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KPaul

join:2007-02-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed

[Cable] Welp, my first TSI rant - looking for help

So the new ATPIA speeds kicked in and low and behold, issues. I wasn't expecting smooth, but I wasn't expecting the phone call I got this morning either... (will get to that)

I started having very erratic speeds, both up and down, but mostly down, on the 45/4 profile. On 28/1, it was going perfectly. I mean, straight perfect. I posted in the forums (direct) and was told they would look into things, but in the mean time I needed to reset my modem, and follow all the generic steps. No problem, done. Then called in because it became unusable at points, either through my router or directly to the modem. They asked me the questions top to bottom of the list below, which I answered fully. Then at the end of the call, they ask that I email them everything again (so now this is the second time I am doing it) of the exact information I just went though with them...

I then was told to wait til they call me back. I got that call this morning, saying that because my firmware is older, rogers wont help me "troubleshoot" until it's updated. WTF. So the TSI person says either I go to Toronto to get someone from the forums to update it, or I buy a new modem?

This is blatant shit service. I call shenanigans on having to buy yet ANOTHER "new" modem for a speed upgrade, even though my 6121 is perfectly capable of the 45/4 (though someone in TSI or rogers land doesn't think so, or is incapable of providing.

What options aside from those two do I have here? I won't go on a "proud user for blah blah years" sell, but this isn't right.

Dear K

an effort to get the issue resolved, can you please complete some troubleshooting with us?

Please note we need this information gathered and testing done while your service is experiencing difficulties. If your issue is an intermittent one, please complete this during a time when there is an issue with the service.

If you are not comfortable completing these steps, please do not hesitate to give us a call at 1-877-357-2889. Our technical support agents would be happy to walk you through this over the phone.

• Please hook your computer up directly to the modem with an Ethernet cord, effectively bypassing any routers or other equipment
• Unplug power to the modem for at least three minutes, and then plug it back in
• Navigate to the webpage: www.speedtest.net and click on “Begin Test”

Please record your results:
• Ping:
• Download:
• Upload:

Second speed test: We also require speed test results from a secondary test. Please navigate to www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/ and select a city closest to you from the "Choose A Location" area. Please record the results:
• Download:
• Upload:

If this resolves your speed problem, it is likely that the router was the cause, or another computer on your network was using bandwidth. The internet appears to be working properly. However, if your speeds are still slow, please continue troubleshooting.

The next thing we need is your IP Address information. This can be obtained from:
Windows: Start > All Programs > Accessories > Command Prompt > “ipconfig /all”
MAC: Apple Button > System Preferences > Network > Ethernet

Please include as much of the following as you have available:
• Physical Address -
• Dhcp Enabled -
• Autoconfiguration Enabled -
• IP Address -
• Subnet Mask-
• Default Gateway (called “Router” on MAC)-
• DHCP Server -
• DNS Servers -
• Primary -
• Secondary -
• Lease Obtained-
• Lease Expires -

We will need the power levels from your modem. To get them, please follow these instructions:
• Hook a computer directly to the modem with an Ethernet cord, bypassing any routers or other devices
• Open a web browser on the computer and enter 192.168.100.1 in the address bar and hit enter
• Click on “Diagnostics” or “Signal”
• Please copy and paste all text on this screen, we cannot use a "screen shot" as our system will not allow attachments.

For your information, ideal power levels are as follows:
• Downstream/Forward Path Power Level: -11 to +11dbmv
• Upstream/Return Path Power Level: 35 to 52dbmv
• SNR/Signal to Noise Ratio: above 32db

• Are your DNS servers set to obtain automatically?

Windows: this is found in Network Connections, by right clicking on Local Area Network and selecting "properties". Then, select IPv4 and click Properties.

MAC: Apple button > System Preferences > Network > Ethernet > Advanced > DNS
• Factory reset the modem?

Thomson/RCA: Hold pinhole reset button for 10 seconds.

Motorola: In the modem page at 192.168.100.1, Click on “Diagnostics”, then click “Reset All Defaults”, ;; followed by “Restart Cable Modem”
• Disable your firewall?
• Windows: restart in safe mode?
• Try another computer?

The following steps will involve ping and trace route tests.

