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PToN
Premium
join:2001-10-04
Houston, TX

Migration Time..!! Office365 / Google Apps

Hello, Hello,

So.... Although our current email system is working without any problems or issues, my boss (because of consultants) wants me to look at having a hosted email server solution. Other than adding calendar sharing to what we have, i see no other benefits (other than me not having to worry about it, which is not bad though).

Anyways....

We are currently into a freshly renewed VLA with MS so we have literally 3 years before it expires, i am sure that there may be a way for us to get out of this if we commit to Office 365 for the same amount of time..? Dunno, something i ll have to negotiate.

- Is anyone using Office 365 or Google Apps for business? Care to comment on your experience...?
- Does Exchange support threaded email conversations?
- Is this a full version of Lync?
- Does 365 come with a full Sharepoint or what it would be the foundation version.??

If we are able to get the VLA transferred as an Office 365 deal thingy, i can see the greater value as we can have desktop clients of Office apps, however, if this is not possible, why would i chose 365 vs Google?

Thanks for any comments.


Badger3k
We Don't Need No Stinkin Badgers
Premium
join:2001-09-27
Franklin, OH
I just had to look at this for a client that is probably way smaller than you. This link has a couple spreadsheets that go into a whole lot of detail on the differences. »www.techrepublic.com/blog/datace···res/5516

I'm pretty sure Lync Online can do everything Lync On-Prem can, as long as you have the right plan from Microsoft. I believe Sharepoint Online has more features/functionality than Foundation, however there are somethings you just can't do/have access too because of the shared platform. Mail enabling a document library is one such thing that is missing.
--
Team Discovery: Project Hope

Oedipus

join:2005-05-09
kudos:1
reply to PToN
1. We use Office365 resold via AppRiver. Some of our users use POP in their Outlook and we've learned quite a bit about how POP and Exchange interact with each other. Stability has been good as long as it's Exchange across the board. Throwing POP in the mix has resulted in fairly poor reliability. I much prefer Appriver's native Exchange product.

2. Yes, at least with Outlook 2013.

3. I don't know. We don't use Lync at all.

4. Same as above. We're banging rocks and clubs together over here.

lorennerol
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Seattle, WA
reply to PToN
Microsoft's support for Office 365 and hosted Exchange is abysmal. There is virtually no accurate/complete documentation, and my experience was that it took hours of direct work over days or weeks to get cases escalated to someone who had the expertise to solve the problem and whom I could understand. Before that it was a WHOLE lot of:

"Have you rebooted?" (PC, Outlook, router, whatever they could think of).

"I send you a link". These invariably pointed to some informal IT support forum with ideas (not solutions) of things to try from anonymous people.

"I send you script". This would be a Powershell command on which I could find no documentation anywhere.

We did the migration for the client on a fixed-cost basis. Once it was done I told them they any support for it is billed at real time, including the time required to wade through Microsoft's unthinkably bad support system.

I wouldn't recommend MS' hosted platform to anyone and any other clients who insist on using it will have to pay for every second it takes us to deal with MS.

ke4pym
Premium
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC
Reviews:
·Northland Cable ..
·Time Warner Cable
·ooma
·VOIPO
·Verizon Broadban..
reply to PToN
We just signed a contract to push 60k users to Office365.

Sharepoint is not as feature complete as the self hosted option.

Lync loses a lot of functionality (such as PBX integration) as well.

Now, you can run in a hybrid mode. Which, for Lync and Exchange, we're going to have to do (we can't afford to lose our SMTP gateway). So, in hybrid mode you get to keep PBX integration and SMTP.

For the record, in June, there were 19 outages of Office365.

We're not looking forward to it.

lorennerol
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Seattle, WA
said by ke4pym:

For the record, in June, there were 19 outages of Office365.

If you talk to anyone inside MS it becomes quite apparent that running systems is NOT a core competency there, and since they struggle to run their own infrastructure, it seems unlikely (and your stats agree) that they could do any better with their hosting infrastructure.


osumba2001

join:2000-12-11
New Albany, OH
reply to ke4pym
Is this documented anywhere (the June outages)?


Badger3k
We Don't Need No Stinkin Badgers
Premium
join:2001-09-27
Franklin, OH
said by osumba2001:

Is this documented anywhere (the June outages)?

They keep track in the portal and also post incident reports after each outage. I show 9 Exchange Online, 4 Sharepoint Online, 4 Lync Online, the 3 others related to the portal or subscriptions. I can only recall maybe 1 or 2 of those causing any issues with clients.
--
Team Discovery: Project Hope


osumba2001

join:2000-12-11
New Albany, OH
Duh, thanks.

