dslreports logo
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc
Search similar:


uniqs
102005

cellrecycler
@135.0.8.x

cellrecycler to bosephus

Anon

to bosephus

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences? - WORD OF WARNING

Click for full size
Vmedia Internet Plans
Click for full size
Comwave Fair Usage
Click for full size
Rogers Small Business Internet
Word of warning re "Deals" from comwave/vmedia - great if you don't use XBMC, dropbox, google drive, box, any kind of torrents or Netflix I suppose.

My family have been customers of vmedia for a few months for internet services after dealing with crappy service from distributel for a while. Vmedia offers 30/5 "Unlimited" access for about $50/m plus modem rental (unless you buy it which we did for $80 at CanadaComputers - a Vmedia reseller) plus installation of about $65. So far doesn't sound too bad, right?

My family is in the *mostly* silent segment of the pop. that got so fed up with paying to watch the crap they put on TV that you have to pay to watch that we dropped cable/satellite all together and joined the legions of torrent watchers a few years back. The CRTC decision to force Bell/Rogers et al to wholesale broadband internet made it an easy decision to switch to another provider who offered no bandwidth limitations which is how we ended up on Distributel and most recently Vmedia c/o Comwave. (I just hope the CRTC will make a similar decision about forcing Bell/Rogers/Telus/SaskTel/MTS etc to wholesale Cellular waves to MVNOs - Mobile Virtual Network Operators - like Cricket and MetroPCS in the US of A).

Bell upset us as well so we switched our phone to primus and then comwave a few years back... getting the comwave contract ended has been fun as well...

Anyways back to the words of warning - 30/5 is pretty decent but a couple weeks ago we noticed that video streaming through both XBMC/mashup and Netflix has become choppy to the point of being nearly unwatchable. I've tried tech support, switching routers, upgrading WiFi equipment, installing ethernet cables and using internet over the home electrical wiring to try and fix the problem... it finally became apparent today why this has been such an ordeal.

My family and I own a store. We use Rogers broadband for business there which costs about $80/m on a month-to-month deal with 30/5 service and unlimited bandwidth. At work it takes about 10 minutes to download a 5GB file from MSDN (microsoft developers network) over WiFi.

Doing some computer work at home this evening the same file took 4 HOURS to download from MSDN and another 3GB file is saying 12HRS - same file I downloaded in 10 minutes today at work... it would be faster to drive the half hour, burn a DVD, and drive home than wait.

anyways, I did some digging to find out if VMedia is traffic shaping. On their terms of service page I found this:

»www.vmedia.ca/support/po ··· csa.aspx
quote:
11. Service Speed:

Internet Service is provided on a Best Efforts basis. VMedia does not guarantee the speed of any Internet Service. The speed of Internet Services is dependent on various factors, some of which are not under our control, including the distance of the customer from our network equipment or the usage by other customers in that geographic area. As such we do not guarantee the maximum service performance (i.e. throughput or speed). Internet speed may also be affected by traffic management practices that are applied to the service. To learn more about traffic management practices see Internet Traffic Management Policies (ITMP).

Seemed like reasonable standard internet boilerplate crap but the "learn more about traffic management practices see Internet Traffic Management Policies (ITMP)" link intrigued me so I clicked on the link... and arrived at »www.comwave.net/legals/#ITMP - those MoFos we'd been trying to ditch.

A bit of digging on that Comwave link shows:
quote:
Fair Usage Policy:

The Customer acknowledges and agrees that the expression "unlimited usage" used in advertising for Internet Service refers to the time allowed for using the Internet Service based on intermittent use. Abuses of the network with excessive usage as solely determined by Comwave, and after notice from Comwave, may result in either the customer being transferred to one of Comwave's metered usage plans or the suspension or termination of service, in which case the customer remains obligated to pay amounts owed for any remainder of a contract period. In some jurisdictions a customer may cancel pursuant to 2.09 (d). Excessive usage and Abuse is determined by Comwave when a customer exceeds more than 300Gig for two consecutive month, or more than 500Gig in any one month.
300GB sounds ok I guess if you don't own a small business that's connected to other computers, tablets, notebooks, smartphones, etc, that are all connected to file syncing services like Dropbox or GDrive. But if you DO have dropbox or gdrive and have the 100GB or 1TB plan, you're going to blow through your allotment in no time.