How to Ping (50 times) and Trace Route:

(replace "google.ca" with the desired target)
Windows: Start > All Programs > Accessories > Command Prompt
Type: ping google.ca -n 50 (press enter)

Type: tracert google.ca (press enter)
MAC: Go > Utilities > Network Utility
Ping tab > Enter google.ca > Set ping number to 50 > Click "Ping"

Trace Route tab > Enter google.ca > Click "Trace"

• Ping google.ca 50 times - Please paste results
• Ping voip.teksavvy.com 50 times - Please paste results
• Ping [Default Gateway -Windows- or Router -Mac- address from IP info above] 50 times - Please paste results
• Trace Route to [Default Gateway -Windows- or Router -Mac- address from IP info above] - Please paste results
• Trace Route to google.ca - Please paste results
• Trace Route to voip.teksavvy.com - Please paste results

Thanks for choosing TekSavvy and please don't hesitate to email us back or give us a call at the number below if you have any further questions!

Justin
Online Services Team
Teksavvy Solutions Inc
TOLL FREE: 1-877-779-1575
»teksavvy.com
--
I hate rogers and their CRAP tech. support... But, MAJOR kudos to the TekSavvy team!


tommyv2

join:2007-06-03
London, ON

Holy crap that's a lot of trouble to put up with. I remember when I called in for a downed connection (someone put a shovel through the cable down the road) and I had to do this whole song and dance to prove that my connection was actually down, as if having no sync light isn't telling enough on top of being an expert-level user that can easily read modem config pages before they're told they even exist.

Why did you get the 6121 instead of the 6120 in the first place, just because?



KPaul

join:2007-02-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed
reply to KPaul

I was told it would help future proof, so that's what I sought out. I am gonna actually ask for this tread to be locked for the time being, I need to keep trouble shooting on my end as I feel that's all I can really do at this point.
--
I hate rogers and their CRAP tech. support... But, MAJOR kudos to the TekSavvy team!



KPaul

join:2007-02-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed

1 edit
reply to KPaul

Two speeds directly when connected to my modem.




--
I hate rogers and their CRAP tech. support... But, MAJOR kudos to the TekSavvy team!


jibby

join:2008-03-31
reply to KPaul

This firmware BS from Rogers is silly. Another hoop for TPIA providers to jump through to make them look inferior to Rogers own offerings. They have to have the ability to push out the firmware updates, they've done it in the past.



Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1
reply to KPaul

MAC and Mac mean different things. Certainly when it comes to networks.

50 dkp minus to the copy / paste script



jmck
formerly 'shaded'

join:2010-10-02
Ottawa, ON
reply to KPaul

when did you buy this modem from TSI? or did you buy it yourself?



KPaul

join:2007-02-08

Don't remember to be perfectly honest. Assume not through TSI, as the firmware is off.
--
Damn APTIA...



TSI JoeC
Premium
join:2013-07-29
Chatham, ON
kudos:1
reply to KPaul

Hey guys!

KPaul, I have left you a post in your thread on »TekSavvy Direct . Let us know what you would like to do and we can go from there!

Regards,
TSI Joe



TSI Andre
Got TekSavvy?
Premium,VIP
join:2008-06-03
Chatham, ON
kudos:24

Did you buy the modem from us?


Fervid

join:2013-02-20

1 edit
reply to KPaul

[delete me]


Arcturus

join:2008-04-18
London, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
reply to KPaul

I changed my mind, Teksavvy can take their time in upgrading me

As I sit in London, on the 28/1 with a order to upgrade to 45/4.

I'm on a 6120, once my package upgrades I'll do the full round of testing and we can compare at least.


TheTommyD

join:2011-03-24
Ottawa, ON
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
reply to KPaul

How is it you go out and get a Modem with the wrong firmware and then say Teksavvy has "Shit Service" when you get caught?? There's dozens and dozens of previous posts, in multiple forums, from people who thought they'd save a buck by buying modems elsewhere. Rogers and Teksavvy clearly state/stated 1.0.6.1.

It looks like your only option is to get one of the guys to update it for you, or buy an approved modem with the correct firmware.



