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Dying in a 'free and informed manner'

In the approach proposed in the PQ's bill, patients must state their intentions in writing, a doctor must agree and a second doctor must confirm that medical aid to die is the only way to end the patient's suffering.

Read more: »www.montrealgazette.com/health/D···W3oti5Lr

how many second doctors will actually agree with the first doctor and how many of these cases would still end up in court..

I have heard that this ruling does not apply if your wearing a turban.

right!....it's just not safe enuff

Legislation like this will never be perfect at the outset, will never please everyone and is liable to remain in flux for decades. I'm curious to see how this all works out. It's an issue that needs to be addressed and needs vigorous public debate.

It's already done here anyhow. This is just a formalization.

I can foresee all kinds of obstacles to the patients. For instance, what about life insurance? No insurer pays out for a suicide. Does this mean that if you are dying a hideous and painful death, even if the government says assisted suicide is OK, you have to stick it thru to the bitter end to make sure your loved ones are taken care of? Or do you end up having to cash it in at a discount just to make sure they don't end up ripping off your heirs?

And what if you are incapable of expressing your desire to die at all at the time? How is a stroke victim going to be able to submit the proper paperwork in writing?

If you are in a coma or paralyzed by a massive stroke does your power of attorney have the right to carry out your final wishes at all? Is it possible to specify in advance that you wish to end your life in the event that you are not capable of doing so yourself at the final moment? Or do we have to rely on the barbaric old tried and true removal of the feeding tube and slow starvation to meet our makers in these cases?

the curious thing about this is if this passes, then it won't be a crime in Quebec, but under Federal law it will be a crime. So, will that affect things?

No..Quebec does not recognize Canadian Federal laws.
Remember they think they are their own country.

Re: Dying in a 'free and informed manner'

yes, I know, but regardless of them not recognizing Canadian law, the Feds could conceivably charge someone with murder. The Feds have never had the balls to go against Quebec, but perhaps one day they will, so the question becomes:

What if you are a dr. and perform euthanisa on a patient, then you travel for whatever reason to another province in Canada. It's possible, once in say Ontario, you could be arrested for a crime since it is not legal in Canada? Admittedly, that's not likely, but I think a possible scenario. Aren't criminal prosecutions under Federal jurisdiction and not provincial?

that's exactly what I'm trying to point out.

Actually, it wouldn't be.

»laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts···tml#h-77

Except for the fact it's an unlawful act as defined by Section 241 of the Criminal Code:

Precisely.

I personally believe the real reason behind this new legislation is to provide another opportunity for the PQ government in Quebec to fight the Federal government. Pauline Marois' election platform was pretty clear that she and her party would take every opportunity to battle the Feds on whatever issues they could find. This would clearly be one of those cases if the legislation passes.

I also feel it is quite doubtful that any doctor would assist in a suicide, at least a documented assisted suicide since legally, they could still be arrested and charged with a criminal offence as outlined in section 241 of the criminal code of Canada.

Bill 52 has broad tripartisan support. Both the liberals and pq are working on it together. For once, this bill has nothing to do with quebec-vs-roc and everything to do with bringing law in line with what society feels is just.
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that's a fine line. You can't define euthanasia as not being murder and not being suicide (assisted). It has to be one or the other. Regardless of what you call it, euthanasia currently does not have an exception of being legal in Canada, so regardless of what she's said, it is considered illegal for the time being and anyone performing it can be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Anything pertaining to the criminal code cannot be exempted by provincial law.

I'm willing to bet you're wrong on that. We shall have to wait and see if Bill 52 passes in the end and whether there will be a conflict between QC and Feds. I will say this, the PQ government has been establishing a pattern of setting up conflicts with the Federal goverment, so this fits its MO.

Perhaps the PQ does want a fight about it, but the fact that all the other parties are backing them up on it indicates that the PQ's desire for fights with the feds isn't the only thing driving this bill. It seems that Quebeckers genuinely want this bill.

The process of this getting put into a bill started in 2009 when a PQ MNA proposed a special commission to look into it. Jean Charest agreed with the PQ MNA (the same one behind Bill 52), and the committee (consisting of members from all parties) spent time travelling around Quebec and interviewing Quebeckers. At the end of it, they unanimously recommended moving forward with this.

This isn't just something that popped up out of the woodwork, this is a process that started under a federalist liberal government, that involved all the parties, and is now entering the final stages. Whatever the PQ might want in the sovereignty debate, the overall process really does seem to be non-political.
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I find it strange that they would allow two people, who potentially don't know you, to decide whether or not you can kill yourself. Hopefully one of them is a psychiatrist, and they consult with people who actually know you.

ok...so let's say the law is passed and implemented....then what happens in a case like this, does she go to quebec and die, or she still has to go to switzerland?
can you explain pls?...

»Winnipeg woman seeks help to die in Europe

Quebec couple travelled to Switzerland so husband could die

»www.cbc.ca/news/health/story/201···bec.html

The Criminal Code of Canada is Federal. Provincial law (AFAIK) does not trump the CCC. This seems a lot like the US States that legalized marijuana but where US Federal Law still applies. I think that the Supreme Court will eventually decide this question and if was any other Province than Quebec, I think I could easily predict the answer.

Well, it looks like it's not clear if it's in violation of the the criminal code to begin with, and then there's the question of what exceptions health care apply to the code anyhow.

I mean, if a patient has a very serious illness, and a doctor performs a risky procedure that's the patient's best shot, and the patient dies, we don't prosecute the doctor for murder. There has to be some common sense here.

I don't get what the big deal is anyhow. The law is supposed to be a reflection of a society's values, and if we as a society agree in the majority that the existing law no longer reflects our values, why should we not seek to change it?

As far as I can tell, bill 52 is not very controversial, there's pretty broad support for it. I don't get why people are making it into a "quebec wants to do their own thing" and not a "province tries to pass progressive civil rights bill".
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