Add a conservative 1 to 3 hours of TV viewing per day on ONE TV over the course of a month (30 days) at HD quality (720p) and you're looking at up to 270GB of bandwidth for that 1 TV.
A family of 4 with an online gamer, a TV and someone who streams music or works in any type of online capacity and you're going to fall into the Excessive Usage and Abuse category as defined by Comwave.

I wouldn't be so p-oed by the whole ordeal had I not been tempted to offer VMedia's services to my own customers at my shop. I'm also angry that I recommended them in good faith to friends and family believing that they were somehow different than the competition.

Fair usage is fine - I explain it to my Wind customers all day but as someone who prefers to be up-front, any asterisk beside a word like FREE or UNLIMITED or $0 (pronounced as ZERO DOLLARS, not FREE) is equivalent in my mind to a company excusing itself for not telling you the truth. (Consequently I always tell people that Wind mobile is OK IF X, Y and Z conditions are true and you don't expect to replace your broadband connection with it. 5GB is included but past that you're on dialup)

Rogers, bas*rds that they are, at least have the decency to put asterisks, superscript numbers, and other indicators that they're full of sh*t in the appropriate places on ads. Vmedia doesn't even have the decency to do that.

As a consequence, my family is going to double our spending with Rogers and use the small business internet at home for our home office and offsite backup needs. »www.rogers.com/business/ ··· t/plans/

F-U Comwave/Vmedia... learn to use your ASTERISKS and maybe we'll be back.
GeorgeBurger
join:2011-12-30

GeorgeBurger

Member

Hi Cellrecycler, sorry for your disappointment with our policies, but I assure you they are typical for the industry, as you know. The services we provide are geared to the residential market, and limitations are included in policies, though rarely employed, to avoid abuse by people who overload the capacity with uses that are well beyond what is acceptable for a residential user. In any case, thank you for pointing out the unintended link, I don't know how it got there but it has been removed. We have no connection with Comwave.
daeron
join:2012-05-11
Ottawa

daeron

Member

If you have nothing to do with Comwave and they have nothing to do with you, why are some of your policies (or some of theirs) cut and paste word for word of each other? Share the same lawyer?

WhaleOilBee
What a long strange trip it's been
join:2011-08-02
Manotick, ON

1 edit

WhaleOilBee to LazMan

Member

to LazMan

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences?

I can't imagine VMedia, or any other ISP that offers 'unlimited' internet, would be eager to boot a subscriber for using some extra capacity one month, or even infrequently.

Human nature, being what it is, there would be people who would abuse the unlimited access by doing things like wiring up an apartment building and make a huge profit by charging the tenants for the connection. The ISP is only trying to protect themselves by spelling out 'acceptable use' in the terms of service. Relax.

OTOH, if you're experiencing a slow, choppy connection, then you have a complaint worth investigation.

also... Have you tried Remote Desktop'ing to home during the day and downloading the MSDN file at the same time as when doing it from work? Then, in the evening, do the same in reverse. Comparing a daytime d/l from work to an evening d/l from home is not really a fair side-by-side comparison.
btech805
join:2013-08-01
Canada

btech805 to cellrecycler

Member

to cellrecycler

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences? - WORD OF WARNING

I agree with George on this, every ISP offers fair usage policies for what is considered acceptable for a RESIDENTIAL customer. There is a reason why business plans are more expensive and this is one of the reasons, same with service calls, same day vs. Next day service (for a 1st party customer). Every ISP has the same language in their terms of service, and some even flat out forbid the use of business use over a residential account.
taraf
join:2011-05-07
Ottawa, ON

taraf

Member

When I clicked on the ITMP link in their TOS, it brought me to an anchor within the same page.

If you Googled for it, and found the Comwave site, that's because of the search terms you used, not because the two companies are somehow linked. They aren't. ITMP is a standard term in any ISP's terms of service. That's like saying that Ford and Chrysler are the same company, because you found the word "wheel" on both of their websites.

As for your complaints about the service, you should really consider calling tech support. I have the 25/2 cable at my apartment, and have not experienced any of the problems you say that you have. At this very moment, I'm watching Netflix in super HD, downloading a torrent, and typing on this forum. While I'm aware of the problems in saying "works here" when dealing with technical issues, it really does suggest that the issues you are experiencing aren't endemic to their network or technical competence.
daeron
join:2012-05-11
Ottawa

daeron

Member

I think you are misunderstanding what his complaint around the TOS. There was a link in Vmedia's TOS that pointed to Comwaves TOS . What is interesting is the language around section "Internet Service" is identical on both sites which is why I asked if they used the same lawyer.

