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90115534
Someone is sabotaging me.Finding out who
Premium
join:2001-06-03
Kenner, LA

Surface

Poll
Do you think the Windows RT and Surface tablet will succeed?

No

Yes.


Votes:55




JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

It may take an xbox level of effort (and investment), but yeah. They are a core part of the new 'devices and services' vision.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us



kickass69

join:2002-06-03
Lake Hopatcong, NJ
reply to 90115534

I hope not. Windows will end up being like iOS...locked down and only being able to get apps through the Microsoft Store. Could no longer get programs freely like we do today without 'jailbreaking'. That's not a future I'd look forward to and Windows would cease to exist.


Oedipus

join:2005-05-09
kudos:1
reply to 90115534

Not a chance.



JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

1 recommendation

reply to kickass69

said by kickass69:

I hope not. Windows will end up being like iOS...locked down and only being able to get apps through the Microsoft Store. Could no longer get programs freely like we do today without 'jailbreaking'. That's not a future I'd look forward to and Windows would cease to exist.

Why could there not be two options? A locked down version for the people who don't want to deal with any of the downside to "freely installable" viruses and malware, and who don't ever use anything more than apps they find in the app store, and a version for the other folks (mostly here) who don't want that?

They're losing that first group to iOS in droves. I think they'd like to provide those people with a product they want to buy.

Edit: oh, and for those office types, with remote desktop a Surface RT is really the ideal meeting device. Small, light, infinite battery, and you're on your desktop. I was continuing work in visual studio just yesterday in a meeting, on my RT. Pretty sweet.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us


DrStrange
Technically feasible
Premium
join:2001-07-23
West Hartford, CT
kudos:1
reply to 90115534

Surface is an overpriced gadget that I don't need. Might be nice for about 1/4 or 1/3 the MSRP.
If I suddenly feel the overwhelming urge to buy this, I'll get a Kindle Fire instead.

I predict it will go the way of Zune.



Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1
reply to 90115534

I honestly don't think it matters,.....

I suspect Windows OSes don't necessarily have to "succeed" on an individual bases. Therefore the question should probably be something like " Will Windows ultimately fail to take hold on ARM hardware?", because there very well may be a successor to the current Windows RT regardless of how it fairs.

I mean it would be of questionable logic to assume, for example, that if Windows 8 didn't fair well that there would never be another version of Windows for x86 / x64 hardware. So I see no reason to think the same of Windows RT on ARM,...



Kramer
Premium,Mod
join:2000-08-03
Richmond, VA
kudos:2
reply to 90115534

I don't see RT succeeding, but I do see the Surface possibly doing well if Microsoft gets the price point for the Pro under control. I'm not sure that is very important to them though. That may take some time as hardware improves and prices come down. In the end Microsoft may succeed by creating a single unified interface with a common bucket of applications that can be used. I don't think they succeed if those applications have to be developed for two platforms. Apple has managed to do this successfully, but I don't think MS can pull it off. Developers will need to see some major improvement in ownership numbers for that to work. Microsoft just needs to concentrate on their core business and the zillions of developers that support it.



90115534
Someone is sabotaging me.Finding out who
Premium
join:2001-06-03
Kenner, LA
reply to 90115534

Interesting results everyone. Thanks.



Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1
reply to Kramer

said by Kramer:

I don't see RT succeeding, but I do see the Surface possibly doing well if Microsoft gets the price point for the Pro under control. I'm not sure that is very important to them though. That may take some time as hardware improves and prices come down.

Microsoft doesn't set or control hardware prices or at least not for this type of hardware in this segment of the market.

Again, the Surface Pro isn't anything new. It's predecessor PC tablets running Windows 7 on Sandy Bridge Core i5 processors and even earlier Core i5 processors / hardware where in approximately the same price range.

The current gen PC tablets, of which Surface Pro is only a part of, are more powerful, efficient and slightly cheaper then previous generations. However, its unrealistic to expect Microsoft's offerings here to be any cheaper then they already are (or significantly cheaper then other manufactures).

Prices will likely drop over time without direct intervention from Microsoft.


Kramer
Premium,Mod
join:2000-08-03
Richmond, VA
kudos:2

I never said Microsoft was in control of this although I can see why you might have thought I meant that. I just don't see RT being anything more than a way to get the message out that in the end will fail to do so. Hardware prices will fall as you say without MS' intervention. The big problem for Microsoft is that they have let too much time go by without doing anything significant.

The iPad came out almost 3 years ago to the day. There are two of them in my family and the owners are now loyal Apple customers. They are my children, and I doubt either will ever again buy anything made or powered by Microsoft for the home other than perhaps a game console. The iPhone came out 6 years ago and Microsoft hasn't been able to do anything to compete. A lot of people who simply use the computer to surf the web, to read email and to have a little fun gravitated to either the Apple tablet/phone ecosystem or now the Android ecosystem that offers much lower prices. Microsoft comes along way too late, with decent hardware, but hardware that goes head to head or even exceeds Apple prices. I said it some time back, but they needed to give this stuff away at a loss. That they were in full control of. That's the only way they were going to crack this market. I just don't see MS being a meaningful competitor in what is rapidly evolving to be an entirely different market for the home then it was just three years ago. You never know for sure though. IOS is boring and hasn't significantly changed since its inception. Apple lost its visionary and seems to have lost some direction. Anything could happen. If I were Microsoft, I'd be as worried about Android as I would IOS.