I just logged into our 30 day trial portal (»portal.microsoftonline.com) and see them in there. Some data truncated due to screen resolution.

»i.imgur.com/0bcqHvR.jpg


MineCoast
Premium
join:2004-10-06
127.0.0.1
reply to Oedipus
said by Oedipus:

1. We use Office365 resold via AppRiver. Some of our users use POP in their Outlook and we've learned quite a bit about how POP and Exchange interact with each other. Stability has been good as long as it's Exchange across the board. Throwing POP in the mix has resulted in fairly poor reliability. I much prefer Appriver's native Exchange product.

2. Yes, at least with Outlook 2013.

3. I don't know. We don't use Lync at all.

4. Same as above. We're banging rocks and clubs together over here.

I'll also 2nd AppRiver, even O365 through them. I not only say this because I have been working for AppRiver for years now, but because I truly believe in their product, so much so that I've moved my personal e-mail as well as most of my family over to AppRiver instead of Yahoo, gMail, Hotmail, etc.

Oedipus

join:2005-05-09
kudos:1
reply to osumba2001
said by osumba2001:

Duh, thanks.

I just logged into our 30 day trial portal (»portal.microsoftonline.com) and see them in there. Some data truncated due to screen resolution.

»i.imgur.com/0bcqHvR.jpg

Fun fact: EX3214 was posted at least in part because of yours truly.


PToN
Premium
join:2001-10-04
Houston, TX
reply to PToN
Wow, thanks for the replies..

It seems it is mostly a nightmare... I ll have to do so more reading and seek user feedback on different environments.

Thanks, this is very helpful.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·ooma
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com
reply to PToN
- Is anyone using Office 365 or Google Apps for business? Care to comment on your experience...?

We currently use Office 365 here at my workplace. About 200 mailboxes all in the cloud and working great. Our entire enterprise is going to be moving to Office 365 in the next couple years, but we were the first core to move last year.

I know many small businesses that run Google Apps for business and that works flawlessly as well.

- Does Exchange support threaded email conversations?

Yes it does.

- Is this a full version of Lync?

Lync Online is an additional addon to Office 365. We have a Lync server local and it works great with Office 365.

- Does 365 come with a full Sharepoint or what it would be the foundation version.??

Sharepoint is also an addon to Office 365. We have a local install and it integrates well with Office 365, but I am no sharepoint admin.

----

I think the thing to look at when you view a hosted solution is to determine if it is right for you or not. Are you in a storage crunch? Do you have an unsupported email platform? Do you have HIPA or SOX compliance? Any other compliance you have to go with? What about archiving?

So many questions, but for us, Office 365 was the way to go. Its rock solid and works very well. In the last 10 months since migrating, we have had a total of 6 outage situations, with a total of 7 hours that were on Microsoft's end. (Yes, we keep track of the outages). So I don't know where all these June outages took place, but we were not affected by some of them. Either that or they took the systems down after hours.

Sounds like you got all the info you needed. Let me know if you want more information.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net

JoelC707
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL
kudos:5
Click for full size
You don't see all these? I attached a screenshot of my last 30 days service health issues. There were a few other June outages that have been bumped off the list already.


Mellow
Premium
join:2001-11-16
Salisbury, MD
reply to PToN
Not affected me that I can tell, email has been rolling in with no reported issues by my users.

Edit: I am exchange only.

Oedipus

join:2005-05-09
kudos:1
reply to PToN
A full week of POP authentication issues finally drew to a close today. MS finally, finally fixed whatever the issue was.

The only person less thrilled than the client being incessantly asked for their password is the guy who has to listen to them moan.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·ooma
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com
reply to JoelC707
said by JoelC707:

You don't see all these? I attached a screenshot of my last 30 days service health issues. There were a few other June outages that have been bumped off the list already.

I see those, but I can tell you that none of those outages affected us at all. Either those outages were centralized to a specific server farm, connection or something along those lines. In fact, the times that are on those trouble tickets do not coincide with any downtime on our end. So I don't know what to tell you.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


PToN
Premium
join:2001-10-04
Houston, TX
reply to PToN
A lot of my users have iPhones, and iPads and some have Macs. How does Exchange work with Apple products?

JoelC707
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Lanett, AL
kudos:5
There is a version of Office for Macs (2011 I think). For iPhones, they can connect just fine with the stock mail app (and I assume iPad can as well).


