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iLearn

join:2013-01-16
canada

1 recommendation

Garage door problem

Click for full size
I have a Craftsman 1/2 HP garage door motor.

Today, the garage door would not close with when I press the garage door button. It moves for a few inches and then goes back up, clicking sound is heard a few times.

I disconnected the garage door from the track and it opens and closes just fine - without the load of the door.

I opened the door again with the door button, disconnected it from the track and hit the garage door button. I dont know what that thingy called but it moved ok.

Apparently, the door works when I try to open the door but does not work when I try to close it.

The photo eyes are aligned.

The light at the back of the motor blinks 4 times. Does any one know what that means?

Thanks


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada

Your 'close force' is pretty much at minimum - I'd try dialling it up a bit.

I had a similar problem with my father-in-laws door; it would close about 6" then reverse... Near as I could tell, there was nothing wrong; the rolling resistance of the door was just right at the threshold the opener was set to, and over time, got slightly harder to close (bearing or spring wear) and was tripping the safety... I turned it up a bit, and it started behaving normally again.



psafux
Premium,VIP
join:2005-11-10
kudos:2
reply to iLearn

said by iLearn:

The photo eyes are aligned.

But are they detecting any obstructions? Doesn't take much. One or both sensors should have a light on them indicating whether they detect an issue. Brush off any dust from the eyes and try again.


nunya
Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:12
Reviews:
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reply to iLearn

Mine does this in the evening at sunset. The sun shines at just the right angle to mess up the photo eye.
It's a Crapsman 1/2 HP too.
It's very annoying when it stops and does the stupid "clicky-clicky-clicky-clicky" routine.

If you hold the hardwired button down, it forces it to close.
--
If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't.


iLearn

join:2013-01-16
canada
reply to iLearn

Thanks All.

LazMan - I will try it in the morning. May be it was the sun light as nunya said. If it does not work then I will try to increase the 'close force' by one notch.

psafux - There is nothing obstructing the eyes. I tried to clean them up and both lights for the sender and the receiver are lit. So I dont think that is the issue.

nunya - Crapsman lol. Sorry but what is the hardwired button and where it is located?

BTW, I did put WD40 all over the assembly and everywhere in an attempt to reduce the noise down during operation. Later I found out that it was not a good idea to do it. It was not me guys, it was a buddy of mine who suggested this to me. And guess what, I called him up when this happened and he is also having some type of problem with his door. And we both put WD40 on our door around the same time.

I wonder if this has to do anything with this.

I will find out more about his and will keep you posted.



ilikeme
I live in a van down by the river.
Premium
join:2002-08-27
Sugar Land, TX
kudos:1

The hardwired button is the button on the wall in the garage that has a physical wire running to the opener.



mityfowl
Premium
join:2000-11-06
Dallas, TX
reply to iLearn

The next time you lubricate. Use lithium grease not wd 40.

Also it would behove you to put some oil (not wd40) on your spring.


iLearn

join:2013-01-16
canada
reply to ilikeme

said by ilikeme:

The hardwired button is the button on the wall in the garage that has a physical wire running to the opener.

Oh that! OK thanks

iLearn

join:2013-01-16
canada
reply to mityfowl

said by mityfowl:

The next time you lubricate. Use lithium grease not wd 40.

Yep, thanks


Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
kudos:18
reply to mityfowl

said by mityfowl:

The next time you lubricate. Use lithium grease not wd 40.

Also it would behove you to put some oil (not wd40) on your spring.

Or they can use GDL Spray.

Blaster 9.3 oz Garage Door Lubricant
»www.homedepot.com/p/Blaster-9-3-···02532761


--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time?


mityfowl
Premium
join:2000-11-06
Dallas, TX

said by Doctor Olds:

said by mityfowl:

The next time you lubricate. Use lithium grease not wd 40.

Also it would behove you to put some oil (not wd40) on your spring.

Or they can use GDL Spray.