The business world is an entirely different story. MS is so entrenched in so many areas that I don't see anyone breaking that hold for at least 5 years or more. I really think Windows 8 was a huge mistake, because it was too big a change for business customers. Touch will become important for businesses too, but never in the same way as it has become the standard for the home market. I really think MS needs to concentrate on that business market more than anything. It is the core of their business and they need to keep their customers very happy. Unless MS is willing to take a huge expensive gamble by giving away hardware under cost, I'm afraid the home market is gone for them. The same applies to phones. They need to give them away.



Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1

1 edit
reply to 90115534

If there is some ambiguity or misunderstanding about an earlier statement of yours please feel free to clarify.

I do agree with everything you said about Apple / Apple products. I have a number of Apple products at home as well and the kids are always vying for them. I also just gave my eldest an iPhone. I think the reality is that a lot of people are growing up with their earlest computing experiences on ARM devices like an iPad and iPhone (or Android) rather then on traditional computers running Microsoft OSes.

The dream or Mantra of a computer on every desk and Microsoft OS on every computer is eroding. Microsoft knows this and this is likely why their Windows RT ARM initiative makes sense,........to them.

Microsoft is indeed intrenched in the business sector but Microsoft is also very well known for its relationship with hardware manufacturers. I don't really see how Microsoft could sell hardware like the Surface and Surface Pro at a loss and still maintain a working relationship with these OEMs that are likely relying on thin profit margins,...

Microsoft still needs these hardware manufacturers and Surface / Surface Pro at fair market prices is affront enough to them.

***edit***

quote:
Which brings us neatly onto Windows RT. if the upstream supply chain is to be believed, Microsoft will retire the Windows RT brand and merge it with Windows Blue -

Microsoft finally approves cheap 7- and 8-inch Windows 8 tablets, might merge Windows RT with Blue

Whatever that means,......


JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

said by Octavean:

Whatever that means,......

yeah that is a meaningless statement, unless they are referring to branding. there is nothing about rt other than the name - it IS windows 8. compiled for arm.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us


Retired
Premium
join:2002-11-09
Earth
reply to 90115534

No....Microsoft is done. And Apple is taking a sprial nosedive too.

Google and Samsung are tops.
--
I work hard. I play hard. I stay hard.


BlitzenZeus
Burnt Out Cynic
Premium
join:2000-01-13
kudos:3

Only for consumer who don't want to do more than basic stuff, the same kind of crap you can do on a smartphone. If you want to do more with a device you need a real computer, and walled garden applications are not where it's at. Sure people can have their device os be hacked to run 3rd party software, but that's not something the average person will do. Tablets are for grandparents, and parents who couldn't program their own vcr.

WinRT is a joke, and worse than the offerings by Apple and Google in it's variety.
--
I distrust those people who know so well what god wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires- Susan B. Anthony
Yesterday we obeyed kings, and bent our necks before emperors. But today we kneel only to the truth- Kahlil G.


bgraham

join:2001-03-15
Smithtown, NY
reply to 90115534

Personally I prefer the Acer Netbook for $350. I added a 500 gig hard drive for $54 and now I have a real Win7 computer that runs MS Office and Photoshop and will hold all of my data. (Photoshop runs not very rapidly, but it runs)
Every day at home I back up my desktop data to the netbook using Synctoy, so it's an easy way to do backups.

Anywhere I go I have all my data and 6 hours of battery time and I have no need or interest in cloud computing.

The Netbook has a real keyboard too .

The netbook along with Starbucks made life bearable last year during hurricane Sandy when we had no electricity or internet for 3 weeks.

We go to Europe on vacation every year and I can keep my photographs backed up to the Netbook and the camera memory cards.

I would rather invest in a later better screen resolution Netbook than a Surface or an Ipad or whatever other tablet there is out there with it's little available software or memory.

Edit: Oh yes, I hate the shiny Netbook screen. Do something Acer!!



aurgathor

join:2002-12-01
Lynnwood, WA
kudos:1
reply to Octavean

My guess is that "merging" will mean that the successor of Windows RT will be called "Windows Blue ARM version", in addition to the current 32 bit (x86) and 64 bit (x64) versions.

I kinda doubt that it would run traditional PC software (be it 32 or 64 bit) since the ARM ISA is fairly different from the x86 or x64 ISAs. While it's not impossible to create an emulator and run x86/x64 PC programs in that, I don't think MS would do that for the Blue ARM.

I agree that MS can't compete solely on price because it relies heavily on 3rd party manufacturers. It can; however, compete on quality and features, and to a lesser extent, on value on premier products.
--
Wacky Races 2012!



Metatron2008
Premium
join:2008-09-02
united state

Rt is a failure out the door. Overpriced tablet witha lower resolution screen then ipad and android, very few apps, attempting to cash in on the windows brand.

The only tablet you should get if you get a Microsoft one is a x86 tablet.



aurgathor

join:2002-12-01
Lynnwood, WA
kudos:1

Even Win8 is considered a failure by many....



Alcohol
Premium
join:2003-05-26
Climax, MI
kudos:4
reply to 90115534

The only thing that'll succeed is a surface laptop. Or maybe a surface phone.
--
I found the key to success but somebody changed the lock.



aurgathor

join:2002-12-01
Lynnwood, WA
kudos:1
reply to 90115534

I don't see either one of them going away anytime soon in spite of disappointing sales, and real or perceived technical issues.

With the majority of portable devices being ARM based, MS is not going to abandon an ARM based windows, though it may be merged into Blue.

As for Surface:

quote:
Panay says the team is working on future Surface generations at the moment . "When I say generations, not just one, we have the teams at full speed and loving what they're building and seeing," he says enthusiastically. "I think things just keep getting better, just hopefully what you'd expect from us."
 
MS often needs 3 iterations to get something really successful, and I think their tablets (haerdware) were reasonably decent already, even if they don't have the sales numbers to back that up.
--
Wacky Races 2012!