KPaul

join:2007-02-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed

If you read, I don't remember where I bought it from... It may have been teksavvy. Quite likely actually, but that was a long while ago. And in that long while, service has been perfect on 28/1, so this is why I am annoyed that there is NOW an issue with the firmware. I have used support in the past with this, I guess, firmware, and no problem.

And as for my "only option", those are the two options I am only exploring really, given I understand what is going on. Thanks for the lack of constructive opinion, but I can do without it.

Andre, I am not entirely sure. I have a strong suspicion I did, but again, I can't really remember, nor find paper work for it. I don't want to say I did and demand a fix. I would rather play it safe, and say I don't know, and find someone to update the firmware to get help.
--
Damn APTIA...



TypeS

join:2012-12-17
London, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable

Maybe TSI tracks the sale of modems by S/N and/or HFC MAC? If they do they could use the S/N and MAC you provided to see you purchased it from them or not.

@Teddy Boom

How difficult is the process of upgrading the firmware? I realize its not at all like upgrading the firmware on my router but I did stake computer engineering in highschool years ago, working with circuit boards, etc.



mackey

join:2007-08-20
kudos:6

said by TypeS:

How difficult is the process of upgrading the firmware? I realize its not at all like upgrading the firmware on my router but I did stake computer engineering in highschool years ago, working with circuit boards, etc.

The DOCSIS standard expressly prohibits allowing end users to update the firmware. All updates MUST come from the CMTS.

/M


KPaul

join:2007-02-08
reply to KPaul

I'm heading to Toronto on Wednesday to get this fixed with the firmware. Anyone that wants me to take their modems, I'll do it for the $10 for the cost, plus $5 in gas.
--
Damn APTIA...



TwiztedZero
Nine Zero Burp Nine Six
Premium
join:2011-03-31
Toronto, ON
kudos:5
reply to mackey

said by mackey:

The DOCSIS standard expressly prohibits allowing end users to update the firmware. All updates MUST come from the CMTS.

Docsis standards say no such thing. Its the incumbent that own the last mile that insist on this or that modem type and this or that firmware build; and their forced shut out of TPIA providers in regards to modem firmware updates is something they sliped into the CRTC tariffs to effect this stranglehold purposefully. (supposedly to protect the health of the incumbent network)

Entirely unethical. Its a dirty play to invigle users back to their own service. In other words deliberate sabotage.

We shouldn't have to be hostages.

Now if we were allowed to use any modem that adhered to the Docsis 3.0 specifications (standards) set out by CableLabs irregardless of vendor or unit model. This might not be too much of an issue. As long as the firmware build from the TFTP or other method plays nice. MSO's don't want customers to have access or to be able to update their own bought and paid for modems on their own as it if was a router.

The incumbents don't want it that way they need to assert their control of the last mile at any cost and to hell with consumers. They don't care about you, they only care about control of their network and their bottom line, their greedy shareholders demand it.


TypeS

join:2012-12-17
London, ON
kudos:1
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
reply to mackey

said by mackey:

said by TypeS:

How difficult is the process of upgrading the firmware? I realize its not at all like upgrading the firmware on my router but I did stake computer engineering in highschool years ago, working with circuit boards, etc.

The DOCSIS standard expressly prohibits allowing end users to update the firmware. All updates MUST come from the CMTS.

/M

Um, if you read my post you saw that I already know that as I said its not like upgrading the firmware from a router. That said, it's not impossible, it's just not an action allowed by the manufacturer.


TwiztedZero
Nine Zero Burp Nine Six
Premium
join:2011-03-31
Toronto, ON
kudos:5

said by TypeS:

it's just not an action allowed by the manufacturer.

No its an action not wanted by the MSO network, not the manufacturer. Its a system of control because they have to look after the "health of their HFC network". Though I'm not sure thats quite so true anymore with Docsis 3.0 Standardized by CableLabs - Its just another anticompetive ecosystem the incumbent MSO's use to keep ahead of their competition.

Its a lot like the "wireless" spectrum fiasco regarding competition in some respects.
--

!- From the mind located in the shadows of infinity -!
Nine.Zero.Burp.Nine.Six
Twitter = @TwiztedZero
Chat = irc.teksavvy.ca
Expand your moderator at work


KPaul

join:2007-02-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed
reply to KPaul

Re: [Cable] Welp, my first TSI rant - looking for help

Click for full size
With 1.0.5.1 firmware
Click for full size
With 1.0.6.1 firmware
Went to Toronto today for the sole reason to update my firmware... Here's the info in case anyone is reallllly good at decrypting it. I am going to be trying speed tests and downloads now.
--
Damn APTIA...


