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Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service

[Southeast] AT&T IFITL DSL service grossly oversubscribed.

So after getting a call from some office thanks to Mark in the direct forums it appears that AT&T's stance on this is that they know the service is terrible, they know it is overloaded and the only thing they are willing to do is continue to sell new service to degrade it even further.

If you are not satisfied with the speeds* then you can cancel your service as we are not going to do anything to improve the quality of DSL service. We are focusing on UVerse now and are continuing to roll that out to new areas.
Wow, just damn.
*speeds - speeds are regularly below 300kbs after 6PM and the connection quality is so terrible that a 128K video can not be streamed. They are so bad that it often takes 2-3 times the duration of the video just to 'buffer' it.

Additionally I was told that if I continued to report issues with the service that they would declare my residence unserviceable and deny me service.

Past slogans
"Welcome to the new AT&T"
"AT&T rethink possible"

Future slogan suggestion
"AT&T delivering a new level of douche-baggery"

If you are experiencing issues with your AT&T DSL service and are unable to get them resolved I encourage you to file complaints with the Public Service Commission, even if it is on your way to another provider. Hopefully with enough complaints they at least will be fined or penalized in some manner but I doubt it.


weaseled386

join:2008-04-13
Port Orange, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House
·AT&T U-Verse
I won't dispute that iFITL is an old limited service, but what (exactly) are you using to gauge your speeds? Stating that you're getting below 300kbs while streaming video tells us nothing.

IFITL hasn't been installed in years, and there really isn't anything to take its place. In some places MX DISCS was installed, but even it is gimped. A very limited number of the MX DISCS is being upgraded, but even after upgrades they won't see Uverse speeds. (Although in the not-so-distant future they'll be able to order Uverse video.)

They can't just drop a VRAD to upgrade IFITL areas. That would be going fiber to copper.. What, exactly, do you propose they do?

Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
»/testhistory/710463/eedee

There you can see my speed tests, the times tell all.
This is not what happens as a result of the industry regularly oversubscribing/overselling the service this is the result of a gross negligence in continuing to oversubscribe.

I use the speed tests here. I use the facts that pages on forums such as these take 5-6 seconds to load. AT&T tries to sell this off as 'slowdown' from congestion, that is not what this is this is a case of the equipment at my first hop being overutilized probably more than 300%.

I was only using the streaming as an example, a 1.5M connection should have no issues streaming a 128K video, provided the host is not the source of the problem.

I don't want U-Verse speeds, well I don't expect them anyway.

What do I propose they do?

Well they could start by STOPPING selling new service on a system that is already crippled, then they could upgrade the capacity to where it performs at an acceptable level.

I know IFITL is old and limited that has nothing to do with what I am experiencing, unfortunately it is my only option at the moment.


SlowFITL

join:2012-02-01
Mobile, AL
Reviews:
·AT&T Southeast
reply to Jeff35582
I'm not sure about IFITL, but the MX in my neighborhood could see better speeds than the FTTN version of Uverse by uprgrading the electronics in each pedestal. They would be splitting one fiber optic drop to 12 homes with short copper runs which is still theoretically superior to traditional UVerse in every way.

It can be done, but AT&T is too cheap to do it.


weaseled386

join:2008-04-13
Port Orange, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House
·AT&T U-Verse
said by SlowFITL:

I'm not sure about IFITL, but the MX in my neighborhood could see better speeds than the FTTN version of Uverse by uprgrading the electronics in each pedestal. They would be splitting one fiber optic drop to 12 homes with short copper runs which is still theoretically superior to traditional UVerse in every way.

It can be done, but AT&T is too cheap to do it.

I won't dispute the cheap part, but I can talk about certain aspects of the technology. Unless the MX itself is upgraded it'll do zero (no, 0%, nothing) good to upgrade anything beyond the RT. As part of the MX upgrade the electronics inside the pedestal are replaced. A small fan is installed, and they move from -139VDC to -190VDC. While reaching behind a bay to trace some cables I hooked myself up across several of the -190VDC version. Damn that hurt

Sadly, even after the upgrade the customers will not see Uverse speeds... at least not in the near future. Regardless how much the fiber can carry the issue is with the system and the software running it.


