| reply to Guspaz
Re: CRTC 2013-80 Optional Upstream Speeds, DSL Modem Cert said by Guspaz:There is nothing in the filing that CNOC could disagree with. They even make some good points about why cable modem certification shouldn't be required for cable either Not every VDSL2 modem has 100% interoperability with every other VDSL2 remote and the same goes with modems.
Bell has no reason to object to people BYOMing since Bell will be charging ISPs $95 diagnostic when subscribers complain about sync/speed problems and the tech call determines that the modem must be the problem - "Works fine with Sagem/Cellpipe, bad customer-owned CPE."
Things are a little bit more touchy on cable where one rogue modem can fudge up the whole node for all subscribers and services on it. On xDSL, a bad modem is unlikely to have much effect on other lines unless it experiences some sort of catastrophic failure.
BTW, CNOC wasted their time with the $3.75 upload option since Bell removed the fee from their tariffs in February. |
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 GuspazGuspazPremium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:19 | reply to resa1983
I believe the fee is still there for business tariffs? Or maybe it was for HSA (non-PPPoE, not what the CRTC is calling HSA)?
Anyhow, the point is that Bell is basically saying in their filing that they don't care what modem you use, use whatever you want. In practice they're preventing people from using anything but a Bell modem (they require to register serial numbers), but in the filing they're saying BYOM is fine.
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Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org |
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resa1983Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:7 Reviews:
 ·TekSavvy Cable
| Essentially yeah.
Considering what to write in my submission... Other than the fact that Bell should be forced to bear the costs of upgrading their network so Sagemcoms aren't required..
Luckily there's a few extra days.. Will be even more with the CRTC realizing they didn't post some submissions, and need to give additional time for that as well.
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Battle.net Tech Support MVP |
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 hm
@videotron.ca | said by resa1983:Considering what to write in my submission... Other than the fact that Bell should be forced to bear the costs of upgrading their network so Sagemcoms aren't required..
Or identifying which postal codes, areas, or addressed (in their look-up database) have the defective cards/equipment or whatever that requires only a certain type of modem.
Give an option: Fix the defects, or identify them. Or both since they won't fix anything this year or next.
This way both the customer and the ISP know. People shouldn't pay a diagnostic fee of 100$ like InvalidError is saying because of defective equipment that affects the maximum speed they get if they bridge their modems (which is normal to do), or whatever the case(s) may be in regards to Bell's materially defective equipment. |
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| reply to andyb
said by andyb:They state that 2 modems were tested and approved at the request od ISP's but dont say what they were. We already know what they are: the discontinued Cellpipe and the Sagem F@st Bell has been shipping to all new subscribers for the last couple of months. They are the only two modems for which Bell has firmware enabling them to work on either Stinger or 7330 remotes.
Since Bell's testing requires that modems submitted for approval support both equipment types and it is extremely unlikely that 3rd-party ISPs will manage to convince any vendor to make IKNS-specific firmware for low-volume customers, this is effectively Bell telling you "you can pick any color as long as it is black." |
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 andybPremium
join:2003-05-29
SW Ontario
kudos:1 | So some ISP's sent in bells own modems for testing? That makes alot of sense -not |
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resa1983Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:7 | Doubtful. More like bell required they use bells modems, and bell said ' we have to test them first.'
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Battle.net Tech Support MVP |
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| reply to andyb
said by andyb:So some ISP's sent in bells own modems for testing? That makes alot of sense -not What Bell said:
- The Companies are currently aware of two different modems that are fully compatible with their VDSL2 architecture. One, supplied by Alcatel-Lucent Canada Inc. (Alcatel) remains functional but the manufacturer recently discontinued its production. The second, supplied by Sagemcom Canada Inc. (Sagemcom), remains in production.
Bell is clearly referring to their own modems there, not units sent in from TPIAs. |
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andybPremium
join:2003-05-29
SW Ontario
kudos:1 Reviews:
 ·TekSavvy DSL
| Actually at bottom of page 3 it says 2 ISP's requested modem certification and it was done and approved.The kicker I didn't see right off was that some idiot ISP's asked for ADSL2 modems to be tested.No need for that unless bell asks for them to be certified if the isp sells them retail? Who knows but they were not vdsl anyway |
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andybPremium
join:2003-05-29
SW Ontario
kudos:1 Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
1 edit | reply to resa1983
Bell asking for extension again for HSA
 130405-The C···sion.doc 43219 bytes
bell request
(130405-The Comp-TNC 2013-80-AHSSPI Extension.doc.zip)
EDIT: Telus supports bell as they dunno what it costs either and need to do studies also for the HSA |
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andybPremium
join:2003-05-29
SW Ontario
kudos:1 Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
| Telus says leave us alone,it's bells problem with vdsl ours works fine.
 TELUS 130405···ents.pdf 90874 bytes
telus reply to crtc
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| reply to andyb
said by andyb:Who knows but they were not vdsl anyway
In other words, what I quoted is exactly how it is: there are only two VDSL2 modems known to be compatible with Bell's network and we know exactly which ones those two are.
Anything else is buy-at-your-own-risk. |
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resa1983Premium
join:2008-03-10
North York, ON
kudos:7 Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
| reply to andyb
Telus must not have gotten the 2nd extension email for the modem certification issue, hense the early submission. I got the email earlier, but was too busy to look at it. 
I do like their answer on modem certification.
Here's hoping the CRTC forces Bell to fix their network.
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Battle.net Tech Support MVP |
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andybPremium
join:2003-05-29
SW Ontario
kudos:1 Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
| reply to InvalidError
said by InvalidError:said by andyb:Who knows but they were not vdsl anyway
In other words, what I quoted is exactly how it is: there are only two VDSL2 modems known to be compatible with Bell's network and we know exactly which ones those two are. Anything else is buy-at-your-own-risk. I consider it a untruth.
"When the Companies provide wholesale high-speed access
services, they also make available to ISPs documentation that informs them of the various
protocols used and the corresponding standards that must be met. In general, any modem
available in the market that meets those industry standards can be used by the ISPs to provide
wholesale high-speed access services to their end-users on the Companies' network.4"
After reading the 4 footnote you go on to see the "unless you use vdsl where the problems .. etc and no documentation of what is wrong.They dont even admit using pre standards |
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| reply to InvalidError
said by InvalidError:.... there are only two VDSL2 modems known to be compatible with Bell's network .......
Wrong......
There's only one supported modem available for NEW sale - Sagemcom.
Sombody ought to pay Sagemcom a bunch of money to discontinue it now......to force the CRTC to tell Bell to get better remotes or freaking roll-out FTTH on a re-sale basis. |
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| said by MaynardKrebs:Sombody ought to pay Sagemcom a bunch of money to discontinue it now......to force the CRTC to tell Bell to get better remotes or freaking roll-out FTTH on a re-sale basis. I'm pretty sure the CRTC has no authority to dictate which technologies incumbents can or cannot use apart from spectrum reserved for specific technologies.
Unless you can prove beyond reasonable doubt that Bell massively deployed IKNS remotes in a bid to specifically cripple wholesale (unlikely since Bell is stuck having to live with it for their own subscribers too), you will not be able to convince the CRTC or any other authority to force Bell to upgrade these remotes before Bell decides to do so themselves. |
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