TwiztedZero
Nine Zero Burp Nine Six
Premium
join:2011-03-31
Toronto, ON
kudos:5

1 edit

Now that you're on the 1.0.6.1 NOSH build ... I'd say give it a day or three until the CMTS repushes the config again from the tftp side - I think they do it every few days now. Just look at the Logs page of your unit and you should see something like
DHCP Renew - lease parameters tftp file- ...
This might be daily or every few days sometimes a week apart, I think 7 days was the "normal" range. I'm sure your local node factors in there someplace too.

Also ... check the rg6 is firmly connected on both ends but not too tight, and it might help to have the modem's wallwart actually pluged into a wall socket and not a surge protector or your UPS box - at least for a whiles so you can see if maybe theres a power fluctuation or something affecting the modem. It should balance out eventually I do hope once it stabilizes.

--

!- From the mind located in the shadows of infinity -!
Nine.Zero.Burp.Nine.Six
Twitter = @TwiztedZero
Chat = irc.teksavvy.ca



KPaul

join:2007-02-08
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·Rogers Hi-Speed

So a few days for the speeds, either up or down, to level off? What exactly does that config file do?

Connections are good, plugged in as well as they were before, and didn't think of the power being in the outlet, but, sadly, I can't do that given how few plugs, I have. 1.
--
Damn APTIA...



TwiztedZero
Nine Zero Burp Nine Six
Premium
join:2011-03-31
Toronto, ON
kudos:5

2 edits

said by KPaul:

So a few days for the speeds, either up or down, to level off? What exactly does that config file do?

Not "speeds" but rather "power levels".

I've noticed when I changed from the 28/1 package to the 45/4 one the power levels were basically the same no real difference. And the only actual change seems to be via the config file placed on the modem.

The configuration file is a little piece of data that goes into the modem's flash chip much like the one in a router, that sets your speed & capacity and authentication and whatever else oughta be in there. So the CMTS (Cable Modem Termination System) can talk to your modem and allow data to transmit back and forth basically.
said by KPaul:

Connections are good, plugged in as well as they were before, and didn't think of the power being in the outlet, but, sadly, I can't do that given how few plugs, I have. 1.

Its usually best to have a cable modem pluged into a wall outlet really for optimum even power to the modem. Sometimes on a UPS box the signals might spike at different levels especially if your battery either isn't steady or hasn't been properly exercised to retain its charge reliably. (theres a whole school of thoughts and opinions on this.)

Sometimes your household wall sockets might have older or a different wire feed (circuits) to the outlets (like in some places some outlets are wired to your light switch and others aren't) just a few extra things to keep in mind.

If you only have that one single socket to use maybe trying the upper or lower one can be helpful? I don't really know just guessing here I'm not an electrician. But its worth noting.

If you can use a spare other socket in the room and get better results there that might help even if you'll end up having to re arrange your room & network Ugh I know hard to do sometimes, heck might even require finding a longer RG6 so you can if your cable outlet is too far from a good electric wall socket too. Extension cords are a no no, especially for a modem.

Worst case scenario you move your modem & router to a whole other room with more wall sockets and use the wifi via an wifi adaptor if your laptop or pc doesn't have one inbuilt or buy a secondary router and bridge them and put that in your network room. A cheaper N300 class Access point or router would be ok for this sort of thing. I have a spare WNR2000 set up like this. You can find them at liquidators or places like tigerdirect for $20 or so refurb'd or maybe you allready have one in your closet someplace. Plenty of tutorials on how to bridge two routers to relay/extend your network coverage on the web. Google is your friend.

(Additionally, you could also optionally relocate your modem and router to that other room if its not too far away, and run a longer CaT5e from the router (or modem for direct connect trouble shooting) into your network room. Another consideration. )

Anyways others with more extensive experience might chime in on the thread.