ILpt4U
Premium
join:2006-11-12
Lisle, IL
kudos:9
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
reply to Jeff35582
»www.fiercetelecom.com/story/atts···13-05-10

From the Network Operatiions President, it looks like there is a FTTC upgrade path in place:

"Outside of Greenfield areas, the service provider passes 1.8 million in the former BellSouth territory with an existing fiber to the curb (FTTC) architecture, a technology that it pioneered in the late 1980s.

"Fiber to the curb technology has gotten long in the tooth so what we're doing there is going into those 1.8 million homes and upgrading them to a combination of a fiber to the home overlay or new version of fiber to the curb," Smith said."


Wired

@bellsouth.net
reply to Jeff35582
I'm in the same boat but I think i'm ready to jump ship. I only wish my other choice was not Comcast.

Loganville, GA


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1
reply to Jeff35582

said by Jeff35582 See Profile
I don't want U-Verse speeds, well I don't expect them anyway.

What do I propose they do?

Does that mean UVERSE is available there. If so there will definately be no upgrades. All new customers MUST take UVERSE where available. No more DSL. If you switch to UVERSE and don't like it no going back to DSL either.
Most places you also can no longer change levels of DSL either, you are were you are until they decide to pull the DSL plug all together.
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Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
UVerse is not available where I am, it is available in many neighborhoods around me. All of the bandwidth that we had has clearly been reallocated to the UVerse side, if that were not the case then our bandwidth would not be continuously degrading as more and more UVerse builds are rolled out.
When I said what you quoted it was a reply to someone that asked "What do you propose they do?" as if I was simply being difficult and unreasonable in wanting my service to not average 128K d/l throughout the afternoon/evening with an average of >10% packet loss in any 24hr period and over 30% from 3PM until 1AM.

I'm not a network engineer, but I am not an idiiot either I've been a network administrator for over 20 years, this is a problem that has been created artificially, the amount of IFITL / DSL customers has actually been lowered and our speeds constantly degrade because they have been taking away far too much of the overall capacity as blocks of that service get converted.

I have had the service since the first damn day it was available, I KNOW how it should be performing.
This is nothing but the scumbag company that is Ma Bell, always has been, always will be, just to be clear that is not a reflection on the techs I understand their hands are tied, but this problem could be 100% resolved by re-allocating some additional bandwidth, no hardware upgrades required, the problem is AT&T will not do it.


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1
Well I yet so see this impact here. DSL has been frozen, no changes, no new.
but pretty much 24/7 I still get my right around 3mps
--


Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
»/testhistory/710463/eedee
»/pingtest/nil?···outh.net

Well imagine that someone in Key West Florida is having a different experience with their AT&T DSL it boggles the mind.

Look I'm not really sure what you are trying to accomplish here you appear to be trolling me, I have a fucking problem with my DSL and it is legit, and I am at my wits end with AT&T and I don't need some shill from a service area not even related saying "Meh, I have no problems".
You can take a look at the the links I provided of my tests as well as line quality tests from many other users, it isn't rocket science.

I have tried every available avenue in getting this resolved with AT&T and I have gotten nothing but cock-blocked at every step. If you want to make a thread praising them for their effort and your great service by all means knock yourself out, I'll stay out if it.

The level of service I and hundreds, perhaps thousands of others are getting is unacceptable and could be resolved simply by reallocating some of the bandwidth that they took away from our service with some of the UVerse builds.


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1
I am not saying you don't have a problem but I don't a solution other than aproaching the Direct forum.

All ex BSo DSL is frozen where UVERSE is availble ar in you cse even near by. and compared to pure DSL IFITL has always been more problematic.

