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Zinzio

@rr.com
reply to Draco

Re: Twitch.tv Issues (Chime in!)

Well I have been working with both Twitch and TW cable and it doesn't appear a resolution is in site..

This is what Twitch has replied to me with..
--
Jason M replied:
Hi,

The issue is the bandwidth between TWC and Level3 (our CDN). Basically, this is a fixed bandwidth path. Thus, as demand grows during peak hours, your fighting for resources with everyone else. Level3 serves more than us, thus the fight for these resources is beyond Twitch's control. We will continue to try to get the best service (and rates) to allow more of our customers to have lag-free experiences.

FYI: Turbo will not improve this issue.
Regards,

Jason M.
Twitch Customer Support
--

So basically until Level3 stops throttling TWC, the problems will remain. I had a friend that lives down the street that (who has Wide Open West as an ISP) do a tracert to twitch.tv and he is not being routed through Level3, he also doesn't experience any lag.

I have spoken again with TWC and threatened to cancel my service, they escalated the issue to a national support team but i have yet to hear any resolution back (pending now for about 2 weeks.) My best advice is to get another ISP if you can.



Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

said by Zinzio :

So basically until Level3 stops throttling TWC, the problems will remain. I had a friend that lives down the street that (who has Wide Open West as an ISP) do a tracert to twitch.tv and he is not being routed through Level3, he also doesn't experience any lag.

I have spoken again with TWC and threatened to cancel my service, they escalated the issue to a national support team but i have yet to hear any resolution back (pending now for about 2 weeks.) My best advice is to get another ISP if you can.

Level3 isn't throttling Time Warner. As the tech stated, TWC customers are fighting for the pipe alongside others, or the problem is perhaps with the pipes from/to Time Warner to/from Level3 being overloaded and you have Time Warner customers from specific regions fighting for the data. As much as Level3's network tends to be shoddy in some parts of the world, they do carry a lot of traffic in perspective as a Tier 1 provider. So many folks use them.


kywirelessgu
Premium
join:2004-01-25
Nicholasville, KY
reply to Draco

I'm a former insight customer (now TWC) and I've been having this problem for several months now.

Twitch is unwatchable at all resolutions.

I wish more of the tournaments used multiple streaming companies. I don't have as many problems with Azubu or youtube live streams.
--
the answers to all lifes questions... »www.google.com


networkman98

join:2003-05-21
Advance, NC
reply to Smith6612

Yes, Smith6612 is correct here. If there is saturation on a link, there is not much that can be done with it except for backbone teams to get together and troubleshoot the issue. I've seen specific problems with TWC customers using Level 3 DNS servers and there being packet loss on a link between Level 3 and TWC. There is nothing that TWC can do directly because it's on Level 3's end. Do a traceroute or pingplotter and you will typically see no issue with TWC's network all the way out it's own backbone.

Many ISPs (not including AT&T or Verizon), if not all, get their access to the Internet backbone through Level 3 as they are a Tier 1 provider. They merged with Global Crossing which was the other largest Tier 1 provider outside of Level 3.



Draco

join:2006-06-18
Slate Hill, NY

1 edit
reply to Draco

...and what needs to be done is TWC's NOC opening a ticket with Level3/GBLX to track said issues regarding congestion on that route that are effecting usage. Only they can do it, not non-customers of Level3.

The question is if TWC even cares to do so?

I will add that all this weekend I've been in NJ on a VZ FIOS line and streaming just fine as per the norm. I've done bitrates from 2 to 8 Mbps just fine. Though here's a kicker: All weekend after 3-4PM it has been horrible to watch not only my own stream over 2 Mbps, but others as well. So this is behaving just the same on a 75/25 connection on another provider. The route from here goes through alter.net and telia.net where it then times out (like normal).

Very bizarre.



DrDrew
That others may surf
Premium
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:15

There's a long standing conflict between L3 and ISPs about this traffic..

The common arguements are: L3 says it's transit and the ISP pays for bandwidth. The ISPs say it's CDN traffic and L3 should pay for bandwidth.

»publicknowledge.org/blog/netflix···-level-3
--
Two is one, one is none. If it's important, have a back up... 99.999% availability just isn't enough sometimes.



Sieger

@voxility.net

I was having the same issue at NY. I was able to fix it by using one of the free VPN services("http://www.vpnbook.com/"). Now i can watch at 1080+ no problem when i could barely watch 360p before



Jeb

@rr.com
reply to Draco

Re: Twitch.tv Issues

Same problem here. used to watch everything on twitch in 1080p no problem. now I cant watch any VOD whatsoever and streams lag horribly. no answers, just solidifying the fact that this is an enormous and horribly real problem.


piyokos8

join:2010-03-20
reply to Draco

Re: Twitch.tv Issues (Chime in!)

Get a VPN service with a NY local server like StrongVPN. Costs a bit of money but I can't watch streams on Twitch.tv without it. Also resolved some occasional streaming issues with Youtube.



Heroxoot

@24.100.102.x
reply to Draco

Ever since TWC bought insight communication in feb 2013 I have had nothing but lag on twitch. I have tried every fix I can find. Blocking different IPs and such. Nothing works. Nothing helps. I even upgraded to 50/5 from 15/1 because TWC told me I had a lack of bandwidth with 6 people on my internet. Was never a problem before they bought insight.