From Comwave:
Internet Service is provided on a Best Efforts basis. Comwave does not guarantee the speed of any Internet Service. The speed of Internet Services is dependent on various factors, some of which are not under our control, including the distance of the customer from our network equipment or the usage by other customers in that geographic area. As such we do not guarantee the maximum service performance(i.e. throughput or speed). Internet speed may also be affected by traffic management practices that area applied to the service. To learn more about traffic management practices see Internet Traffic Management Policies (ITMP).
From Vmedia:
Internet Service is provided on a Best Efforts basis. VMedia does not guarantee the speed of any Internet Service. The speed of Internet Services is dependent on various factors, some of which are not under our control, including the distance of the customer from our network equipment or the usage by other customers in that geographic area. As such we do not guarantee the maximum service performance (i.e. throughput or speed). Internet speed may also be affected by traffic management practices that are applied to the service. To learn more about traffic management practices see Paragraph 18. Internet Traffic Management Policies (ITMP).

damir
join:2013-12-12
CANADA

damir

Member

cheaper to copy paste

HenryA
join:2011-05-28

HenryA to LazMan

Member

to LazMan

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences?

I've gotten to the point on this site where I see some anonymous poster like cellrecycler, and I think "now if I could only bag this stuff I could fertilize my entire lawn next spring".

They just happen to "stumble" across this site, post anonymous rants on how terrible Vmedia is...but never really post any other comments. Just a quick little load of horse shite dumped on a corner, thank see ya.

As always. I call bs on these posts. It's a posting by competing ISP's who are pissed that vmedia deliver great service for a cheaper price. Plain and simple.

Vmedia traffic shapes...and vampires are real. No..really. Stop laughing...They are. I'm not kidding. It's true. Because it's posted on the intertubes

....funny how us long time users of vmedia have never noticed any traffic shaping. I've noticed some random congestion from time to time..just like I would on any ISP's network. Because it's backboned on Rogers...but that must be vmedia's fault as well right? Crazy huh?...

elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium Member
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in

elwoodblues to damir

Premium Member

to damir

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences? - WORD OF WARNING

said by damir:

cheaper to copy paste

Probably still charged an arm and leg for that.
PHLN
join:2003-07-31

PHLN to HenryA

Member

to HenryA

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences?

said by HenryA:

I've gotten to the point on this site where I see some anonymous poster like cellrecycler, and I think "now if I could only bag this stuff I could fertilize my entire lawn next spring".

They just happen to "stumble" across this site, post anonymous rants on how terrible Vmedia is...but never really post any other comments. Just a quick little load of horse shite dumped on a corner, thank see ya.

As always. I call bs on these posts. It's a posting by competing ISP's who are pissed that vmedia deliver great service for a cheaper price. Plain and simple.

Vmedia traffic shapes...and vampires are real. No..really. Stop laughing...They are. I'm not kidding. It's true. Because it's posted on the intertubes

....funny how us long time users of vmedia have never noticed any traffic shaping. I've noticed some random congestion from time to time..just like I would on any ISP's network. Because it's backboned on Rogers...but that must be vmedia's fault as well right? Crazy huh?...

Ok, how about feedback from a member that been on DSLreports for 12 years?

I have been with Vmedia since May 2013 in their Cogeco region. The service works great when there is no technical issues need to be requested. Anytime when you need technical assistance, due to Vmedia position as a 3rd party provider, I always get the absolute worse service.

I understand why certain customers are unable to separate issues that is out of Vmedia control hands. It doesn't matter to most since ultimately, only Vmedia can talk to Cogeco and get it resolved. When I call into Cogeco they just rejected me for obvious reason.

Just recently in the summer, I had over 20+ days of outage. Currently, I am stuck in trying to upgrade to 55 Mbps package. I sent in my request on August 11 for September 1st. I just called Vmedia this morning and they said Cogeco isn't responding to their request and to call Vmedia back in a week or so. If I were a customer of Cogeco, it would have been done and over with already.

Proof:



Not only that, I been getting unstable speed throughout the day ever since my outage started. I'm pretty sure that the last technician who patched up the line didn't do a proper job and now it is back to being trouble again.

Speedtest: I'm suppose to be getting 20 down and 10 up.




With this type of situation, I don't blame other users from running away from 3rd party and back to 1st party's arms, especially now that they all offer unlimited bandwidth. You pay a bit extra for priority support, that is how I see it anyway.