Blaster 9.3 oz Garage Door Lubricant
»www.homedepot.com/p/Blaster-9-3-···02532761
[att=1]

I've never used silicone on that many hinges and wheels. Never for over 20 years.

If it was cheaper than lithium grease or about the same I'm sure I would use it.

Maybe not on top of the grease thats there though.


jack b
Gone Fishing
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-08
Cape Cod
kudos:1
reply to iLearn

Don't bother greasing the track rails, all you need to do is lubricate the roller axle bearings. Over time dust and whatnot will accumulate and gum up the tracks.
--
~Help Find a Cure for Cancer~
~Proud Member of Team Discovery ~



seaquake
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-23
Millersville, MD
reply to iLearn

My guess is that from what you are describing it is a down force issue. If it's moving, even just a little bit, then the eyes are probably clear. For a test, you should block the eyes and verify that the indicator on at least one of them is not lit up. Try putting the door down. It should instantly click and blink with no door movement.

Increasing the force required to auto-stop the door from closing will very likely fix your problem. What I'd do is take a look at what it's set at now, make a note of it and then crank it up to maximum. Try putting down the door. If it works fine, then that indeed is your problem. Reset the force to one level higher than what it was originally set at and try again. Keep bumping it up one level until the issue is fixed.

EDIT: Yeah, this has happened to me with the same model of door opener. I verified the opening chain (now belt) and tracks were in proper operating condition (as it sounds like you've done) and a slight bump-up in force close took care of my problem.


iLearn

join:2013-01-16
canada
reply to iLearn

oh wow.

I just tried the garage door several times and it worked fine.

So was it not working because of the nunya's sun light theory? I did not change any settings. damn.

But I have lived in this house for 3 years and was it just the coincidence that I never operated that door exactly at the time when sun is shining at the eyes? who knows?

If it happens again then I will play with the force setting as others suggested.


Austinloop

join:2001-08-19
Austin, TX
kudos:1

I have nunya's sun problem sometimes during the year. I solved the problem by taking some cardboard and making a sleeve to shade the lens of the sensor from the sun. Not particularly elegant, but it beats the heck out of trying to rotate the house 30 to 45 degrees.



sempergoofy
Premium
join:2001-07-06
Smyrna, GA

I did the same cardboard trick. I still have the problem sometimes during the year. I may have addressed it once by swapping the two sensors. I think one transmits and one receives.
--
nohup rm -fr /&



nunya
Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:12
reply to Austinloop

I did the "cardboard trick" too. It helps, but it's still not 100%.


lutful
... of ideas
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
kudos:1
reply to iLearn

said by iLearn:

But I have lived in this house for 3 years and was it just the coincidence that I never operated that door exactly at the time when sun is shining at the eyes? who knows?

Perfectly aligned system will not be bothered at all by the sun ... unless you have a glass wall or a huge hole right behind the transmitter. The simple reason is that the receiver-to-sun straight line will be at least 15 degrees away from the receiver-to-transmitter straight line for a proper garage door setup.

It is possible that the aiming was off by a few degrees during install but still allowed the transmitter beam to fall on the receiver lens with sufficient intensity. However, the bad aiming also allowed the sun to fall on the lens.


nunya
Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:12

I set mine with a laser level. Still does it. I think it's just "one of those things" that you laugh at and live with.
--
If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't.


lutful
... of ideas
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
kudos:1

said by nunya:

I set mine with a laser level. Still does it. I think it's just "one of those things" that you laugh at and live with.

It may be just a nuisance to most people but home/personal security could be compromised on rare occasions. Since you have the most experience with this problem, please record a demonstration video during the next sunset and kindly upload it.

