better than well saidPremium
join:2004-10-08
Rockford, IL Reviews:
·Comcast
| reply to 35245635
Here is an illustration on my website for this
»www.rockfordremodeling.biz/basic···-window/
The window doesn't pass in the other picture I posted
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»www.rockfordremodeling.biz
»www.rockfordremodeling.biz/blog/ |
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35245635
join:2013-03-04
North Reading, MA | That's the exact same info I posted. It doesn't help at all. Why doesn't the window pass? Width? Height? Space to floor? Just saying it 'doesn't pass' doesn't help anyone.
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FreedomBuildWell done is better than well saidPremium
join:2004-10-08
Rockford, IL Reviews:
·Comcast
| said by 35245635:That's the exact same info I posted. It doesn't help at all. Why doesn't the window pass? Width? Height? Space to floor? Just saying it 'doesn't pass' doesn't help anyone.
Robbin got part of it, Doesn't open near far enough. Width isn't right either. The openable area does not equal 5.7 sq ft. min.
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»www.rockfordremodeling.biz
»www.rockfordremodeling.biz/blog/ |
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35245635
join:2013-03-04
North Reading, MA | reply to pende_tim
The other thing to note is most of the time the CITY is the master record for the property size. If there is an issue with the property you need to have the CITY update their records. You can't simply change stuff on your own whether it's right or wrong. To get a 3 bedroom house turned into a 1 bedroom for example you'd typically need to call the CITY and report the house to them. They would come inspect the house and make the determination.
Just thought I would share this tidbit of information.
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 MsradellP.E.Premium
join:2008-12-25
Louisville, KY
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| reply to kontos
said by kontos:said by Msradell: The windows I ended up with your cellular PVC, so they can be painted to match other services. They have a 20 year guarantee! Unless you want to go extremely low budget, I would stay away from vinyl windows. he overall size of the window.
Umm, do you know what the 'V' in PVC stands for? I certainly do, however, the cellular PVC is a very different material than the material used in "vinyl" windows. It's more like wood and how it's handled. It can be machined, drilled, painted, etc. just like wood. Its expansion and contraction rate is also different than "vinyl" window material which is extruded. |
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 marigoldsGainfully employed, finallyPremium,MVM
join:2002-05-13
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:2 | reply to 35245635
said by 35245635:The other thing to note is most of the time the CITY is the master record for the property size. If there is an issue with the property you need to have the CITY update their records. You can't simply change stuff on your own whether it's right or wrong. To get a 3 bedroom house turned into a 1 bedroom for example you'd typically need to call the CITY and report the house to them. They would come inspect the house and make the determination.
Just thought I would share this tidbit of information.
Why would a city keep track of such information? The county might keep track of number of bedrooms for assessment purposes (and total rooms matters more than number of bedrooms). In some states the city might do the same for assessment, but normally the city has no such records at all.
(I deal with local government assessment records on a daily basis.)
In our area, this is actually a pretty simple change. You just return your annual assessment card with a change in the number of bedrooms. Most of the time no inspection is required to make the change; they just check when they make the triennial in-person inspection.
Of course, Massachusetts could be totally different, since all of my experience is with midwest states. The original colony states do tend to be odd compared to everyone else on these types of matters.
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35245635
join:2013-03-04
North Reading, MA
2 edits | said by marigolds:said by 35245635:The other thing to note is most of the time the CITY is the master record for the property size. If there is an issue with the property you need to have the CITY update their records. You can't simply change stuff on your own whether it's right or wrong. To get a 3 bedroom house turned into a 1 bedroom for example you'd typically need to call the CITY and report the house to them. They would come inspect the house and make the determination.
Just thought I would share this tidbit of information.
Why would a city keep track of such information? The county might keep track of number of bedrooms for assessment purposes (and total rooms matters more than number of bedrooms). In some states the city might do the same for assessment, but normally the city has no such records at all. (I deal with local government assessment records on a daily basis.) In our area, this is actually a pretty simple change. You just return your annual assessment card with a change in the number of bedrooms. Most of the time no inspection is required to make the change; they just check when they make the triennial in-person inspection. Of course, Massachusetts could be totally different, since all of my experience is with midwest states. The original colony states do tend to be odd compared to everyone else on these types of matters. I own 5 properties in 5 different states. Every single one of them the CITY is the end all be all with the property. It goes as far as the appraisers. I had an appraisal just last year where they refused to count 196 sq. ft. in one of the properties because the CITY didn't show it in the GLA. They said if I called the CITY and got it added to the GLA they'd count it as GLA and increase the value. A few years before that it happened on another property in a different state.
A CITY would have to be nuts to allow home owners to control the CITIES revenue by allowing them control the master records of the property! Not to mention taking the home owners word could mean ILLEGAL space could be added or removed just take the window example in this thread for that. Without the CITY controlling that info they don't know if the work was done correctly with a permit, meets code, or is even considered GLA. The home owners have no idea about that stuff nor do they care.
I could see the COUNTY controlling that info in some places. It really doesn't matter for the discussion if the CITY, COUNTY, or STATE, or FEDS control it just the fact that a ruling body controls it and you have to have them involved to alter it.
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marigoldsGainfully employed, finallyPremium,MVM
join:2002-05-13
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:2 | said by 35245635:A CITY would have to be nuts to allow home owners to control the CITIES revenue by allowing them control the master records of the property! Not to mention taking the home owners word could mean ILLEGAL space could be added or removed just take the window example in this thread for that. Without the CITY controlling that info they don't know if the work was done correctly with a permit, meets code, or is even considered GLA. The home owners have no idea about that stuff nor do they care. Sure the homeowner could to that.... if they want to go to jail for an illegal tax declaration when the triennial inspection is done.
As I mentioned, here all that matters is the number of rooms, regardless of room type.
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35245635
join:2013-03-04
North Reading, MA
1 edit | said by marigolds:Sure the homeowner could to that.... if they want to go to jail for an illegal tax declaration when the triennial inspection is done. Hardly. They have no idea what's legal or illegal so you can't hold them responsible for doing what they 'feel' is right. If you give them that option you can't then turn around and slap them for not knowing stuff. You either trust them or you don't. I've never seen or heard of any place that conveys trust to a home owner though. Can you link the city/county you speak about? I'd love to read about it.
said by marigolds:As I mentioned, here all that matters is the number of rooms, regardless of room type. Room type matters for a number of reasons. Fire department cares for smoke/co detectors. Health department cares for septic and sewer reasons. Assessor's care for property value reasons. Total number of rooms matters but so does the use of those rooms. If you do this stuff daily you already know that though.
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