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
Reviews:
·ooma
·Comcast
·Callcentric
·Site5.com
reply to PToN
said by PToN:

A lot of my users have iPhones, and iPads and some have Macs. How does Exchange work with Apple products?

Exchange works flawlessly with apple and android products. We have 200+ devices here that work great.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net


JB
Stay Gold
Premium
join:2009-05-14
kudos:1
reply to PToN
said by PToN:

- Is this a full version of Lync?

Yes, it is included with office 2013.

rugby
I think I know it all.
VIP
join:2000-09-26
Plainfield, IN
reply to PToN
If you have to have hosted Exchange, take a look at Intermedia. We migrated a client to O365 and after 4 days of troubleshooting random disconnects and an angry client, we punted and got Intermedia involved to help migrate to their service. Not as cheap, but I get an AMERICAN when I call, and they actually know their stuff. We got daily updates on the migration (270GB of email for 30 users) and I have been really happy with their level of knowledge.

lorennerol
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Seattle, WA
said by Nightfall:

Exchange works flawlessly with apple and android products. We have 200+ devices here that work great.

Except for the interminable three or four months last year when Exchange push inexplicably broke on iOS. Apple and MS took turns pointing fingers at each other. In the end, an iOS update resolved it.

said by rugby:

If you have to have hosted Exchange, take a look at Intermedia. We migrated a client to O365 and after 4 days of troubleshooting random disconnects and an angry client, we punted and got Intermedia involved to help migrate to their service. Not as cheap, but I get an AMERICAN when I call, and they actually know their stuff. We got daily updates on the migration (270GB of email for 30 users) and I have been really happy with their level of knowledge.

Can't second this emphatically enough. Getting an intelligible, competent tech on the phone with Microsoft's offering is offensively and unimaginably difficult.

Oedipus

join:2005-05-09
kudos:1
said by lorennerol:

said by Nightfall:

Exchange works flawlessly with apple and android products. We have 200+ devices here that work great.

Except for the interminable three or four months last year when Exchange push inexplicably broke on iOS. Apple and MS took turns pointing fingers at each other. In the end, an iOS update resolved it.

Not a clue what you're talking about. We had at least a hundred iOS devices running Exchange at that time and we never saw a single issue.


MineCoast
Premium
join:2004-10-06
127.0.0.1
said by Oedipus:

said by lorennerol:

said by Nightfall:

Exchange works flawlessly with apple and android products. We have 200+ devices here that work great.

Except for the interminable three or four months last year when Exchange push inexplicably broke on iOS. Apple and MS took turns pointing fingers at each other. In the end, an iOS update resolved it.

Not a clue what you're talking about. We had at least a hundred iOS devices running Exchange at that time and we never saw a single issue.

It's true. I work at AppRiver and we provide Hosted Exchange and we got slammed with calls and e-mails from clients having issues. The same happened with iOS 4.0 and 4.1 which I personally had problems with on my iPhone. This is one of the many reasons why I ditched the iPhone after using them for 4+ years. At least on Android you have choices such as Touchdown, etc for exchange.

rugby
I think I know it all.
VIP
join:2000-09-26
Plainfield, IN
reply to Oedipus
said by Oedipus:

Not a clue what you're talking about. We had at least a hundred iOS devices running Exchange at that time and we never saw a single issue.

iOS 6.1.1 (or 6.1) caused major traffic and load problems for Exchange servers. There was a bug with the Activesync implementation and it could cause Exchange to actually crash.

lorennerol
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Seattle, WA
reply to Oedipus
said by Oedipus:

Not a clue what you're talking about. We had at least a hundred iOS devices running Exchange at that time and we never saw a single issue.

Exchange 2003 wasn't affected. 2010 was. Can't remember if 2007 was a problem.

Oedipus

join:2005-05-09
kudos:1
We weren't running any 2003 Exchange clients at that time. It was a mix of 2007 and 2010.


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON
reply to PToN
We just switched to Google apps from exchange. I was converted last week. Rather seemless.


Minvaren
Premium
join:2001-07-26
Houston, TX
reply to PToN
The new location I work at has Office 365, apparently due to poor previous Exchange admins.

After a month of battling Powershell cmdlets due to aspects of the management GUI not working, waiting hours to days for Distribution list updates, and the aforementioned service outages, we're going to be exploring other options on or before our next renewal. My personal preference would be to pull Exchange back in-house, but intermedia might be a good alternative, based on the praise for it in this thread.