HenryA
join:2011-05-28

HenryA

Member

So blame Cogeco. Reads like they have shitty service.

damir
join:2013-12-12
CANADA

damir

Member

LOL!
PHLN
join:2003-07-31

PHLN to HenryA

Member

to HenryA
said by HenryA:

So blame Cogeco. Reads like they have shitty service.

I did blame Cogeco. But ultimately who am I giving my money every month to? As mentioned in my post, not every customers can identify the problem and this is why I completely sympathize with those frustrated consumers. The middleman obviously going to take all the blame considering he is the one directly dealing with the customer.
dallas1
join:2014-04-16
Oshawa

dallas1

Member

»www.start.ca/services/highspeed I get full speed 150/10 the 15 is not at my house yet

WhaleOilBee
What a long strange trip it's been
join:2011-08-02
Manotick, ON

WhaleOilBee to PHLN

Member

to PHLN
said by PHLN:

With this type of situation, I don't blame other users from running away from 3rd party and back to 1st party's arms, especially now that they all offer unlimited bandwidth. You pay a bit extra for priority support, that is how I see it anyway.

For less than the amount that I would pay Rogers for unlimited 30/5 internet, I can also get TV included from VMedia...

Rogers 30/5 $61.99 + $25 unl = $86.99
Vmedia 30/5 $49.95 + Basic TV $24.95 = $74.90

Even with the VMedia Premium TV @ $39.95, the package cost is just ~$3 more than Rogers Internet alone.

Given that, and the fact that I've never had chronic cable internet problems with Rogers, Teksavvy, Acanac, or VMedia, I'll not be running back to Rogers arms anytime soon. This may not be the case for everyone, but if you're fortunate to have a stable cable connection, the choice is pretty easy.
PHLN
join:2003-07-31

1 recommendation

PHLN

Member

said by WhaleOilBee:

This may not be the case for everyone, but if you're fortunate to have a stable cable connection, the choice is pretty easy.

I agree.

Maybe the alternative is to first sign up with a 1st party. Make sure the line is good then switch over to 3rd party? That way, you get priority support that you need to get the line stable before setting on a price you can endure.
shannoncc98
join:2012-03-23

shannoncc98 to GeorgeBurger

Member

to GeorgeBurger

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences? - WORD OF WARNING

Hi George. Just wondering, I saw an earlier post that said that over 300 gb 2 months in a row or over 500 gb in a month will be considered abuse.

Does the IPtv traffic count in this or just the normal internet usage? I was considering switching from Bell Fibe to Vmedia internet and tv, but if I have to limit tv watching to stay below that limit I don't see the point of buying 3 Vboxes, a modem, and paying an install fee if I'm going to be disconnected for abuse for using too much bandwidth on an 'unlimited' service. Could you please clarify this? Thanks.
GeorgeBurger
join:2011-12-30

GeorgeBurger

Member

Hi shannoncc98, I am very happy you are considering joining VMedia, but puzzled by your reference to 300 or 500GB limits on usage. Can you tell me where you got the impression VMedia imposes that?

TypeS
join:2012-12-17
London, ON

TypeS

Member

I think they're confusing the the rage post that compared VMedia to Comwave. Probably should be separated into another thread, its a long and confusing post.

Joe2184
@184.151.190.x

Joe2184 to GeorgeBurger

Anon

to GeorgeBurger
I'm really looking into this and ready today to pull the trigger - I have fibe available but I'm a rogers customer. My Internet with rogers is all over the place - so will fibe be more stable? I rather pay more for realibility - but hate using bell / rogers. So looking for stable and reliable.

nekkidtruth
YISMM
Premium Member
join:2002-05-20
London, ON
Netgear R7000
Asus RT-N66
Hitron CODA-4582

nekkidtruth

Premium Member

said by Joe2184 :

I'm really looking into this and ready today to pull the trigger - I have fibe available but I'm a rogers customer. My Internet with rogers is all over the place - so will fibe be more stable? I rather pay more for realibility - but hate using bell / rogers. So looking for stable and reliable.

If you have Rogers and your connection is having issues, any cable TPIA will suffer the same.

Fibe TV is currently only available to FTTN or FTTH customers. Whether it's more stable or not entirely depends on how well your area is set up. FTTN/FTTH is only available to Bell and not to third party ISP's. So you would have to go to Bell directly to get that connection.

