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Schafer

@optonline.net

Privacy and Police Pings of Cell Phones

I got a scanner to listen to railroad radio traffic to know if any trains were coming for photography purposes. I started to listen to local police out of curiosity about happenings in town.

There is no federal law against listening (yet), but I am amazed at
about how the police "ping" cell phones to locate people who may or may not be involved in a crime.

A situation develops and within minutes they are pinging cell phones. Sometimes it takes 12 minutes to get a location and sometimes they can get a location right away. Its like they have a data terminal right to verizon or sprint or whoever, and there is no human gatekeeper.

Keep in mind none of these phones dialed 911. They are just sitting in someone's pocket.

Sometimes they say "to 30 meters" and sometimes they just get a general location.

They can send update the location of the phone on a map inside the mobile data terminal of the cruisers too. And the dispatcher can direct the cruisers where to go to make a "fence".

Sometimes they use is to locate a person who is reported to be distraught, to locate the registered owner of car which was reported to leave the scene of some malfeasance (whether the registered owner was involved or not), and sometimes they get tired of waiting for "key holders" to come to a place with an activated burglar alarm and want to locate them to see where they are....

Exactly when did it become legal to do this?



CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County

It is 'legal' till someone challenges them on doing this... Though it might be difficult to convince people that this is bad if they actually catch people involved in a crime.
--
Brian

"It drops into your stomach like a Abrams's tank.... driven by Rosanne Barr..." A. Bourdain

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DownTheShore
Honoring The Captain
Premium
join:2003-12-02
Beautiful NJ
kudos:14
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
reply to CylonRed

Re: Privacy and Police Pings of Cell Phones

said by CylonRed:

It is 'legal' till someone challenges them on doing this... Though it might be difficult to convince people that this is bad if they actually catch people involved in a crime.

Or until they false arrest someone and the media gets a hold of the story.
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kickass69

join:2002-06-03
Lake Hopatcong, NJ
reply to Schafer

Re: Privacy and Police Pings of Cell Phones

I'm guessing this is in the NYC Metro area since you're using Optimum. Where were you listening to this?

Unfortunately it seems to be deemed legal:

»policeledintelligence.com/2012/0···-kosher/



Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:5
reply to Schafer

I have no heartache listening on a scanner and the assumption I did is absurd. I used some far out their leaps just to make a more subtle point simply because I find that most of you types and yes I am stereotyping, dont get subtle cues. What I am saying is that your crying like babies because the cops are trying to fight crime. As you may have noticed they are usually a few steps behind both physically and in technology. The OP seems to want to take jabs at the police whereas the stuff they are doing pales in comparison to what your FBI and CIA do in the states and around the world. So you cowardly pick on the NY Police dept (and they showed how fine they are during the Trade Centre destruction) and not the true usurpers of your freedoms. Its rather disgusting and I dont have any hesitation in saying so.

And its legal to boot. Can I watch as youall insert the other foot!
--
Ain't nuthin but the blues! "Albert Collins".
Leave your troubles at the door! "Pepe Peregil" De Sevilla. Just Don't Wifi without WPA, "Yul Brenner"

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Trihexagonal

join:2004-08-29
US
Reviews:
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1 recommendation

said by Anav:

So you cowardly pick on the NY Police dept (and they showed how fine they are during the Trade Centre destruction) and not the true usurpers of your freedoms.

It's people like you that are the real threat to our freedom and rights as outlined in the United States Constitution.


CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County

Pretty sure the Constitution has no idea cell phones exist not that they might exist in the future.



Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:5
reply to Trihexagonal

said by Trihexagonal:

said by Anav:

So you cowardly pick on the NY Police dept (and they showed how fine they are during the Trade Centre destruction) and not the true usurpers of your freedoms.

It's people like you that are the real threat to our freedom and rights as outlined in the United States Constitution.

Hahaha, that is so funny. I think there is a long line ahead of me that a. are really a threat and b. dont care, and they are all south of the 49 parallel. I admire many people in the US, both alive and historically, but Tri, your not one of them. What happens in the US, directly affects use here in Canada and thus we do care and do pay attention.
--
Ain't nuthin but the blues! "Albert Collins".
Leave your troubles at the door! "Pepe Peregil" De Sevilla. Just Don't Wifi without WPA, "Yul Brenner"

LlamaWorks Equipment


Schafer

@optonline.net
reply to CylonRed

This is a lesson in a "slippery slope".

All this location technology was required by the FCC so that 911 could send help to the right place fast.

Now you can have a SWAT team at your door, no matter where you are, because someone stole your car and used it to commit a crime.

Or somebody can now "SWAT" you by claiming your distraught and a weapon owner by making a call on a burner phone.



Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:5

I can see that is a valid concern Schafer. It demonstrates that cops need to be educated in technology and use it properly but they should still have access to it. Of course SWAT teams would be overkill but with the plethora of assault rifles one cannot be too careful.

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Schafer

@optonline.net
reply to kickass69

Re: Privacy and Police Pings of Cell Phones

No, Im out in the sticks although I grew up in NYC. Im in a medium sized Connecticut town listening to use of cell phone location data by Connecticut State Police and the local police.

Radioreference.com hosts streams of police scanners. Everything is recorded and if you get there premium membership you can go back to any arbitrary point in time and listen to a stream.

If I heard a good cell phone ping incident I could mention the date and time and stream.

ECPA 1986 prevents people from stating specific info they overhead on a scanner, for any service, I believe.



Schafer

@optonline.net
reply to kickass69

kickass69 there was a time when recording a cop with video or even just a tape recorder at a traffic stop was a felony. We can only hope the issue finds its way to a higher court.

The first step is raise awareness.



Schafer

@optonline.net
reply to CylonRed

Cylon. No, but the fourth amendment gives you the right to be secure in your person houses papers and effects against unreasonable searches...

So it will take a court to decide (overturn) whether a judge should write a warrant for a ping/locate or define exigent circumstances allowing the police to do a ping/locate without a warrant.



Anav
Sarcastic Llama? Naw, Just Acerbic
Premium
join:2001-07-16
Dartmouth, NS
kudos:5
reply to Schafer

said by Schafer :

kickass69 there was a time when recording a cop with video or even just a tape recorder at a traffic stop was a felony. We can only hope the issue finds its way to a higher court.

The first step is raise awareness.

Good thing, being accountable and transparent by the police builds trust so that when they use technology in an educated but useful way, the public will be more accepting. There is a program in our town whereby it appears as if they will post online what each cop did everyday.....

They are not the enemy, the friggen perps that dont respect our society are the problem.
--
Ain't nuthin but the blues! "Albert Collins".
Leave your troubles at the door! "Pepe Peregil" De Sevilla. Just Don't Wifi without WPA, "Yul Brenner"

LlamaWorks Equipment


Faster
Premium
join:2013-03-09
reply to Schafer

It's not new but the frequency of it is increasing in that we've had a recent rash of SWAT calls from someone claiming to be a mega celebrity living in the LA area saying people with guns have entered their estate or house and SWAT and regular cops roll out big time. Naturally it's all a prank made by someone. Often the celebrity is not even in town.