And yes we are miles apart but part of the ex BSo....and this is not a system wide degreee... Just that nothing will be improved DSL is pretty much frozen in time. You say UVERSE is around you... then likely it will soon be there and that is where they are concentrating developement
--


Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
I did go to the Direct forum, they got me in contact with some wonderful people that were some of the most contemptuous that I have ever spoken to.
This is not an issue with IFITL being problematic.
In fact it always was very stable and reliable in my area, but that's not what is up for debate.
DSL is obviously not frozen because they have removed vast amounts of our available bandwidth, because the DSL capacity is obviously much lower than it was 2 years ago, yet our bandwidth has been drastically cut.
You are failing to see the big picture here this situation could instantaneously be resolved by reallocating an appropriate amount of bandwidth. If they can't and won't do that now then the U-verse is going to be grossly oversubscribed as they continue porting more customers to it.

To beat all they continue to sell new service I had a neighbor order it last week, which will further degrade the service. They are willfully and knowingly selling a service that they know is broken, have admitted is broken only to make it even worse than it already is.
If DSL was 'frozen' as you say he would not have been able to order it.


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1

1 edit
Well again not what I am trying to say.

But you have stated Uverse is all arround you just not to you yet. It will likely be soon and where their development efforts are going not DSL.

Unless you can get someone in direct to pull some magic string or get your state PSC to intervine you likely will be stuck with what you have.

And OK there maybe not yet... but I guarantte you the second Uverse is available all DSL sales and service changes but to Unevse will cease.

Sorry that is your situation, and yes I am fortunate me on an island of fixed known geo and pop market size DSL has always been very consistant vs markets where growth is unlimited and not the infrastructure to support it.

Just saying.... unless you can get some strings pulled I see no change until Uverse like soon arrives if all around you.... and you will be ready to jump at... were as me the DSL works fine and have resisted Uverse.... only because they want you to buy everything and the ktchen sink servive and I hate putting all my eggs in one basket where one thig fails EVERTHING does.

Uverse internet service alone is not at all attractive.... and still QOS must be maintained and fixed regulated POTS line.... Uverse basically VOIP again that goes away too. POTS line through many hurricannes has never gone down.... while again unregulated cable down for weeks. Uverse is the same thing not reg QOS regs.... great when it works but no hurry to repair or QOS to maintain.
--



Jon J

join:2000-06-12
Nashville, TN
reply to Jeff35582
I am having frequent download speed problems and have had five extensive conversations with tech support and have not yet been threatened with retaliation as the OP says can happen. Thanks for that information. I'll keep it in mind.

exodeon

join:2013-05-29
Diamondhead, MS
reply to Jeff35582
I called them today requesting service for a house that had their DSL in December, so no installation is necessary. They said they were full and asked if I wanted their worthless dial up. U-Verse isn't available here either, sobmy only choices are to wait or shell out over 200 dollars to start up Cable One which has nothing but awful reviews. Tired of this only game in town stuff.

Diamondhead, MS


weaseled386

join:2008-04-13
Port Orange, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House
·AT&T U-Verse
reply to Jeff35582
The amount of misinformation you spew is epic. FITL is still on the same dedicated 4 DS1's per 96 customers it has been. There is NOTHING shared between the frame relay feeds FITL is on, and the IP backbone Uverse is on. The Alcatel 7330's have a 1G link, and it can easily be upgraded to 10G. Oh, and that is split between a max of 384 customers.

I understand you have an issue, but you're blaming it on the wrong things. You're on an old service. I'm sorry you have to deal with it, but those are the cards you hold until they find it profitable enough to upgrade you.

Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
You seem to know a lot more about the core equipment than me. I'll concede that it is not what is being contested here.
They have obviously did one or more of the following.

over consolidated the IFITL connections in the 7330's
dropped them all down to 1G from 10G.

Whatever the case my connection is DRASTICALLY WORSE than it ever has been. The reason it is bad is because of lack of bandwidth or exceeding the hardwares capacity.

I have had the connection since the very day they offered accounts, it has had it's ups and downs but it has overall been extremely reliable. The only other exception was in Jan-July of 2010 when the EXACT SAME situation arose it was fixed by expanding capacity.
Now I'm pretty damn sure some of the IFITL customers have been upgraded to U-Verse, in any even the number of NEW IFITL/DSL services have not put the level of stress I'm seeing on that network. The ONLY answer here is the capacity of the service that I had has been DRASTICALLY reduced for it to perform at less than ~35% of 1.5Mb for 8hr+ each and every day.