Good Luck mate!
--

!- From the mind located in the shadows of infinity -!
Nine.Zero.Burp.Nine.Six
Twitter = @TwiztedZero
Chat = irc.teksavvy.ca


swintec
Premium,VIP
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VoicePulse
·Sprint Mobile Br..
·RapidVPS
reply to TwiztedZero

said by TwiztedZero:

said by mackey:

The DOCSIS standard expressly prohibits allowing end users to update the firmware. All updates MUST come from the CMTS.

Docsis standards say no such thing. Its the incumbent that own the last mile that insist on this or that modem type and this or that firmware build....

You seem to be addressing two separate issues with this post but..

To download a CM software image securely, the CM vendor and/or MSO will digitally sign the image using the appropriate code verification certificate (CVC) and place the image on a Software Download server. A CM is enabled to download a software image when it receives a valid CVC in its configuration file. Triggering thedownload of the software image can be done using parameters in the CM configuration file, or SNMP commands.

After a CM downloads a software image, it validates theimage by verifying that theincluded CVC chains to the
DOCSIS Root CA, and by checking the image’s digital signature. If this validation is successful, it installs the
software image for operation.


Do you have a spare CMTS, TFTP server, privy to the cable companies CVCs and other network security policies so you could "easily" update your own firmware in your house? it appears that great care has gone into the specs to allow only the cable system / CMTS the ability to upgrade modem firmware.
--
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swintec
Premium,VIP
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VoicePulse
·Sprint Mobile Br..
·RapidVPS
reply to KPaul

With all the new speeds being pushed out, is it possible you need a modem that allows 8 channel bonding versus only 4 that you can get with the 6121?
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TwiztedZero
Nine Zero Burp Nine Six
Premium
join:2011-03-31
Toronto, ON
kudos:5
reply to swintec

Yes the CMTS does it pretty much like you describe.

Though some have managed to flash modems with a compatible firmware build (see other threads regarding this).

At present ATPIA providers don't have a system or method of doing this on their own. And the incumbents have been a little sly with the CRTC and inserted stipulations that they won't push firmware on behalf of their ATPIA clients on purpose as part of their competive advantage strategies. This leaves end users in a no firmware update even on compatible approved modem models with older firmware in particular the Docsis 3.0 units.

This has forced some to seek out 3rd party modem firmware fixes as mentioned above.

Its quite sad it has to be this way. But thats the nature of the beast.

What happens down the road at the next CRTC tariff rounds in the comming months ahead that might or might not change this is anyone's guess.

And Thank You for a little more of a technical overview of the CMTS breakdown swiftec
--

!- From the mind located in the shadows of infinity -!
Nine.Zero.Burp.Nine.Six
Twitter = @TwiztedZero
Chat = irc.teksavvy.ca



TwiztedZero
Nine Zero Burp Nine Six
Premium
join:2011-03-31
Toronto, ON
kudos:5
reply to swintec

said by swintec:

With all the new speeds being pushed out, is it possible you need a modem that allows 8 channel bonding versus only 4 that you can get with the 6121?

•SB6120 - 4x4 channel bonding - 1.0.6.1 - approved - limited up to the 45/4 packages.
•SB6121 - 4x4 channel bonding - 1.0.6.1 - approved - limited up to the 45/4 packages.
•SB6141 - 8x4 channel bonding - 1.0.6.1 - not approved

Approved for use up to 45/4

Approved for use on 150/10
--

!- From the mind located in the shadows of infinity -!
Nine.Zero.Burp.Nine.Six
Twitter = @TwiztedZero
Chat = irc.teksavvy.ca


swintec
Premium,VIP
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VoicePulse
·Sprint Mobile Br..
·RapidVPS

said by TwiztedZero:

•SB6120 - 4x4 channel bonding - 1.0.6.1 - approved - limited up to the 45/4 packages.
•SB6121 - 4x4 channel bonding - 1.0.6.1 - approved - limited up to the 45/4 packages.
•SB6141 - 8x4 channel bonding - 1.0.6.1 - not approved

With such high speeds it seems foolish to not have an 8 channel modem approved....although maybe if the speed issues have to do with this they will quickly certify the 6141?

It really is a no brainer since those three modems use the same exact firmware images which Moto did specifically to make deployment easier on the MSO.
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