Draco

join:2006-06-18
Slate Hill, NY
reply to Draco

»help.twitch.tv/customer/portal/q···nnection

More and more people reporting in on this issue. Same pointless replies from Jason M. suggesting blocking IP ranges again which have *NOTHING* to do with it. So frustrating. We'll see if they further answer questions in this thread... unfortunately no one from Twitch have hit these forums.


andy4theherd

join:2012-12-02
Ashland, KY
reply to Sieger

said by Sieger :

I was having the same issue at NY. I was able to fix it by using one of the free VPN services("http://www.vpnbook.com/"). Now i can watch at 1080+ no problem when i could barely watch 360p before

what server are you using? i've tried the EU1 and the US and both are way worse than my normal TWC slow Twitch stream...

cmbuzzkill

join:2013-05-16
Dallas, TX

The problem seems to be internal to Level3 in how it deals with inbound traffic from various parts of the US -- mostly from the South/Southeast and mostly from TWC. The only (for the love of god please be temporary) solution seems to be the use of a VPN service if your broadcast is experiencing the stop/start lag problems. Using the VPN will (possibly, but not always) allow your traffic to hit Level3 from areas where inbound traffic isn't having problems, and be routed through to Twitch.

This "solution" adds hops to your route, decreases the maximum bandwidth you can use to stream, and can therefore decrease the overall quality (bye bye 1080p...) of your stream -- in a word, it sucks.

The fingerpointing game can (and probably will) go on for a while, but I think eventually something will get done and Level3 will get itself sorted.


rippleeffect

join:2012-11-02
Palmdale, CA
reply to Draco

I haven't been able to watch any stream over 480p today (probably around 1mbps). Anything higher than that just stutters and lags.

I'm trying to watch the WCS_America feed right now, and its barely handling 480p.

I'm so fed up with TWC, but I do not have any other options in my area. For the amount of money I've paid them over the course of 9 years of service, you'd think I'd be able to get a steady 3mbps video feed.

I'm able to stream all day at 3.5mbps, but I can't watch it live. I know my upload is good because I can go back and watch the vod later and it looks good, AFTER I let it buffer forever)



Josh H

@rr.com

Exactly the same issue in SoCal as well. I can hit 2mbps downloads for drivers from nvidia, however, when it comes to streaming, my connection does not pass 120k / sec.

I use TWC for home, and for work, both have the same issue. Traceroute timesouts after the 9th hop.



Josh H

@rr.com

Just tried tethering my 4g phone from verizon. Stream is fine getting 600k-800k constantly. Jump back on TWC, down to 120k



MrCacaface

@rr.com
reply to Josh H

Same problem here in Austin TX. Our internet in general has been absolute garbage as of the last few months. It just seems to be majorly throttled on certain sites. Twitch VODS being to the EXTREME. I can only watch .2 seconds and it buffers for about 3 seconds and plays the next .2 seconds. Just plain bs.


coolcat120

join:2007-04-13
reply to Draco

Good news.
»blog.twitch.tv/2013/06/time-warn···service/



Draco

join:2006-06-18
Slate Hill, NY

Very good news indeed. For the past two weeks or so (at least), I've noticed streams properly functioning even without a VPN.

Big thanks to anyone from TWC that was actually listening and awesome job from all of you for speaking up. It's all about numbers and many came out in force to voice their displeasure not only here, but on many other forums. Excellent result.

We would love to know who was involved with "sitting down with Twitch" to give them some recognition to boot. They deserve some reward for caring for customers at the very least. (I even wonder if there was a trouble ticket opened on it?)


jca2050
Premium
join:2002-02-04
Dallas, TX

Draco: do you lag when you stream? I tried streaming QuakeLive and noticed 20-30 ping variance while streaming. I'm on 50/5 and have set stream bit rate ranging from 1,500 to 3,500 and get same latency variance even at 1,500 (less than 1/3rd upload B/W).



Draco

join:2006-06-18
Slate Hill, NY

said by jca2050:

Draco: do you lag when you stream? I tried streaming QuakeLive and noticed 20-30 ping variance while streaming. I'm on 50/5 and have set stream bit rate ranging from 1,500 to 3,500 and get same latency variance even at 1,500 (less than 1/3rd upload B/W).

My bad, I didn't see you reply.

You can "lag" for many reasons. I can take some random pot-shots at recommending why though w/o deep investigation. What router do you use? Is your router doing QoS? Does it help if you enable (& adjust settings) or disable it?

If you're using OBS to broadcast, try using some of the (advanced) options to adjust how it's using bandwidth. Beware these two options can sometimes...
1.) do nothing.
2.) make your stream susceptible to more frame drops.
3.) actually help.

The two options I'm talking about are:
- Settings > Broadcast Settings > Minimize Network Impact
- Settings > Advanced > Automatic Low Latency Mode

First try enabling the first one. Then enable the second one if that doesn't have any effect while keeping the first checked off. Try different combinations of this and that should hopefully help latency a little. If it doesn't do a damn thing, then you need to investigate the router and maybe some other things that might be causing latency fluctuation.