There is no misinformation there.
I have been told by AT&T employees that they know about the issue, they just don't care. They have stated that, it is disgusting but it is what one would expect I guess.

You can be a fanboi all you want and act as if they have not made significant changes that reduce the IFITL capacity of I guess my particular cabinent OR the capacity of the network that feeds them.

I'm not crazy, I'm not an idiot, this problem was created by AT&T cutting corners somewhere and it most certainly related to U-Verse.

dmcbass

join:2012-12-12
Lawrenceville, GA
I spoke with one of my friends in the DSG early this month and was told again that it is a known capacity issue and the RT site on Webb Ginn is due a hardware addition in 3 or 4 months to better disperse the load between switches.
Do I believe that, no not really.
Odd thing is that most of my neighbors have left AT&T and the speeds continue to worsen.
Another thing is that I can no longer record my speed tests on this site, minor irritation.

Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
The speeds continue to worsen because as more people leave and more U-Verse conversion are done the bandwidth that the cabinets that service us is being cut more and more.

You can see that the fanboi telling me I don't know what I am talking about has tucked tail and disappeared.

He acts as if I don't know that my service has been far better ALWAYS regardless of the time of day above 1.5 until recently, except for an extended issue that was resolved in 2010.


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1

1 edit
You just don't get it yet....

Yes they DON'T care where UVERSE is present they want everyone to convert and DSL to just go away.

Your situation just is highly unlikely to change unless you do. DSL is basically frozen as is, with no further development and yes maybe even diverted resources.

Unless you want to go to he local PSC or something to try and force them. Very doubtful ATT will do anything if its a resource and not line issue.

Sorry you are in a dense enough an area its become problematic.
But it is very unlikely since UVERSE came in they have sold any DSL to anyone new.
Heck I am getting more Uverse junk mail than I am from Comcast and even a few knocks on the door....SE ATT just wants DSL to go away.

And remember that little escape clause... consumer DSL is a best effort not guaranteed service.
--


Jeff35582

join:2002-10-25
Snellville, GA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
No, apparently you don't get it.

AT&T has intentionally and willfully lowered the quality of service delivered to IFITL customers. It is unacceptable for the bandwidth to be taken away from us at these levels, the service I get now is 1/7th to 1/10th what I got 3-4 months ago.

The problem I have is AT&T is my only viable option, they know that and since there is no competition for them there is no incentive to do anything about it, and nothing will ever be done about it, EVER with sat and LTE which the bandwidth limitations nullify any viability it has.

This probably is an effort to force DSL into upgrading to U-Verse.
The local PSC has no real leverage over AT&T, they are more for local telco's and utilities. The FCC is a worthless government entity with the people that are in place to handle issue on the take from companies like AT&T so nothing can be accomplished there either, they don't even respond to complaints.

Consumer DSL being best effort and not guaranteed service?

How exactly is it best effort when AT&T is willfully reallocating the bandwidth to a point that they know without a doubt that service will be and has been severely degraded as a result?

If I could get U-Verse I would, I can't and I along with many hundreds, if not thousands of users get crap for service.


Hayward
K A R - 1 2 0 C
Premium
join:2000-07-13
Key West, FL
kudos:1

1 edit
said by Jeff35582:

This probably is an effort to force DSL into upgrading to U-Verse.
The local PSC has no real leverage over AT&T, they are more for local telco's and utilities.

Again there is NO PROBABLY about it, that is their intent.
Unfortunately you are in a dense enough under resourced area to become a problem... hasn't yet here but likely will eventually if they get enough UVERSE customers, but they might pull the plug on DSL all together by then.

Where both exist the resource priority definitely goes to the more bandwidth demanding to keep viable UVERSE

As you have said regulatory stuff is pretty powerlessly deregulated these days.... so its switch or live with it. Even POTS doesn't have the QOS regulations it did just a few years ago... thanks Republicans-Tea Baggers.
--