Joe17474
@184.151.190.x

Joe17474

Anon

So if I went with Vmedia's DSL option... Would that perform better then cable?

nekkidtruth
YISMM
Premium Member
join:2002-05-20
London, ON
Netgear R7000
Asus RT-N66
Hitron CODA-4582

nekkidtruth

Premium Member

That entirely depends on your area. Is Fibe TV available to you? Fibe Internet packages are not the same thing. Fibe TV requires FTTN/FTTH which practically eliminates DSL's biggest issue, distance.

If you don't have FTTN, it's totally hit or miss with DSL services. For instance, in my area I can only receive 1.5Mbps with DSL but 150Mbps with cable.

Twist90232
@130.113.126.x

Twist90232 to Joe2184

Anon

to Joe2184
said by Joe2184 :

I'm really looking into this and ready today to pull the trigger - I have fibe available but I'm a rogers customer. My Internet with rogers is all over the place - so will fibe be more stable? I rather pay more for realibility - but hate using bell / rogers. So looking for stable and reliable.

If you are having connectivity issues relating to the infrastructure, do not switch to Vmedia. Vmedia does not own the line and Rogers/Bell forbid them from ever touching it. Get Rogers to rectify the issue before moving over. If Rogers are unable to do this, then move to Bell. Confirm that you are satisfy with the connectivity and then do a change over to Vmedia.
PHLN
join:2003-07-31

1 edit

PHLN to LazMan

Member

to LazMan

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences?

I just want to give an update on my situation. With the assistance of George Burger, Cogeco finally completed the task they were assigned to do. I am now official on the 55 Mbps plan.




Spectacular value considering it is only $60. If you were to go with Teksavvy it would be $99.95 for unlimited (even the cheapest option is at $67) and if you go with Cogeco it would be $103.99.

Those that are having issues, please understand that Vmedia is trying their best to make you a happy customer. However, the incumbents are trying their hardest to taint Vmedia's reputation by delaying work orders.

damir
join:2013-12-12
CANADA

damir

Member

you should really change the image and remove your ip.
PHLN
join:2003-07-31

PHLN

Member

said by damir:

you should really change the image and remove your ip.

Thanks.

damir
join:2013-12-12
CANADA

damir

Member

No problem man, good luck with ur connection.
jdrom
join:2008-03-02
East York, ON

jdrom to nekkidtruth

Member

to nekkidtruth

Re: VMedia - Real-World experiences? - WORD OF WARNING

said by nekkidtruth:

FTTN/FTTH is only available to Bell and not to third party ISP's.

Slightly inaccurate... FTTH (Fiber To The Home) is only available to Bell. FTTN (Fiber To The Node) is available to everyone. That's what the 25/10 and 50/10 packages are with VMedia and other IISPs. Also FTTN definitely still has distance limitations as the last mile is still the good ol' copper wires.

As far as I know, VMedia (or maybe CikTel?) is still the one providing you access to the actual Internet. Bell/Rogers lines merely get your home connected to VMedia's network. Generally I've found VMedia to load pages slower than TekSavvy, perhaps it's related to their network management and their upstream providers/peering. I have 50/10 VDSL with VMedia and 45/4 rCable with TekSavvy. Maybe the difference in network technologies contributes to this as well. Speed Test yields full bandwidth, so it's not that.

I've been with VMedia for about 4 months now and have been through numerous ups-and-downs. They had a month-long issue with routing connections between Bell and themselves which was painful as it caused the connection speed to drop all the way down to an unusable ~100Kbps at peak times. Even just this past week I was suffering from slower than normal speeds (15-25Mbps) with some packet loss that was chalked up to "congestion". There was some network maintenance this weekend though and more servers were added to their IPTV pool, so hopefully things return back to normal. So far it has.

I had a review thread going on here, but since it's been locked, I will say that my original conclusion remains the same. TV quality still isn't quite up to where I'd like it to be. Any fast motion or flashing lights results in a lot of pixellation making it challenging to distinguish faces or details. It sounds like VMedia plans to fix this eventually by switching to H.265 instead, but who knows what sort of time frame that is. It also seems to have to do with their source feeds coming over compressed 10Mbps satellite for a lot of channels, which it sounds like they're looking to resolve as well.

It seems like they're doing their best to improve upon the service while trying to cope with, what I imagine to be, exponential growth. Every company goes through growing pains, TekSavvy had similar issues too that I've been through, but I still feel I might have jumped on the IPTV bandwagon a bit too soon (even though I held out for nearly a year since finding out about VM).

All that being said, I've still suggested VMedia to others, with similar words of caution. It's still an amazing value, much more so than their direct competitor.