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« $1.50 a min?
This is a sub-selection from Pure speculation.


Mojo 77

@184.105.144.x
reply to SunnyD

Re: Pure speculation.

Oh FFS. Only this website would have boobs come out defending AT&T for abusing a system used to help the elderly and hard of hearing.

IP Relay has been abused for decades. As the article notes, you should be able to do the math at $1.50 per minute subsidies with a decade or two of abuse, when 80-90% of all IP relay traffic is fraud. Do the math.

The chicken-shit FCC didn't call for an audit of course so we'll never know for sure, but if you think this netted them anything less than a billion you're a fool.


Alex J

@he.net
Also, the article doesn't even mention that IP Relay has been used for prank calls for several decades. Nice of taxpayers to fund the bill for that, and nice of regulators to do nothing about it. This was a massive story in 2004 I remember. It's mind blowing that we're just now seeing any real action on this:

»www.nbcnews.com/id/4781806/ns/te···U8bWsiSo


FFH
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
reply to Mojo 77
said by Mojo 77 :

Oh FFS. Only this website would have boobs come out defending AT&T for abusing a system used to help the elderly and hard of hearing.

IP Relay has been abused for decades. As the article notes, you should be able to do the math at $1.50 per minute subsidies with a decade or two of abuse, when 80-90% of all IP relay traffic is fraud. Do the math.

It isn't defending AT&T to question the amount of fraud minutes claimed by Karl. Until he can find stats showing how many IP Relay minutes were used and how much was fradulent, the total amount of loss is speculation.
--
"If you want to anger a conservative lie to him.
If you want to anger a liberal tell him the truth."


Mojo 77

@184.105.146.x
What I really like is there's a huge article here clearly outlining proven fraud perpetrated against a service that's intended to help the elderly and hard of hearing, and you and barney here's only comment is that you think it's outrageous to speculate that we could be talking billions of dollars in fraud.

The DOJ lawsuit alleges tens of millions, the FCC alleges unspecified millions. Neither did an audit because they're weak-kneed weasels and AT&T would fight them for years in court. The DOJ estimated that 95 percent of AT&T's IP Relay call volume was fraudulent foreign callers. The article speculates that it could top out in the billions, and with a decade of use I'd tend to agree that's a very real possibility over 10-15 years of abuse.

You guys are either trolls or obtuse.

SunnyD

join:2009-03-20
Madison, AL

2 recommendations

reply to Mojo 77
I completely agree that if/with no audit, than the fine is mostly a hollow victory. But let's be honest, without that audit saying "billions" it no more relevant than saying "tens". It only serves to make things potentially more sensational than they are.

Personally, I'd have preferred to see a full audit. From what I can tell, the DOJ may still pursue this further (it appears that their investigation isn't linked to the FCC's action at all?). Perhaps criminal charges may still come of it too. One can only dream. Until then, this is a step forward no matter how minuscule it happens to be.


Mojo 77

@184.105.146.x

I completely agree that if/with no audit, than the fine is mostly a hollow victory. But let's be honest, without that audit saying "billions" it no more relevant than saying "tens". It only serves to make things potentially more sensational than they are.

The article simply speculates we could be talking billions, with $1.50 per minute and ten to fifteen years of abuse (not to mention prank calls). I think that's entirely within the realm of possibility and not "sensational." What's "sensational" is that it took ten to fifteen years for the government to do anything about it.

It's very, very unlikely you'll see either the DOJ or FBI pursue an audit, based on historical cases like this. I bet if you did a real audit of any incumbent telco's coffers over the last thirty years, you'd find a hell of a lot worse than a billion in IP relay fraud.


battleop

join:2005-09-28
00000

1 recommendation

reply to Alex J
"Also, the article doesn't even mention that IP Relay has been used for prank calls for several decades."

Uhmmm.........
--
I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company.


OSUGoose

join:2007-12-27
Columbus, OH

1 recommendation

reply to Mojo 77
How much of that "foreign" traffic was US prankers using intl VPN's


ArrayList
netbus developer
Premium
join:2005-03-19
Brighton, MA
none most likely.


cork1958
Cork
Premium
join:2000-02-26

1 recommendation

reply to FFH
said by FFH:

said by Mojo 77 :

Oh FFS. Only this website would have boobs come out defending AT&T for abusing a system used to help the elderly and hard of hearing.

IP Relay has been abused for decades. As the article notes, you should be able to do the math at $1.50 per minute subsidies with a decade or two of abuse, when 80-90% of all IP relay traffic is fraud. Do the math.

It isn't defending AT&T to question the amount of fraud minutes claimed by Karl. Until he can find stats showing how many IP Relay minutes were used and how much was fradulent, the total amount of loss is speculation.

Yeah,
I love stats to but I'm not such a blind nit wit that I can't see that no matter what the actual stats may be, we all know how true this is and the fact the FCC did absolutely nothing about it just proves that office needs to be eliminated! Just as AT&T and Verizon, just to mention a couple, need to be also!
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»www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/