It is possible that some receivers were assembled with a wide angle lens by mistake. The receiver's acceptance angle can be easily checked.


jack b
Gone Fishing
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-08
Cape Cod
kudos:1

Depending on the garage orientation I would think switching the transmitter with the receiver should eliminate sunlight caused issues. Or, simply glue on a short piece of PVC pipe as a "blinder" to the receiver "eye".
--
~Help Find a Cure for Cancer~
~Proud Member of Team Discovery ~


lutful
... of ideas
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
kudos:1

said by jack b:

Depending on the garage orientation I would think switching the transmitter with the receiver should eliminate sunlight caused issues.

Thank you. I really wanted someone else to point out the ONLY CORRECT position for the IR receiver is where either sunrise or sunset can't interfere with its operation.

It makes no sense to align the beam perfectly using a laser when the sensor was installed on the wrong side.

said by jack b:

Or, simply glue on a short piece of PVC pipe as a "blinder" to the receiver "eye".

Another common sense solution.

Older design IR sensors were not very selective spectrum-wise and needed to be put in a short tube with a very narrow angle lens. But this person still had a problem with the sun and fixed it using a tube from toilet paper roll.

Better designs use IR sensors which are matched to the transmitter wavelength and also modulate the transmitter beam to make sure the system is not confused by external IR sources.


nunya
Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:12
Reviews:
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Kind of hard and expensive to reorient my house (faces north). Think about it before saying "it makes no sense". There is no "wrong side". There's either the "deal with it in the morning" side, or "deal with it in the evening side".

It's not as big of a deal to me as it may be to others. I can hold the button down, wait 15 minutes for the sun to move, or have one of my kids stand outside so their shadow is covering the eye.

I'll try the TP tube though. It might work better than my cardboard blinder.
--
If someone refers to herself / himself as a "guru", they probably aren't.


lutful
... of ideas
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
kudos:1

2 edits

said by nunya:

Kind of hard and expensive to reorient my house (faces north).


No need to reorient your house. Just swap receiver and transmitter - many have wing nuts to simply that process. The original installer just did not think about it.

said by nunya:

Think about it before saying "it makes no sense". There is no "wrong side". There's either the "deal with it in the morning" side, or "deal with it in the evening side".

Moving the receiver to avoid potential solar interference around sunrise or sunset would not cause interference during the opposite daily event. That is true for any practical garage design even for perfectly east-west oriented houses located on the equator.


LazMan
Premium
join:2003-03-26
canada

1 recommendation

reply to nunya

Wow - some people just itching for a fight debate around here these days...


robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1
reply to lutful

said by lutful:

said by nunya:

Think about it before saying "it makes no sense". There is no "wrong side". There's either the "deal with it in the morning" side, or "deal with it in the evening side".

Moving the receiver to avoid potential solar interference around sunrise or sunset would not cause interference during the opposite daily event. That is true for any practical garage design even for perfectly east-west oriented houses located on the equator.

Please explain why you believe this

lutful
... of ideas
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
kudos:1

Click for full size
Google Sketchup has a sun path simulator which can be used to model the front of a garage in 3D and check this theory.

I drew a quick sketch of how this problem could happen on some setups. The sun's path will be at an angle from the beam's path and the opposite side will not see the sun because of the wall.

With perfect east-west orientation at the equator, the sun's path will actually be blocked by both sides of the garage.

robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1

But you are only thinking about a single day of the year. The sun does not rise and set from the same point every day. Therefore what you need to show is that it would be impossible for the rising sun to affect a sensor one day and days or months later the setting sun could not do the same if the sensors were reversed.


lutful
... of ideas
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
kudos:1

said by robbin:

But you are only thinking about a single day of the year.

Curiously I had mentioned Google SketchUp sun path simulator to avoid this type of assumption about my thinking process.

All manufacturers ask installers to choose the least sunny side for the receiver because it can be determined easily and the depth and height of the beam can be adjusted within specified limits to account for both summer and winter.

I previously mentioned that modern sensors modulate the beam to reduce solar interference ... which can also come from shiny garage wall/floor/cabinets.

robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
kudos:1

There is no least sunny side if the sun rises on one side of the door, shines on it all day, and sets on the other side.